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Topaz1128
Guest
How is this song anti-Catholic?
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kage_ar
Guest
Of COURSE Mary knew, she said YES. Read the Magnificat.
Protestants want to paint Mary as a dumb ignorant passive girl, someone who was nothing more than a vessel to hold Jesus for 9 months. This song is written by Protestants from an anti-Mary point of view.
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Cathryn
Guest
We had a beautiful Easter Vigil with all seven of the readings and all the candle lighting and incense. We are a small town parish but had 5 people enter the Church with Baptism. I don’t even know how long the service lasted. Probably about three hours. If any of you had a really great Easter Vigil, I suggest that you let your Pastor know. Priests and Pastors appreciate it when all their planning and hard work is appreciated by their parishoners. They usually just hear about the complaints. This sometimes really can get them down.
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Topaz1128
Guest
OK, OK. Forgive my ignorance.
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MarkThompson
Guest
Don’t worry, some of us didn’t think your view was ignorant at all. I for one don’t think Mary knew all those things: she was “blessed among women,” but neither scripture nor tradition tells us that she was gifted with foreknowledge of the future. Her “yes” was a manifestation of her trust in God; if she had known all the things the song says, her acceptance of God’s will would be a bit more of a no-brainer. It’s like if there were a song saying, “Abraham, did you know that the angel would stay your hand?”, and someone replied, “Of course he knew – read Genesis!” Uh, no; that’s the whole point – trust in and submission to God.
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benedictgal
Guest
The archangel Gabriel already told her that God would be the Father of her Son and that the child would be called the Son of God. Mary and Abraham are different because she was born without the stain of original sin and thus could be much more open to God than Abraham ever could. The song in question is Protestant in nature and has no business being in any kind of Catholic liturgical service because it is not compatible with the Church’s teachings on Mary.
I do not want to derail this thread. The only reason why I mentioned this song was that I believed it was highly inappropriate to have used this song for Good Friday, after the Passion but prior to the homily, as a meditation piece. It did not make for good liturgy, and made a bad experience only worse.
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Topaz1128
Guest
I still think it’s a beautiful song.
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MarkThompson
Guest
I’m sorry the song didn’t work for you; I’ve never heard it in a liturgical setting, so maybe I would find it equally inapt. And I’ll limit myself to this one response, since even though the thread’s pretty much petered out I don’t want to really derail it either. (BTW, I assume we’re talking about the same song, with lyrics about like these.)
Anyway, Luke tells us that Mary “was greatly troubled” at the Gabriel’s greeting, and that Gabriel then explained to her that her son “will be great and will be called Son of the Most High, and the Lord God will give him the throne of David his father, and he will rule over the house of Jacob forever, and of his kingdom there will be no end.” That’s all well and good, but it doesn’t explain why Mary should have known that her “baby boy will save our sons and daughters, . . . will one day walk on water, . . . give sight to a blind man, . . . calm a storm with his hand,” or even “one day rule the nations” as opposed to ruling just the house of Jacob. You can argue that she would have intuited these things, or that they were revealed to her in a way not discussed in Scripture, but that’s a matter of sufficiently deep interpretation that I don’t think the song can be said to be obviously “anti-Catholic.”
I’m not aware of any authoritative Catholic teaching that holds that Mary knew all these things at the moment she gave her assent. Personally, I find it telling that Mary replied, “Behold, I am the handmaid of the Lord. May it be done to me according to your word,” and not, “Ah, I see your point – yes, this all sounds like a good idea.”
In the end, of course, although I think you’ve overstated the case, I fully agree with you that the song is a highly bizarre choice for Good Friday as opposed to, say, Christmas or the Annunciation, and I also agree that there are much better songs, on a variety of levels, that could be chosen on any of those occasions. Regards –
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roadsend
Guest
It seems to me that John 2:1-11 spells out pretty clearly what Mary understood regarding her Son’s capabilities prior to the beginning of his public ministry.
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MarkThompson
Guest
Or Luke 2:41-52.
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benedictgal
Guest
So, Mary did know. Her urging Jesus to assist at the Wedding of Cana should be a strong indication that she knew that her Son was also the Son of God.
Again, I do not want to hijack the thread, but, even questionable music manages to really upset the liturgy, especially during the Triduum. Paraphrases of the official prayers of the Church such as the Exultet and the Gloria are worse. Unfortunately, well-intentioned people planning Triduum seem to think that this most sacred time of the year is ripe for experimentation.
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Jean_Anthony
Guest
Just a reminder, everyone, please stick to the topic. If you wish to respond to an off topic comment, start a new thread in the appropriate forum/search for an existing one on that topic. Thank you all.
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hwriggles4
Guest
I have been to some good Easter Vigils, and then I have been to a few that were disappointing.
Yesterday, I attended a very reverent Good Friday Mass at my parish, which is now a 30 minute drive because I moved last year. Both priests, three deacons. The Passion was read, and the congregation venerated the cross. Not too many people left early either. I will go to Easter Vigil there tonight - I missed it there last year because I was invited to another parish for Easter Vigil.
On the other hand, I recall as a kid going to Easter Vigil where the pastor (now deceased) would purposely skip and admit that he would only do three readings in order to make the Vigil go faster. I also remember music (this was the 1980’s) that was the Marty Haugen “happy clappy mentality” with the choir being more like entertainment. At the end of one reading, the line is “look what had occurred.” The choir gets up, shouting and singing “He is Alive, He is Alive, and he’s show me the way, Alleluia.”
I also remember an Easter Vigil I attended (circa 1997) at my old parish when I lived in another city. During the baptisms, the choir sang “Wade in The Water” for each individual baptism, and clapped. There was also some liturgical dance. That was the last time I attended an Easter Vigil there.
One of the best Easter Vigils I attended was at my current parish. The parish had recently gotten a new head of Adult Faith Formation, and the candidates for confirmation got up and publicly professed in front of the congregation the acceptance of all the church’s teachings. (I wish we would have done that at our confirmation - I had one of those large confirmation classes at the age of 15 where many of us basically went through the motions - several of the high schoolers looked at it as a graduation exercise from religious education).
I like it when people are friendly, but there’s another place for that, like a reception afterwards or a nice hello outside or in the narthex. The sanctuary is not a convention hall.
Happy Easter.
Yesterday, I attended a very reverent Good Friday Mass at my parish, which is now a 30 minute drive because I moved last year. Both priests, three deacons. The Passion was read, and the congregation venerated the cross. Not too many people left early either. I will go to Easter Vigil there tonight - I missed it there last year because I was invited to another parish for Easter Vigil.
On the other hand, I recall as a kid going to Easter Vigil where the pastor (now deceased) would purposely skip and admit that he would only do three readings in order to make the Vigil go faster. I also remember music (this was the 1980’s) that was the Marty Haugen “happy clappy mentality” with the choir being more like entertainment. At the end of one reading, the line is “look what had occurred.” The choir gets up, shouting and singing “He is Alive, He is Alive, and he’s show me the way, Alleluia.”
I also remember an Easter Vigil I attended (circa 1997) at my old parish when I lived in another city. During the baptisms, the choir sang “Wade in The Water” for each individual baptism, and clapped. There was also some liturgical dance. That was the last time I attended an Easter Vigil there.
One of the best Easter Vigils I attended was at my current parish. The parish had recently gotten a new head of Adult Faith Formation, and the candidates for confirmation got up and publicly professed in front of the congregation the acceptance of all the church’s teachings. (I wish we would have done that at our confirmation - I had one of those large confirmation classes at the age of 15 where many of us basically went through the motions - several of the high schoolers looked at it as a graduation exercise from religious education).
I like it when people are friendly, but there’s another place for that, like a reception afterwards or a nice hello outside or in the narthex. The sanctuary is not a convention hall.
Happy Easter.
I clicked on this post and saw something about a disappointing Easter Vigil and I thought, “Where IS this person? Asia? Australia? Is it that late in Europe!?! This person is from Pennsylvania! It’s WAY to early for a Vigil there!”Then I saw that the post was from 2010.
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paperwight66
Guest
Perhaps this was just a slip of your typing finger, but there is NO Mass on Good Friday. Liturgy including Holy Communion, yes, Morning and Evening Prayer as well, but no Mass. It’s the one day of the year when there is no Mass anywhere in the world.
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Monkey1976
Guest
I thought we weren’t supposed to practice necromancy. 
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