Traditional Vocation

[TantumErgo90]

I’ve heard many traditionalists say that there are only two vocations: priest/religious and married and that the Single Life isn’t a vocation. However, what is the vocation for those who have sodomitic disorders? What is their vocation? As they cannot be married and they shouldn’t be in religious life or the priesthood. Can they be called to one of those two, but cannot fulfill it due to their impediment. I’d appreciate a Traditional Catholic answer. A person on the vocations comittee at my church thinks the single life is a vocation, because “all people need a vocation, and this is what gays are called to be.” I politely disagreed with her.

 

[skatepixie]

I have often wondered what vocation there is for me…I would like to be married, but I have to be on the pill for medical reasons.

Or, what if you feel called to be married and just never meet “the right person.”

Or, you could be the opposite. My mom didn’t think she wanted to be married until she met my dad, and she still says she can’t imagine ever being married to anyone else.

Then, what about people who are not fit health-wise for a vocation. Ie…people with retardation, etc.

 

[markadm]

A person on the vocations comittee at my church thinks the single life is a vocation, because “all people need a vocation, and this is what gays are called to be.” I politely disagreed with her.

But the Church herself teaches this:

In the light of such teaching, this Dicastery, in accord with the Congregation for Divine Worship and the Discipline of the Sacraments, believes it necessary to state clearly that the Church, while profoundly respecting the persons in question[9], cannot admit to the seminary or to holy orders those who practise homosexuality, present deep-seated homosexual tendencies or support the so-called “gay culture”.

Such persons, in fact, find themselves in a situation that gravely hinders them from relating correctly to men and women. One must in no way overlook the negative consequences that can derive from the ordination of persons with deep-seated homosexual tendencies.

Different, however, would be the case in which one were dealing with homosexual tendencies that were only the expression of a transitory problem - for example, that of an adolescence not yet superseded. Nevertheless, such tendencies must be clearly overcome at least three years before ordination to the diaconate.

(CDW, Instruction Concerning the Criteria for the Discernment of Vocations with regard to Persons with Homosexual Tendencies in view of their Admission to the Seminary and to Holy Orders)

I noticed you say “I’d appreciate a Traditional Catholic answer”, and whilst I respect that the Church’s view may have been expressed in a different form in times past, I cannot see how it could realistically have been otherwise, given the absolute need for purity in the clerical state.

Reading and thinking carefully about what that document says and other teaching on the matter it is clear that it is a different matter for those who, whilst having previously suffered from these tendencies, are no longer tormented in that way.

 

[TantumErgo90]

But the Church herself teaches this:
Quote:
In the light of such teaching, this Dicastery, in accord with the Congregation for Divine Worship and the Discipline of the Sacraments, believes it necessary to state clearly that the Church, while profoundly respecting the persons in question[9], cannot admit to the seminary or to holy orders those who practise homosexuality, present deep-seated homosexual tendencies or support the so-called “gay culture”.

Such persons, in fact, find themselves in a situation that gravely hinders them from relating correctly to men and women. One must in no way overlook the negative consequences that can derive from the ordination of persons with deep-seated homosexual tendencies.

Different, however, would be the case in which one were dealing with homosexual tendencies that were only the expression of a transitory problem - for example, that of an adolescence not yet superseded. Nevertheless, such tendencies must be clearly overcome at least three years before ordination to the diaconate.

(CDW, Instruction Concerning the Criteria for the Discernment of Vocations with regard to Persons with Homosexual Tendencies in view of their Admission to the Seminary and to Holy Orders)
I noticed you say “I’d appreciate a Traditional Catholic answer”, and whilst I respect that the Church’s view may have been expressed in a different form in times past, I cannot see how it could realistically have been otherwise, given the absolute need for purity in the clerical state.

Reading and thinking carefully about what that document says and other teaching on the matter it is clear that it is a different matter for those who, whilst having previously suffered from these tendencies, are no longer tormented in that way.

I think you seriously misinterpreted what I was asking. I IN NO WAY support that men with sodomitic attractions be admitted to the priesthood or religious life. What I was asking is that if the Single Life traditionally has been considered a vocation and what would the vocation be of those that have sodomitic attractions. I fully agree with the statement from the Holy Office. It is despicable that sodomites and those with sodomitic attractions were ordained. I was disagreeing with the vocations committee member about people being “called to the single life”. I know that Consecrated Virginity is “single life”, but that is a religious vocation, entirely different than Single Life.

 

[CollegeKid]

Respectfully, I would disagree with you that the single life is not a vocation for some. I think it is for those who are not called to marriage or religious life or the priesthood. For what its worth, this is something I’ve discussed with my spiritual director (parish priest) who is quite orthodox and has stated that he more often than not sympathizes with traditionalists. In fact, he is determined to learn how to offer the Traditional Latin Mass. He has told me that for some the single life is in fact their true vocation- this could be, for example, for someone who devotes their life to military service, or to an apostolate of the Church, or someone in real life-Condoleeza Rice-who has remained unmarried because, according to her own testimony, her schedule would be unfair to a husband and children.

 

[CollegeKid]

Also, I would agree with the lady you spoke to at church- if a person who suffers from deep-seated homosexual tendencies can never overcome those through prayer and counseling, I don’t see how they would have any other option than the single life- to act on their tendencies would be sin, and for them to get married would be totally unfair to anyone they would take as their spouse, seeing as a normal marital relationship including sexual relations would be impossible for them.

 

[SnorterLuster]

I have a St. Paul Sunday Missal published in 1954 that does list the single life as a vocation. It is listed as The State of Chaste & Virtuous Unmarried Life. The missal notes; "…if matrimony is good, voluntary chastity is even better, if embraced for the love of God and neighbor."

The missal states further:

**"However, it is not advisable for anyone to remain in the single state in the world, unless prevented by some impediments or duties which keep them from entering a Religious Congregation or from embracing the married state.
"Nevertheless, should someone be compelled, by force of circumstances to remain unmarried, but in the world, they must recognize the hand of God and patiently submit to His most holy will.  The unmarried must courageously tread the path of life alone.  It requires a great deal of courage and fortitude to pass through life alone, but the Giver of all good gifts will not withhold these qualities from His true servants if they keep their eyes and heart fixed upon Him.
"If you are called to this state of life, strive to do good to others – help work for the salvation of souls – but above all, strive to become perfect in the following of Christ."**

In my mind, if a homosexual is unable to overcome his affliction to the point that marriage is not in the cards, he can nonetheless resist the temptation of his sodomy and be called to a chaste single life.

And beyond just homosexuality, old maids and bachelors have long been a part of parish life in the Church. I think all of us have had aunts or uncles that never married for one reason or another including never finding a compatible mate.

 

[TantumErgo90]

Thank you for the quotes. Celibacy is a higher calling. But one must not be single because he doesn’t want a family. Here is a main point in the posted quote

if matrimony is good, voluntary chastity is even better, if embraced for the love of God and neighbor.

So it needs to be done out of love of God and neighbor. I cannot be done because of laziness. I also feel bad for those who have sodomitic inclinations, I could never imagine what they are going through. But since they do have an impediment as quoted

"However, it is not advisable for anyone to remain in the single state in the world, unless prevented by some impediments or duties which keep them from entering a Religious Congregation or from embracing the married state.

, they have to live a single state in the world. Thank you for the quotes and helping me understand better. But the single state is not a vocation in the sense of God calling you to be Single in the world, except when someone becomes a consecrated virgin out of sacrifice for God. The state of being “single in the world” in and of itself is not a vocation, you must want to do it because you want to give a sacrifice to God. Correct me if I’m wrong.

 

[JKirkLVNV]

Thank you for the quotes. Celibacy is a higher calling. But one must not be single because he doesn’t want a family. Here is a main point in the posted quote So it needs to be done out of love of God and neighbor. I cannot be done because of laziness. I also feel bad for those who have sodomitic inclinations, I could never imagine what they are going through. But since they do have an impediment as quoted , they have to live a single state in the world. Thank you for the quotes and helping me understand better. But the single state is not a vocation in the sense of God calling you to be Single in the world, except when someone becomes a consecrated virgin out of sacrifice for God. The state of being “single in the world” in and of itself is not a vocation, you must want to do it because you want to give a sacrifice to God. Correct me if I’m wrong.

The homosexual inclination is, I think, a cross. We all have a vocation to take up the cross before us and follow Christ, a universal vocation. In that sense, I think the single life would be a necessary part of THAT vocation.

And I’m not sure we can say that God calls a homosexual to the priesthood (though he would be unable to answer that call). The Church ratifies a call from God to priestly and religious life and I should think that would fall under the power of binding and loosing given the magisterium, which has declared that homosexuals may not be ordained. Maybe I’m wrong in my interpretation.

 

[TantumErgo90]

But is the single life a vocation in the Catholic Church?

 

[JKirkLVNV]

This link HAS links you can look at:

forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=193042

 

[TantumErgo90]

Thank you for your responses. I have come to the conclusion, through research and reading online that in-fact the Single Life is NOT a vocation, but a state in life in which a person tries to find their vocation. However, one may stay in single life if circumstances prevent them from entering marriage, priesthood, or religious life. The only question is what is the vocation for those unable to enter into religious life, marriage, or priesthood? Would it be in a third order? Please help me, I need to explain this to the vocations committee member.

 

[JKirkLVNV]

Thank you for your responses. I have come to the conclusion, through research and reading online that in-fact the Single Life is NOT a vocation, but a state in life in which a person tries to find their vocation. However, one may stay in single life if circumstances prevent them from entering marriage, priesthood, or religious life. The only question is what is the vocation for those unable to enter into religious life, marriage, or priesthood? Would it be in a third order? Please help me, I need to explain this to the vocations committee member.

I’m not too certain I’d stress over it. Our life is our cross and our vocation is to carry our cross and follow Christ.

 

[joanofarc3]

I’ve heard many traditionalists say that there are only two vocations: priest/religious and married and that the Single Life isn’t a vocation. However, what is the vocation for those who have sodomitic disorders? What is their vocation? As they cannot be married and they shouldn’t be in religious life or the priesthood. Can they be called to one of those two, but cannot fulfill it due to their impediment. I’d appreciate a Traditional Catholic answer. A person on the vocations comittee at my church thinks the single life is a vocation, because “all people need a vocation, and this is what gays are called to be.” I politely disagreed with her.

I think someone EWTN even admitted that the single state is “incomplete.” I think that’s the best word. If one isn’t called to marriage, or the priesthood/religious life, then one would make a vow of celibacy in order for that state to receive “merit,” so to speak.