"The gates of Hell will not Prevail"

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Melchior

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I have noticed in my interaction with Orthodox and of course Catholics that this verse is often used in a way that puzzles me.
Everytime I hear someone reference the concept it is defensive as if the gates of Hell are attacking the Church and the Church will not be overcome by said gates. But ‘gates’ by there very nature are defensive not offensive. Isn’t the concept that Jesus was conveying to Peter really that the Church is storming Hell and the Church will smash through the gates of Hell?

If the phrase were “The armies of Hell will not prevail” I would understand the common usage. But gates don’t attack, they are attacked.

Any thoughts?

Mel
 
I’ve also seen the translation, “Jaws of hell.” Perhaps that changes the meaning?
 
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ServusChristi:
I’ve also seen the translation, “Jaws of hell.” Perhaps that changes the meaning?
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It certainly does. I am wondering which is the more accurate translation.

Mel
 
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Melchior:
I have noticed in my interaction with Orthodox and of course Catholics that this verse is often used in a way that puzzles me.
Everytime I hear someone reference the concept it is defensive as if the gates of Hell are attacking the Church and the Church will not be overcome by said gates. Any thoughts?
Mel
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It means the Church can keep someone from going to hell absolutely, AND nothing, EVEN in hell, can overcome the Church, that Jesus builds on Peter… It’s both a positive and a negative protection.
 
It certainly does. I am wondering which is the more accurate translation.
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Apparently it is “gates”:
bible.crosswalk.com/Lexicons/Greek/grk.cgi?number=4439&version=kjv

Also, from some of the commentaries from that website:
Its gate symbolized its power because the military forces of an ancient city always sallied forth from its gates.
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The gates of hell - As gates and walls were the strength of cities, and as courts of judicature were held in their gates, this phrase properly signifies the power and policy of Satan and his instruments.
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…So ‘gates’ are not necessarily deemed defensive.
 
It also shows the power of true repentance to save a sinner from eternal damnation.
 
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Melchior:
I have noticed in my interaction with Orthodox and of course Catholics that this verse is often used in a way that puzzles me.
Everytime I hear someone reference the concept it is defensive as if the gates of Hell are attacking the Church and the Church will not be overcome by said gates. But ‘gates’ by there very nature are defensive not offensive. Isn’t the concept that Jesus was conveying to Peter really that the Church is storming Hell and the Church will smash through the gates of Hell?

If the phrase were “The armies of Hell will not prevail” I would understand the common usage. But gates don’t attack, they are attacked.

Any thoughts?

Mel
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I guess you could pick any intrepretation you wish… it is pretty clear the meaning to the verse for most… but don’t ever think Satan isn’t constantly in the offensive mode… defense is his last concern… his motivation is to harvest as much of the body of Christ that he can… and if Christ is the Head of the church, and we are his body, then i feel most would assume said harvest was aimed strictly at his church… you and me… so we can play semantics with “gates of hell” all you want, but i do feel the message is clear, and i can’t see the benefit of trying to muddy up the message with different intrepretations… so be it gates, jaws, or tweezers… belzubub, satan, prince of darkness, devil, or the big bad boogie man is out to get you… the good news is… be not afraid… THE GATES OF HELL WILL NOT PREVAIL… but it didn’t say they wouldn’t try… be kind, beware, be insured… sorry about the last one… nature of the job… 👍
 
From my limited understanding, didn’t Pharisee’s or evil people in general (at the time of Christ) supposedly do alot of scheming and plotting outside the gates of different establishments, I heard an apologist speak on this once but it is really fuzzy in my mind, but the concept is this…Satan, the devils and their followers can do all the plotting and scheming they want (at the gates of hell) but they will not prevail in destroying the Church.
 
And the gates of hell, etc. Ancient cities were surrounded by walls. In the gates, by which they were entered, were the principal places for holding courts, transacting business, and deliberating on public matters. See Barnes “Mat 7:13”. The word gates, therefore, is used for counsels, designs, machinations, evil purposes. Hell means, here, the place of departed spirits, particularly evil spirits. And the meaning of the passage is, that all the plots, stratagems, and machinations, of the enemies of the church, should not be able to overcome it–a promise that has been remarkably fulfilled.
—Barnes’ Notes on the New Testament

Here is another take on what this means.
 
Interesting! I had to read that six times!

The gates, in my imagination, would open as Pandora’s box might have, releasing everything within. In other words, Hell’s fury will not prevail against the Church.

It was easy to conjure a picture of St. Michael leading a charge through Hell’s gates, but I don’t find that picture really consistent with the Beatitudes, for example. I can see the Church fighting and winning, but not really attacking. I realize that righteous anger might be aggressive, as Christ was in clearing the temple. You know, this could go on and on. . . Are we called to resist temptation or attack who or what tempts us? Both, perhaps? In the end, doesn’t sin start with our own selves, our human nature? Would we have to attack ourselves?

I now conclude that the Church, with Christ as our head, will save us from ourselves. Isn’t that what Christ was saying?

Thank you all for bearing with me through that thought process. Comments? Obviously, I could have used some jumping in during that. . .

Thank you, Melchior, for an interesting thread.

God bless.
 
In my mind, I keep seeing the image of the church standing against all attacks. The church will not fall under the attacks of the devil and his cohorts. Satan will do his best to knock us (the church) down. But he will not prevail.
 
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Melchior:
If the phrase were “The armies of Hell will not prevail” I would understand the common usage. But gates don’t attack, they are attacked.
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In the Revised Standard Version (Catholic Edition) of the Bible, this phrase, from Matthew 16:18, is translated as “powers of death.”

The Ignatius Study Bible states that the literal translation is indeed “gates of Hades.” Hades is the temporary place of the dead, and, also, “the habitation of evil forces that bring about death and deception.” The Jewish Temple’s foundation stone was believed to be the seal between heaven and Hades.

The implication is that if the “gates of Hell” were removed, the powers of death and deception would be loosed into the world. But aren’t they already?

I guess this means that even though the gates have been opened and the powers of death and deception are loose in the world, they will not prevail in the end.

But we can count on having a lot of problems until that time.
 
18 et ego dico tibi quia tu es Petrus et super hanc petram aedificabo ecclesiam meam et portae inferi non praevalebunt adversum eam

18 And I say to thee: That thou art Peter; and upon this rock I will build my church, and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.

18 “The gates of hell”… That is, the powers of darkness, and whatever Satan can do, either by himself, or his agents. For as the church is here likened to a house, or fortress, built on a rock; so the adverse powers are likened to a contrary house or fortress, the gates of which, that is, the whole strength, and all the efforts it can make, will never be able to prevail over the city or church of Christ. By this promise we are fully assured, that neither idolatry, heresy, nor any pernicious error whatsoever shall at any time prevail over the church of Christ.

drbo.org/

Latin Vulgate and Douay-Rheims is the authoritive source for Catholics. I would be suspicious of the translation from the KJV linked here:
bible.crosswalk.com/Lexicons…439&version=kjv
 
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