The paradox of the parable of the lost sheep

[Neoplatonist]

In Matthew and in Luke, Christ tells us that the shepherd will leave the 99 sheep to go in search of the 1 lost one.

Now, why would it not be true that the more lost and confused that sheep is, the more it needs the shepherd to come and rescue it?

If I expect God to come and rescue me, I am wrong, therefore my thinking is confused, and part of why I am lost.

If I think I have done all that God asks of me so that I would be able to see Him and follow Him, but do not see Him, I am wrong, therefore my thinking is confused, and part of why I am lost.

If I am sad that I feel lost and confused, or that I do not see God, even if He is all around me, then I am wrong, and my thinking is confused, and part of why I am lost.

If it is my fault and not His that I am lost, fine; I AM STILL LOST.

If He comes to rescue me, but my mind is confused or filled with error so I do not see him, I AM STILL LOST.

If He calls me and I run the wrong way either from stubbornness or stupidity or anger, I AM STILL LOST.

Is He not able to reach through the cloud of my stubbornness or ignorance or confusion to teach my ignorance or calm my fear or quench my anger or whatever? Is He not able to knock me off my horse with a flash of light and speak to me?

Surely believers must believe that IF my mind were seeing truth clearly, then of course I would turn to Him. So, if He reaches out to me and I turn away, it must be that I do not see clearly, right?

If this reading of the parable is wrong, then I my thinking is confused, and part of why I am lost.

If He is the shepherd, then why am I still lost?

 

[Origen52]

I think the point is that the shepherd never gives up. I’m not a shepherd, I work with rehabilitating stray and abused cats. At first they always hide. Some for days, some for weeks. It sometimes takes months to get them to trust again. It is hours of sitting quietly and gently speaking to them. Hours of patience, slow movements and gentle touch. If I, and many others can spend all this time and energy to teach cats to trust again, how much is God willing to do to bring us to him?

 

[Petaro]

I think the point is that the shepherd never gives up. I’m not a shepherd, I work with rehabilitating stray and abused cats. At first they always hide. Some for days, some for weeks. It sometimes takes months to get them to trust again. It is hours of sitting quietly and gently speaking to them. Hours of patience, slow movements and gentle touch. If I, and many others can spend all this time and energy to teach cats to trust again, how much is God willing to do to bring us to him?

A lovely analogy from a lovely mind. I am sure God must at times, feel as if he is herding cats.
The OP shows in their plaintive call the knowledge all of us need to be found. He firstly knows God is searching. That, to all of us, is a relief to start with. That he knows our sad habits of retreat from the tireless tread of His footsteps always faithful is also a relief to us arrogant, selfish souls. I would suggest the OP read that beautiful poem The Hound of Heaven by Francis Thompson.
We must revel in the promises of Christ. I for one, will be the fat one up the tree waving madly as He passes.

 

[Neoplatonist]

A lovely analogy from a lovely mind. I am sure God must at times, feel as if he is herding cats.
The OP shows in their plaintive call the knowledge all of us need to be found. He firstly knows God is searching. That, to all of us, is a relief to start with. That he knows our sad habits of retreat from the tireless tread of His footsteps always faithful is also a relief to us arrogant, selfish souls. I would suggest the OP read that beautiful poem The Hound of Heaven by Francis Thompson.
We must revel in the promises of Christ. I for one, will be the fat one up the tree waving madly as He passes.

Aye an interesting piece, but surely a hound infinitely beyond the hare would not take so long in the hunt. And surely a hare turning around in circles looking for the hound would shorten the chase still more.

Don’t want it to detract from the main point, but I have to admit, this part sounds a little problematic:

“How little worthy of any love thou art!
Whom wilt thou find to love ignoble thee,
Save Me, save only Me?
All which I took from thee I did but take,
Not for thy harms,
But just that thou might’st seek it in My arms.”

Not usually the kind of language we hear from parents or spouses in healthy relationships.

 

[Kurisu35712]

A lovely analogy from a lovely mind. I am sure God must at times, feel as if he is herding cats.
The OP shows in their plaintive call the knowledge all of us need to be found. He firstly knows God is searching. That, to all of us, is a relief to start with. That he knows our sad habits of retreat from the tireless tread of His footsteps always faithful is also a relief to us arrogant, selfish souls. I would suggest the OP read that beautiful poem The Hound of Heaven by Francis Thompson.
We must revel in the promises of Christ. I for one, will be the fat one up the tree waving madly as He passes.

That was a very good read. Kind of dense, but I got the bulk of it.

Neoplatonist, this may be a long shot, and by all means feel free to ignore it. But perhaps you are in a way being called to be there for someone who really needs you. Who needs something only you can provide, even if that’s just someone to listen to their problems. My best friend is going through something right now. I’m not sure what it is, and he doesn’t seem to be willing to talk to anyone, even his girlfriend if I understood her correctly. But I desperately wish he would talk to someone, even if that isn’t me. I get the feeling that he feels alone or somehow as though he can’t find external help with whatever he happens to be dealing with right now. I just wonder if your feelings of isolation from God are a way for Him to show you that someone you care about is feeling the same way, and wants someone to reach out to them?

I may well be projecting all of this onto you, but I figured I should say it, since the idea came to mind going over your other posts. Alternately, perhaps God simply wants you to search for Him even more. To push yourself and your patience and your faith further than you thought it could go. Mind, I’m not saying that you aren’t trying hard enough or that you’re doing anything wrong. You seem to be searching so earnestly for a response from Him. He’s listening, even if you aren’t aware of it, and He loves you unconditionally and infinitely. Don’t give up searching, even though it gets exhausting not knowing if you’re even on the right track. Feel free to PM me if you ever need to talk.

 

[Neoplatonist]

That was a very good read. Kind of dense, but I got the bulk of it.

Neoplatonist, this may be a long shot, and by all means feel free to ignore it. But perhaps you are in a way being called to be there for someone who really needs you. Who needs something only you can provide, even if that’s just someone to listen to their problems. My best friend is going through something right now. I’m not sure what it is, and he doesn’t seem to be willing to talk to anyone, even his girlfriend if I understood her correctly. But I desperately wish he would talk to someone, even if that isn’t me. I get the feeling that he feels alone or somehow as though he can’t find external help with whatever he happens to be dealing with right now. I just wonder if your feelings of isolation from God are a way for Him to show you that someone you care about is feeling the same way, and wants someone to reach out to them?

I may well be projecting all of this onto you, but I figured I should say it, since the idea came to mind going over your other posts. Alternately, perhaps God simply wants you to search for Him even more. To push yourself and your patience and your faith further than you thought it could go. Mind, I’m not saying that you aren’t trying hard enough or that you’re doing anything wrong. You seem to be searching so earnestly for a response from Him. He’s listening, even if you aren’t aware of it, and He loves you unconditionally and infinitely. Don’t give up searching, even though it gets exhausting not knowing if you’re even on the right track. Feel free to PM me if you ever need to talk.

Interesting idea, K. I feel like I’ve got the hang of this part, so I hope He gets around to “and here’s how awesome it feels to know you’ve been heard” soon. I may be able to help you help your friend, so I’ll PM you.

 

[Charlemagne_III]

If He is the shepherd, then why am I still lost?

Is it not possible that you are still lost because you do not want to be found?

As Chesterton put it, the atheist looks for God as the thief looks for a policeman.

 

[Winterwolf00]

Is it not possible that you are still lost because you do not want to be found?

As Chesterton put it, the atheist looks for God as the thief looks for a policeman.

An amusing if inaccurate analogy.
A more accurate one would perhaps be:
“the atheist looks for God as the skeptic looks for ghosts”

 

[Neoplatonist]

Is it not possible that you are still lost because you do not want to be found?

As Chesterton put it, the atheist looks for God as the thief looks for a policeman.

I think I covered that possibility in my OP. I sincerely believe myself to be looking and listening, so if I am, in fact, not doing those things, I am deceived, therefore lost.

Not sure how my sense of frustration over the desire to find God gets translated to being an atheist. Attributing invisible motives to me will spiral into absurdity as fast as attributing invisible actions to the shepherd.

 

[Charlemagne_III]

I think I covered that possibility in my OP. I sincerely believe myself to be looking and listening, so if I am, in fact, not doing those things, I am deceived, therefore lost.

Not sure how my sense of frustration over the desire to find God gets translated to being an atheist. Attributing invisible motives to me will spiral into absurdity as fast as attributing invisible actions to the shepherd.

The parable of the Prodigal Son is relevant here.

The Prodigal Son was atheist in that he did not recognize the authority and wisdom of his Father. He went his own way. He worshiped Bacchus. In doing so he got lost. He did not return home until he wanted to return home after being lost so long. The point is that you have to want to return home to stop being lost.

That is the condition I was in. I eventually realized that not being in the presence of my Father made me feel lost. It was evident that I would not stop feeling lost until I returned home. But even after returning home I felt lost, but not so lost as I had been. We are all lost in this life, and looking to find our way to an eternal home that is waiting for us to return, and that home is in the bosom of Jesus Christ.

Perhaps that is why you and I still feel lost?

 

[Neoplatonist]

The parable of the Prodigal Son is relevant here.

The Prodigal Son was atheist in that he did not recognize the authority and wisdom of his Father. He went his own way. He worshiped Bacchus. In doing so he got lost. He did not return home until he wanted to return home after being lost so long. The point is that you have to want to return home to stop being lost.

That is the condition I was in. I eventually realized that not being in the presence of my Father made me feel lost. It was evident that I would not stop feeling lost until I returned home. But even after returning home I felt lost, but not so lost as I had been. We are all lost in this life, and looking to find our way to an eternal home that is waiting for us to return, and that home is in the bosom of Jesus Christ.

Perhaps that is why you and I still feel lost?

Except that to the best of my knowledge, I never ran off.

 

[Charlemagne_III]

Except that to the best of my knowledge, I never ran off.

Every time we sin we run off.

 

[Neoplatonist]

Every time we sin we run off.

This bleeds over to a a couple of different threads, but it begs the question, because I have to consider the parallel case: Do we speed when we honestly believe a cop is watching?

This highlights the circularity, because while there is the story of the prodigal son, the vast majority of children who truly feel loved DO NOT run off seeking love somewhere else. If, in fact, the vast majority of children in a given family feel so unloved that they must go seek love and fulfillment elsewhere, there is something more going wrong.

If, in fact, almost all of the sheep constantly wander off lost, then, again, there are more problems at work than just the stupidity and stubbornness of sheep.

If I see the good, I would desire the good, that’s what the identity between THE GOOD and THE BEAUTIFUL means. If most of us continue to choose the less good and the less beautiful, then are we not lost (in ignorance or confusion) even before we wander off and get lost by sinning?