The New Theology of the Body

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Qoeleth said:
Hmm… No, I suppose one would not refuse such medicine.
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Since you have been kind enough to answer my question, I shall answer yours. Why would you not refuse? It is because your reasoning tells you that the medicine is good. Adam and Eve were created by God with perfect bodies. Your body and my body came from our parents. God created our rational soul. Therefore, your theory of a “new theology of the body” would only apply to Adam and Eve who did not commit a bodily sin but a spiritual one (pride) which ended up harming the body.
 
Now before criticizing Plato or Augustine, I’d like to ask one thing: How much of Plato or Augustine have you actually read, which part do you disagree with, and why do you think they are wrong? For example, if you asked me that question about Plato, I would say that I’ve read about 15 of his dialogues. I disagree with his theory of reincarnation because it is against the Catholic faith.
 
Aquinas_Jr said:
Now before criticizing Plato or Augustine, I’d like to ask one thing: How much of Plato or Augustine have you actually read, which part do you disagree with, and why do you think they are wrong? For example, if you asked me that question about Plato, I would say that I’ve read about 15 of his dialogues. I disagree with his theory of reincarnation because it is against the Catholic faith.
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To be honest I can’t really remember what I’ve read. But I notice that all the up-to-date theologians criticize the influence of Plato on Christian thought. For example, in another thread going on about the traditional metaphor of the body as a prison for the soul, many people are suggesting that this is Platonic, rather than Christian.

So, are you saying that the Platonic doctrines of the immortality of the soul, the superiority of the spiritual and the eternal over the material and the temporal, have a valid place in Christian thought? Isn’t the Platonic idea of God as an Absolute Good totally different to the Christian idea? And are you saying that the Augustinian doctrines of the brokenness of the human and of Creation in general, due to sin, actually have some truth?

As it seems the new theology is that Christianity is all about affirming the goodness of the material and temporal world and the body, doesn’t it follow that we should enjoy all the sensual pleasures to the full?

Don’t we become Gnostics is we don’t love this world and everything that is in the world? Didn’t Jesus come to teach us to enjoy our material life to the full?
 
You are falling into the materialist trap. Materialism asserts that matter is the fundamental constituent of reality. This view is not reconcilable with the idea of a soul or a mind. Now, the problem with dualism is that one cannot possibly demonstrate that non-physical can effect physical in any quantifiable way. So, some form of monism necessarily entails: Either materialism or idealism.

Now, you may notice that the only way in which you can understand the world is that first you perceive something outside of yourself and then you form ideas about what you perceive (to conceive). The question then follows: How can I possibly prove that matter exists fundamentally (without me perceiving it)? How can I separate the rational/mental nature of the world from the world itself and thus posit the existence of matter?

One cannot: Matter is an unprovable assertion. And yet, there is an objectivity to this world. This objectivity poses a problem to solipsism (How can I know anything exists other than my own mind?) and so one can rationally conclude that there is a mind greater than my own which provides objectivity to my experience of the world. In noticing the continuity of the world and its unified laws of physics, etc. one must conclude that this greater mind is single and one (As Augustine points out). This greater mind is a necessary being: God.

If you insist that matter exists outside of being an emergent property of the fundamental information of the universe, then you would be wrong in light of the latest theorizing in Quantum Gravity. If you think that idealistic notions are specifically Greek, then you have not read Jewish philosophy (Maimonides, the Zohar, etc.). As a note, the Bible is not philosophy, it is revelation; so you should not propose a false dichotomy. I believe Aquinas explains the relationship between philosophy and scripture quite aptly, if you are interested. Cheers.

(A video from a brilliant young apologist):

youtube.com/watch?v=4NP4QmrbBww
 
A word about asceticism. IMNAAHO.

Often, religious types will speak of ascetic practices as “disciplining the body.” This is not really what they are about.

Bodies do not need to be disciplined per se, as except for purely natural functions such as breathing, our body acts only by command of the soul (specifically mind/will).

Therefore it is the mind and will that must be trained or disciplined, and we do it via the body, because all human experience or action takes place at the level of our bodies.

That is why, for example, dieting is not fasting. Dieting is about the body; fasting is about the will.

One may diet, take medications, train physically etc. for the benefit of his or her body; one does not take part in asceticism for this reason, as when carried to an extreme, asceticism can actually cause bodily harm. But because it strengthens the soul (pArticularly the will), saints have carried it on anyway.

ICXC NIKA.
 
tstrong728 said:
AIDS is an aphrodisiac for most Homosexuals so they actually experience a heightened state of arousal. Arousal has a significant mental component, so as weird as it sounds hurting people want to hurt more…it’s part of their brokenness.
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looooool what? xD
GEddie said:
The problem with bodily excess often does not lie in the body. Rather, it comes from attributing to a bodily need, cravings that originate in the psyche. Examples being drunkenness (“to feel good”); “comfort eating”, or recreational sex. The body is not the driver for these behaviors; the soul is, which is why they lead or can lead to sin.
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Perhaps the OP’s ideal religion is Buddhism, in which living in a material world should not and cannot be avoided, which is why we have “the middle path”, in which moderation, not addiction, is key. Not that I’m specifically trying to lead him away from Christanity in saying so.

(That, or Raelism, but Raelism is ridiculous)
 
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