The Modesty Question

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ThePuzzledCatholic

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Hey guys,

I just read an article about the Marylike Standards of Modesty and I’m a little worried. I thought myself to be a modest person, but after reading that, I feel like one of the most immodest people in the world. The Standards called for ankle-length skirts, High necklines no more than 2 fingers down from the throat, sleeves to the wrist or at least the elbow, and no form fitting attire. It also talked about how leggings (which I practically live in for work) and jeans were inappropriate.
I frequently wear skinny jeans with a T-shirt or tank top, or a skirt with a tucked in T-shirt, and the skirt is mid calf.
I don’t want to be immodest, but I also don’t want to dress like a sister. I live in the world and I like to express myself (hence the T-shirts), so I guess I’m looking for someone more well-versed in moral theology than I to weigh in on this topic.
Also, the page I read these Standards on is:
http://www.salvemariaregina.info/Modesty.html
 
I am not super familiar with dressing “Marylike.” Honestly this is the first time I’ve even heard of this term. I did do a little quick research on this though. This seems to be a standard of dress for women set by the Cardinal Vicar of Pope Pius XI. Pope Pius XI was Pope from February 1922 until 1939. By the dates of this popes reign alone, tells me that this is an old practice. Throughout history woman’s dress has changed. Some may say drastically changed. However my understanding of history, this type of dress would have been common and expected of woman during that era. Whereas now, we are living in the 21st century and woman’s dress has changed, and therefore I believe we have modernized our view of modesty.
 
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catholicgirl2012 said:
I did do a little quick research on this though. This seems to be a standard of dress for women set by the Cardinal Vicar of Pope Pius XI. Pope Pius XI was Pope from February 1922 until 1939.
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And even then, these guidelines would have been challenging to meet. Here is an example of everyday women’s fashion in the 1920s:

(Please Note: This uploaded content is no longer available.)

OP, dress in a way that is appropriate for the situation you find yourself in (let prudence be your guide), and you will usually be just fine.
 
Three good answers.
Can anything constructive be added?
Magic 8 Ball says, “Don’t count on it.”
 
ThePuzzledCatholic said:
I just read an article about the Marylike Standards of Modesty and I’m a little worried.
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Just stop right there, because the Church does not teach anything about “Mary-like standards of modesty”. So this is someone’s opinion. And nothing to be “worried” about.
ThePuzzledCatholic said:
The Standards called for ankle-length skirts, High necklines no more than 2 fingers down from the throat, sleeves to the wrist or at least the elbow, and no form fitting attire. It also talked about how leggings (which I practically live in for work) and jeans were inappropriate.
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Feel free to ignore this. it’s a very skewed view of the world, and it’s is OPINION.

Please read the Catechism on the virtue of modesty and purity. Let that be your guide. Not some whack-a-doodle article on a website.
 
ThePuzzledCatholic said:
Hey guys,

I just read an article about the Marylike Standards of Modesty and I’m a little worried. I thought myself to be a modest person, but after reading that, I feel like one of the most immodest people in the world. The Standards called for ankle-length skirts, High necklines no more than 2 fingers down from the throat, sleeves to the wrist or at least the elbow, and no form fitting attire. It also talked about how leggings (which I practically live in for work) and jeans were inappropriate.
I frequently wear skinny jeans with a T-shirt or tank top, or a skirt with a tucked in T-shirt, and the skirt is mid calf.
I don’t want to be immodest, but I also don’t want to dress like a sister. I live in the world and I like to express myself (hence the T-shirts), so I guess I’m looking for someone more well-versed in moral theology than I to weigh in on this topic.
Also, the page I read these Standards on is:
The Marylike Standards of Modesty
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Your description of your dressing style fits any sensible description of modesty.

That’s just someone’s opinion. There is no need for you to look like a Mennonite or Puritan.

What concerns me more is why this site is “worrying” you.
 
Exactly!

When in doubt I usually refer back to my Catholic School days and follow the handbook guidelines for appropriate dress.

i.e. No exposed midriffs; No exposed cleavage; Straps such as those found on tank tops, muscle shirts, halter tops, tube tops and/or spaghetti strap tops are not permitted; clothing must conceal undergarments; pants must be worn at the waist and completely cover the buttocks area; the bottom hem or edge of shorts, skirts and dresses may be no shorter than three inches above the top of the knee when standing.
 
Those 1920s ladies are NOT appropriately dressed by the standards of first century Palestine. Its “Mary” standards for fashion, yet they’re choosing the arbitrary standards of the early 20th century rather than the first century?
Wear are the head coverings? And way too much skin shown near the foot area…
 
ThePuzzledCatholic said:
Hey guys,

I just read an article about the Marylike Standards of Modesty and I’m a little worried. I thought myself to be a modest person, but after reading that, I feel like one of the most immodest people in the world. The Standards called for ankle-length skirts, High necklines no more than 2 fingers down from the throat, sleeves to the wrist or at least the elbow, and no form fitting attire. It also talked about how leggings (which I practically live in for work) and jeans were inappropriate.
I frequently wear skinny jeans with a T-shirt or tank top, or a skirt with a tucked in T-shirt, and the skirt is mid calf.
I don’t want to be immodest, but I also don’t want to dress like a sister. I live in the world and I like to express myself (hence the T-shirts), so I guess I’m looking for someone more well-versed in moral theology than I to weigh in on this topic.
Also, the page I read these Standards on is:
The Marylike Standards of Modesty
Click to expand...
These are older standards.

However, I will offer my advice as a man.

You should refrain from wearing leggins as pants. Leggins were originally designed to be worn under pants, dress, and/or shorts. They were not originally designed to be worn as pants.

They leave very little to the imagination and it is very difficult for most men to refrain from glancing when a girl or woman is wearing leggings with no shorts/dress/pants over them. NOTE: wearing a sweater that covers the behind isn’t the same as wearing shorts/dress/pants.

I know most women will think I’m insane by saying this, but I know the vast majority of men feel the same temptations when a girl/woman wears leggins with nothing over them.

God Bless
 
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Reading the description you gave, I immediately pictured a woman who is FLDS. Other than that, an Amish or Mennonite woman, I can’t imagine anyone else dressing to those standards. Even Catholic sisters don’t dress that modest (although some nuns in full habits do).
 
Even the Nashville Dominicans fail to meet this mark (too much neck, apparently). This ought to give one some idea as to how restrictive this article is.

(Please Note: This uploaded content is no longer available.)

Unless the article means 2 fingers down from the base of the neck. In that case, the Nashville Dominican just make it.
 
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catholicgirl2012 said:
This seems to be a standard of dress for women set by the Cardinal Vicar of Pope Pius XI. Pope Pius XI was Pope from February 1922 until 1939.
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This has been discussed many times before on this site. Going through the archives via the search function I found at least one person questioning whether the ‘Cardinal Vicar of Pope Pius XI’ ever said this. It would be nice if someone could produce proof.

Edited to add: there are a few places on this forum where this was claimed to be said by the Cardinal Vicar of Pius XII in 1956. It’s like a game of Catholic Telephone. Which Cardinal Vicar said it, and when, if either of them said it at all?
 
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Doing a general search on the Internet doesn’t clear it up either. Some sources say Pius XI (11), others say Pius XII (12).
 
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LumineDiei said:
nothing that is form-fitting (this would include pants, as they do tend to show off the male physique and women’s eyes are naturally drawn to certain areas that a Catholic gentleman would not want any woman looking at)
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In my case, I don’t know that the fabric has been invented yet that is strong enough to hold back the unstoppable tide of my belly. Chain mail, perhaps. But even that’s touch and go.
 
mrsdizzyd said:
Unless the article means 2 fingers down from the base of the neck. In that case, the Nashville Dominican just make it.
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To be fair, that is not 2 fingers down from the collar bone. It is above the collar bone.
 
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