The role of mother and father

[Atreyu]

Hi everyone. It’s been a while since I posted here, but I’ve been trying to stay away so I can get some work done. But I have a theological issue that I need some advice on, and there’s no better place to go.

One of my female friends - who is married with one young child and another one on the way - has been trying to get pre-selected in the upcoming federal Australian elections. If she had have been elected, this would have meant that her husband most likely would have had to resign his career to spend some more time looking after the children. Because of this, some of our more traditional-minded friends were up in arms about a perceived role-reversal. So much so, that there were several discussions and arguments on the matter.

My opinion is that a young Catholic mother would be an invaluable addition to Australian politics. I know that it would have been a really hard thing for her family to commit to - and it would mean many sacrifices on her part as well as her husband’s - but I know they were aware of these sacrifices and the husband was completely supportive of them.

I’m also happy for my traditional friends to have the opinion that I am wrong, and that it is more proper for the “man of the house” to be the bread-winner, with the female playing a secondary role in terms of jobs/careers, so that she can concentrate on her role as a mother.

But what I am not happy for, is for my traditional friends to claim that their view is not just an opinion, and is actually Church doctrine. One (at least) of my friends does indeed claim this, and so this is why I am here.

Now I am aware of Paul’s teaching on the matter and I’m completely happy with the fact that the man should be the head of the woman, and all that jazz. I just don’t see how that corresponds to the woman being unable to be the major bread-winner.

Do people here think this is actually a matter of doctrine? If so, can you prove it? If not, can you give me some advice as to how I can explain this to my friends?

Thanks in advance for your help!

 

[PAJAKI]

I don’t think there is much doctrine about it.
If her husband is supportive of her commitment she has every right to go and try being elected.
I’m a husband and a father and I used to be in our parish’s pastorale counsel. Now my wife got elected and I’m happy to stay at home at look after our baby when she has to attend the meetings since I’m sure she does a much better job that I could do.

 

[Atreyu]

Thanks for your reply. That’s pretty much exactly what I said…

 

[Em_in_FL]

A few good quotes to share…

From JPII’s “ON THE DIGNITY AND VOCATION OF WOMEN”

Therefore the Church gives thanks for each and every woman: for mothers, for sisters, for wives; for women consecrated to God in virginity; for women dedicated to the many human beings who await the gratuitous love of another person; for women who watch over the human persons in the family, which is the fundamental sign of the human community; for women who work professionally, and who at times are burdened by a great social responsibility; for “perfect” women and for “weak” women—for all women as they have come forth from the heart of God in all the beauty and richness of their femininity; as they have been embraced by his eternal love; as, together with men, they are pilgrims on this earth, which is the temporal “homeland” of all people and is transformed sometimes into a “valley of tears”; as they assume, together with men, a common responsibility for the destiny of humanity according to daily necessities and according to that definitive destiny which the human family has in God himself, in the bosom of the ineffable Trinity.

From LETTER OF POPE JOHN PAUL II - “TO WOMEN”

Thank you, women who work! You are present and active in every area of life-social, economic, cultural, artistic and political. In this way you make an indispensable contribution to the growth of a culture which unites reason and feeling, to a model of life ever open to the sense of “mystery”, to the establishment of economic and political structures ever more worthy of humanity.

 

[Cari]

If the husband agrees and is supportive, why would people think they have the right to tell him he’s wrong? He’s head of the Domestic Church, he gets ultimate say, I would think the more Traditional one is, the more they’d HAVE to respect his decision as head of the house. Particularly since there aren’t any Church teachings which this couple is violating.

Personally (which is an entirely different matter, and this is strictly my opinion), I feel that a woman, if financial circumstances allow, should stay home with her children. If a woman is called to the vocation of motherhood, that should be her primary concern. At least until they are much older, and out of the house. But THAT is just my two cents. It’s the above statement that’s my “official” answer to your question.

 

[Atreyu]

Thanks Cari. What I was trying to express to my friend, is that I’m perfectly happy for him to have the exact same opinion as you do - and he does have this opinion. However, he takes it a step further and claims that it is doctrine.

Thanks again for your (name removed by moderator)ut.

 

[Margita]

Why do people have to poke their noses into other families’ business?? I say, tell your friend not to let anbody (except their pastor) interfere with how she and her husband run their lives.

 

[Diddi]

One of my female friends - who is married with one young child and another one on the way - has been trying to get pre-selected in the upcoming federal Australian elections. If she had have been elected, this would have meant that her husband most likely would have had to resign his career to spend some more time looking after the children.

• but I know they were aware of these sacrifices and the husband was completely supportive of them.

I’m also happy for my traditional friends to have the opinion that I am wrong, …

But what I am not happy for, is for my traditional friends to claim that their view is not just an opinion, and is actually Church doctrine.

Now I am aware of Paul’s teaching on the matter and I’m completely happy with the fact that the man should be the head of the woman, and all that jazz.

"…, and all that jazz."

1. ??? I take it you’re not perfectly happy with Paul’s teaching, based on your wording.
2. One might question the timing with a baby on the way.
3. Actually, you didn’t give enough information in your original post for anybody to give useful advice about your friend’s situation with her husband. If, for example, your friend dominates her husband and regularly makes most of the decisions for him to “fully support (if he knows what’s best for him)”, then his being “fully supportive” of the decisions in question is not as convincing as it might otherwise be. Is he your friend also? Maybe these other friends know him a little better than you and know something about how he feels that you don’t. Maybe he has thrown out a “please rescue” signal that these “more traditional” friends have picked up on, but you haven’t. Maybe they sense that he is apprehensive about the decision but afraid to say anything and not be supportive. If, on the other hand, your friend’s husband normally is genuinely involved (as head of the woman) with important decisions and they are a true married team, and he says to his wife, “Hey, I think you should go for it!”, and she says, “I’m not sure. I wouldn’t want you to be unhappy with this decision.”, and he says, “I say do it.”, well that’s a different story. We simply don’t know enough, from what you have posted, to give good advice.

“I’m also happy for my traditional friends to have the opinion that I am wrong,”

“But what I am not happy for,”

1. (Emphasis added.) You seem to have a lot at stake in winning this argument. Are you putting too much pressure on your friend and her husband?

It seems from your statement that you don’t consider yourself very traditional and your referring to these friends by this title seems to speak volumes. I’ve often believed something was Church doctrine and have been wrong. We all do this sometimes. Why is this getting you so riled up this time?

Now for my opinion. Let your friend and her husband make the decision, not you. You’ve given your opinion, now let there be peace and back off. If your friend’s husband is truly in favor of her active involvement in politics, their traditional friends aren’t going to stop her from being involved in politics. After all, it’s his decision, as head of the woman and all that jazz.

God bless you!

 

[lak611]

The daughter of one of my mother’s friends is a psychologist. Her husband previously worked in sales. After they had children, the husband decided to stay home and take care of them since the wife’s income was considerably more than his. The family is doing very well.

 

[Atreyu]

Diddi -

1. 
   *]Whatever made you think that? Actually I fully support Paul’s teaching. It is Biblical and hence the word of God. I don’t know what I said that made you think otherwise.
   *]I don’t have a baby on the way. Is that what you meant?
   *]I am not all that good friends with the couple in question. I am viewing this as simply a theological issue, and I don’t have any emotional attachment as you seem to be suggesting in your post. I think I know enough of the couple in question to say confidently that this would have been a decision that the couple arrived at together, without the wife “dominating” the husband or any such thing.
   *]I’m not putting any pressure on the couple in question - in fact, I have hardly discussed this with them at all. There has been a lot of drama involved in this whole issue, and I am quite confident that this has not been increased by me. Like I said before, I view this as a theological issue only. I have a particular opinion, which I hold to be an opinion - and therefore I hope that this opinion is in-line with Church doctrine. If it is not in-line with Church doctrine, then I need to be corrected. However, if it is in-line with Church doctrine, then I take offence at my friends saying otherwise.
   *]In fact I am quite traditional. I love the Latin Mass, and I am very much a conservative. By me saying that my friends are “more traditional” tells you absolutely nothing about my own position on the scale of liberal to traditional.
   *]Who says I’m getting riled up? In fact, the only thing that has me at all riled up is the wild speculation on your part.
   *]Thank you for your advice on how to proceed with the couple in question. So how do I proceed with my other friends that contend that what the couple are doing is contrary to Church teaching?

 

[Diddi]

Diddi -

1. 
   *]Whatever made you think that? Actually I fully support Paul’s teaching. It is Biblical and hence the word of God. I don’t know what I said that made you think otherwise.
   *]I don’t have a baby on the way. Is that what you meant?
   *]I am not all that good friends with the couple in question. I am viewing this as simply a theological issue, and I don’t have any emotional attachment as you seem to be suggesting in your post. I think I know enough of the couple in question to say confidently that this would have been a decision that the couple arrived at together, without the wife “dominating” the husband or any such thing.
   *]I’m not putting any pressure on the couple in question - in fact, I have hardly discussed this with them at all. There has been a lot of drama involved in this whole issue, and I am quite confident that this has not been increased by me. Like I said before, I view this as a theological issue only. I have a particular opinion, which I hold to be an opinion - and therefore I hope that this opinion is in-line with Church doctrine. If it is not in-line with Church doctrine, then I need to be corrected. However, if it is in-line with Church doctrine, then I take offence at my friends saying otherwise.
   *]In fact I am quite traditional. I love the Latin Mass, and I am very much a conservative. By me saying that my friends are “more traditional” tells you absolutely nothing about my own position on the scale of liberal to traditional.
   *]Who says I’m getting riled up? In fact, the only thing that has me at all riled up is the wild speculation on your part.
   *]Thank you for your advice on how to proceed with the couple in question. So how do I proceed with my other friends that contend that what the couple are doing is contrary to Church teaching?

1. 
   Ouch!
   1. Pray for them and ask them to pray for you. God bless you.
   In Christ,
   
   Diddi