H
hellopeople
Guest
To be honest I don’t think that the Catholic church is any more valid than many of the protestant churches out there. The Catholic church was definitely corrupt for long periods of time throughout history.
- Status
J
JRKH
Guest
Your opinion is duly noted. But -
Let’s not derail this thread by getting into this here. If you’d like to discuss validity of Churches or corruption, a search will turn up many threads on the subject, or you can start a new thread and get many responses.
The issue here is that these people who are advising this girl do not recognize Catholicism as being Christian. That means that they do not give “equal validity to all churches” but rather deny validity to the oldest Church.
Such a position cannot be of God. This is the concern.
Also there must be a concern that this person is tempted to deny her catholic faith in order to extend her temporal life. Now - if she were drawn into another spirituality that would be one thing, but these people are making “Leaving catholicism” a condition of receiving healing. In other words they are attempting to force her to deny her faith. God does not work like that.
The devil tempted Jesus in three ways.
First he temped Him with “temporal” matter, that is that Jesus should do first what was necessary to Live temporally instead of doing first what is needed to Live eternally
Second he temped Him with “Spiritual matter”. That is that Jesus should tempt God by demanding “Proof” instead of simply relying on God to Provide
Thirdly was the biggie - Satan tempted Jesus with Riches beyond imagining if He would deny His faith in God and worship satan instead.
These people are doing the same. They are trying to force this girl to deny her faith in exchange for “temporal goods”. A lousy bargain - but unfortunately one that people too often succumb to.
No - regardless of the validity of other faith communities, this one is definitely NOT valid.
Peace
James
G
GodLovesTheSpek
Guest
I think JRKH has it pretty much explained. 
Temptation goes all the way back to Genesis 3 (RSVCE):
4 But the serpent said to the woman, “You will not die. 5 For God knows that when you eat of it your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil.” 6 So when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was a delight to the eyes, and that the tree was to be desired to make one wise, she took of its fruit and ate; and she also gave some to her husband, and he ate.*
The clever words of The Liar. If only one would reject God one would be like God.
Temptation goes all the way back to Genesis 3 (RSVCE):
4 But the serpent said to the woman, “You will not die. 5 For God knows that when you eat of it your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil.” 6 So when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was a delight to the eyes, and that the tree was to be desired to make one wise, she took of its fruit and ate; and she also gave some to her husband, and he ate.*
The clever words of The Liar. If only one would reject God one would be like God.
B
Bbigam
Guest
Abandon the Church that Christ founded, and the Real Presence of Christ in the Eucharist, in order to bring people closer to Christ? Impossible.
She needs many, many prayers, and yes, the Anointing of the Sick, Confession, and the Eucharist.
N
Newbie2
Guest
Why would she need to start a new church if there is a perfectly good one, or as you say below more than one good one? Why would the condition that she have another child be discussed?
You can’t recognize this as a ruse? Some of these “bible studies” are definitive for “false teachings” and “false prophets”. I’ll bet if she goes along with this, there will be a request for money sometime along the way…
How so? Do you mean the Church herself or individuals within the Church. If you mean individuals within the CC, you’ll get few if any arguments from most Catholics.
H
hellopeople
Guest
The Church is made up of people though. If the highest ranking people in an organization are corrupt, then the organization is corrupt. Was enron corrupt, or was it just the people within enron?
N
Newbie2
Guest
Certain people within Enron. You can’t seriously believe that everyone who’s ever worked for Enron in a management position was corrupt, do you? Same with the CC.
J
JRKH
Guest
Consider this -
If a President is corrupt, does that make the United States Corrupt?
Because Nixon abused his office, is the Constitution less valid?
Enron, as a corporation, was not corrupt. I would wager that anyone receiving and reading the investment prospectus, by laws, mission statement, etc of the corporation would not have seen anything corrupt in any of them. These are the things that define what a “corporation”. The people functioning within the organization can be corrupt or not. Yes, there were people at the top who we so corrupt that they caused the company to collapse. However there were many people in Enron, even people who were in positions of power, who were honest and just as much victims of the collapse as the investors were.
While there were certainly corrupt individuals within The Church, even in the highest offices, The teachings of The church, the core beliefs of The Church remained intact and valid. In fact it is one of the amazing things about The Church that, not even decades of poor leadership, no one corrupt person, even a pope, been able to change the essential Truths taught by The Church.
Peace
James
M
manualman
Guest
Basically these other people are playing the role Peter played when he attempted to talk Jesus out of submitting to crucifixion. Jesus responded by saying “Get behind me Satan.”
Look closer, it really is the same thing. Peter wanted a grand and glorious earthly life aned career for Jesus. He wanted him to be the presume Jewish military messiaf and throw off the Roman conquerers and bring Israel to earthly glory.
These others are promising health and wealth prosperity gospels. That isn’t the gospel of Christ. Suffering is hard to understand, but is inarguably very often connected with accepting God’s will. It is the mark of a phony to promise a life of ease and pleasure in God’s name. Beware.
Look closer, it really is the same thing. Peter wanted a grand and glorious earthly life aned career for Jesus. He wanted him to be the presume Jewish military messiaf and throw off the Roman conquerers and bring Israel to earthly glory.
These others are promising health and wealth prosperity gospels. That isn’t the gospel of Christ. Suffering is hard to understand, but is inarguably very often connected with accepting God’s will. It is the mark of a phony to promise a life of ease and pleasure in God’s name. Beware.
S
SunnaB16
Guest
Maybe this young wife and mother should be reminded of Saint Gianna Molla.
Not the same situation, but praying for her intercession might help. Plus there`s a heap of others; not least, our Heavenly Mother. She needs spiritual healing, at least.
Link to some info
www.wf-f.org/StGianna.html
Not the same situation, but praying for her intercession might help. Plus there`s a heap of others; not least, our Heavenly Mother. She needs spiritual healing, at least.
Link to some info
www.wf-f.org/StGianna.html
C
Celtic_Catholic
Guest
Sounds like some Jehova Witnesses or Holy Rollers got to her. Big mistake letting them in the house. But I’m not so sure satan is responsbile for the trouble. Sometimes I think we give him too much “credit” with “the devil made me do it” explanation. I’m sure the JW’s (or Pentecostals) are mentally disturbed and actually believe everything they’re telling her. I mean, their church is basically a cult. My concern is that they are misleading her by telling her she will live longer than she can and the strong possibility that she believes it. I think she needs an intervention to bring her back to reality. And it’s not because she may leave our Church for another demonination. It’s due to the cult-like influence JW’s (or Pentecostals) project. If she passes away with Christ in her heart and forgiveness from Him (no matter what denomination she is), she will be in paradise.
She’s in my prayers.
She’s in my prayers.
M
Mel23
Guest
Thank you all who gave good advice and prayers. My husband had so many good things to tell her that I felt she needed to hear. So I set a time for us to hang out as friends so she would not think of us coming over to tell her what we thought. I just told her to make sure that nothing got in the way of us hanging out (like these people telling her they had to get together with her to reveal something new) . Before we went over there, my husband went to the adoration chapel to ask the Lord what he needed to tell her. He explained that she needed to go to adoration, confession and receive communion. He told her the reasons to not walk away from the church, the eucharist, the sacraments, etc. I feel she thought she was going to hear something different from us, but my husband just started crying when he was telling her all of these things. She started to cry and said she would go. She has a priest who she is very close to and he has asked her to go to Lourdes. She wanted to but she is on oxygen, and was afraid of her lungs possibly collapsing. She has ALWAYS told Father about everything and always asked for his spiritual guidance, but she told him a little and not the end where they are telling her to leave the catholic faith. I want to call and tell him, but I don’t want her to feel I betrayed her. The lady used to be pentecostal but was married to a catholic. We told her that we knew deep in her heart she knew the catholic faith was the true faith and she agreed. She was trying to tell me that Amber agreed that the eucharist was the body of Christ and she agreed that the catholic faith was 100% right on. So then I asked her why she would leave the faith and then tell her to leave also if she believed that??? Please keep praying for her. I am going to see if she went to mass yesterday like she told us she would do and visit the adoration chapel. Emerald Wings I will look at the links you sent, I need all the help I can get God Bless you all!!! 
- Status