The Influence of the Spanish Mystics On The Works Of St. Francis De Sales

[Abba]

Has anyone read ever read: The Influence of the Spanish Mystics On The Works Of St. Francis De Sales by Rivet. I ordered it and my copy just arrived. it looks delicious. Yum, yum.

 

[utunumsint]

I haven’t been able to find any description of the book online, but it sounds interesting. Surely he was influenced by Saints John of the Cross and Theresa of Avila. There are at least 30 and 40 years between him and them. Interestingly, Saint Thesesa was canonized in the same same year Saint Francis de Sales died (1622).

What I find interesting is how completely Thomistic is Saint John of the Cross. He gives theological and philosophical rigor to mysticism in a way no one has equaled since. Reading Saint John with a proper Thomistic background is so much fun!

God bless,
Ut

 

[Abba]

I haven’t been able to find any description of the book online, but it sounds interesting. Surely he was influenced by Saints John of the Cross and Theresa of Avila. There are at least 30 and 40 years between him and them. Interestingly, Saint Thesesa was canonized in the same same year Saint Francis de Sales died (1622).

Hello there,

Actually Saint John of the Cross does not seem to have had much influence on Saint Francis de Sales - if he had any at all. I cannot find where I read this (when I do I will provide the quote here if not too much time has passed) but the case seems to be that Saint John of the Cross’s writings were not made public until 30 years after Saint Francis de Sales passed away. So, scholars understand that Saint Francis de Sales was not influenced by Saint John of the Cross.

That said, the Baroness Chantal was familiar with some of the heads of convents etc… in Spain and her connection seems to be the connection Saint Francis de Sales got to the works of Saint Theresa - which greatly influenced his writings.

Actually. as I search deeper into Saint Francis de Sales spirituality I arrive not only to the Spanish mystics as his root and foundation, but even for the primary spiritual principle which he promotes - all can reach holiness. This ideology is very Spanish Mystic, it was the Spanish Mystics who wrote about mysticism for the general public with the understanding that only a few can obtain it’s highest level but all are welcome and are capable - and so they wrote to provide the ‘handbook’ sort of speak.

It’s all very interesting.

What I find interesting is how completely Thomistic is Saint John of the Cross. He gives theological and philosophical rigor to mysticism in a way no one has equaled since. Reading Saint John with a proper Thomistic background is so much fun!

God bless,
Ut

Interesting.

 

[DBT]

Hello there,

Actually Saint John of the Cross does not seem to have had much influence on Saint Francis de Sales - if he had any at all. I cannot find where I read this (when I do I will provide the quote here if not too much time has passed) but the case seems to be that Saint John of the Cross’s writings were not made public until 30 years after Saint Francis de Sales passed away. So, scholars understand that Saint Francis de Sales was not influenced with Saint John of the Cross.

That said, the Baroness Chantal was familiar with some of the heads of convents etc… in Spain and her connection seems to be the connection Saint Francis de Sales got to the works of Saint Theresa - which greatly influenced his writings.

Actually. as I search deeper into Saint Francis de Sales spirituality I arrive not only to the Spanish mystics as his root and foundation, but even for the primary spiritual principle which he promotes - all can reach holiness. This ideology is very Spanish Mystic, it was the Spanish Mystics who wrote about mysticism for the general public with the understanding that only a few can obtain it’s highest level but all are welcome and are capable - and so they wrote to provide the ‘handbook’ sort of speak.

It’s all very interesting.

Interesting.

As a Carmelite, it is an interesting question you ask in this thread. I just briefly scanned through the notes section of my version of Introduction to the Devout Life (Image Books) and I see numerous quotes referenced to the Spanish writers of the 1500’s. You’re right, though, so far I see nothing associated to St. John of the Cross.

However, section 4 of Part I speaks of St. Teresa at some length … calling her the “devout Avila” and “Blessed Mother Teresa.” Perhaps there’s more … I’ll have to look. Additionally, it is quite possible some of the quoted Spanish writers were the “learned men” St. Teresa often described. If time permits, I’ll cross reference the names listed to those identified in other works as her confessors/directors.

Thanks for your thread!
Dave

 

[Abba]

She wrote about my family - a couple of lines. She noted how not all had truly converted. Well, from my line they really did until this day.

You would think … she did not have a drop of Jewish blood … but, she did. Saint Theresa of Avila was of Jewish descent.