Twelve Tribes sect - Teachings of their leader and elders on child discipline and slavery of blacks. Child abuse? Racism?

[Nigel7]

I am posting this to hear what you think of this group after reviewing the info below. This religious sect “Twelve Tribes” has been around since the 70’s, has communities in the US and around the globe, and have gotten into hot water with law enforcement and child protective services - police raiding compounds in the US and Germany after documented abuse, various cases with members being arrested for child abuse, including convictions for child abuse, etc.
Twelve Tribes is also in trouble with child protecive services in the US and elsewhere for exploiting children in their factories to produce products for their various businesses. (Loreal , Whole Foods, and many other companies have cut ties with TT after discovering who was behind the companies producing these products branded/smokescreened behind various names)
Twelve Tribes operates many businesses - construction companies around the globe, beauty products, tea (Mate Factor) as well as a string of deli’s under various names (The Yellow Deli, The Mate Factor Deli, etc.) which operate in the red but serve as platforms for drawing fresh recruits into the group.

Below is some information, and I’m curious to hear people’s thoughts once they’ve given it a look.
Do you believe this group is benign, or not? Are they following God’s commands and living out the faith according to the bible? Child abusers and/or racists? Do you believe Twelve Tribes is a safe environment for children?

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Child discipline teachings of Twelve Tribes founder Elbert Spriggs (Yoneq) and other Twelve Tribes elders [followed then by Spriggs’ teaching on the enslavement of blacks]

“It’s better to be too severe in our discipline than too lenient. It is very difficult to increase discipline later on, but it isn’t difficult to decrease…Discipline, in order to be effective, must be consistent, controlled severity, and applied early in life, and immediately after an offense…This means that we shouldn’t give anyone a command unless we see to it that he obeys. The rod must come wherever there is disobedience. Let’s not ever use the rod unless it hurts. It should be that the child would never want another spanking” better to overdiscipline-dolls-fantazing
“A child can learn at a very young age. For example, a wriggling six-month-old baby who intentionally refuses to let you put on his diaper can be taught the meaning of “no” in one or two simple lessons. When he tries to crawl away while changing his diaper, he can be told “no,” pulled back, and held in place for a moment. The next time that he tries to crawl away, he should be spanked lightly”. Control and teaching

“When there is a stubborn child you should shorten the child’s life. It limits the family”.
-Training Up Our Children In The Way They Should Go. 1988-11-22-t02

Yesterday I was down at the river and Yochanan (Haggai’s son) was swimming and I saw that he had stripes on his bottom. I thought that if there were other people there and they saw those marks, they should know that he has a father who loves him.
-Breaking of bread 7/15/89

Continued…

 

[Nigel7]

Cont…

From the cradle to the grave you must discipline your children. From the age of 6 months you would start disciplining them with a rod on the palm of their hands and then you would stop when they are about one year old. From there you would discipline the children with a rod on their buttocks until they submit…
-Elbert Spriggs (Yoneq)

Our children need to fear the rod. The severity of our discipline should cause them to never want to be disciplined again. Don’t be afraid of your “baby”. That he is going to be more than you can handle if you confront his bad attitudes or deal with his disobedience. For we have no other purpose than to deal with our children… So, take action and “beat the tar out of him”.
-Letter From Abel 4/6/85

The method needs to be controlled, slow and hard. He should never want another wippen (sic) as long as he lives.
-Elders Meeting 2/11/78

Reproof gives wisdom to the child. Submission comes only through reverent submission (fear) of the Lord. Execute judgment and draw blood.
-Elders Meeting 2/11/78

A six month old baby can be trained what no means. Lightly use the rod not your hand. When the baby is wiggling when their diaper is changed, spank them to stop wiggling.
-AWM 3/16/88

A man who beats his son frequently will reap the benefits. He will be proud of him among his acquaintances.
-Letter From Abel 4/6/85

Bend his neck and bruise his ribs while he is young. Allow him no independence in childhood, or he will hurt you very deeply. Be strict with your son and persevere if not then you will nurture his insolence.
-Letter From Abel 4/6/85

Continued…

 

[Nigel7]

Cont…

Founder/leader Spriggs on slavery;

[A sample of the writings of Tribes leader Elbert Eugene Spriggs … (when he speaks of “Châm” he means black folks]

"Châm and Servitude Châm is a unique race. If they could only know. Whoever of Châm’s seed learns respect from his servitude to Shem, the curse will be lifted from them. No blessing was mentioned in regard to Châm in Gen 9:24-29, but only a curse. The other sons of Châm would be slaves, but Canaan’s seed would be the lowest, the slave of slaves (1 Pet 2:18-20). The glory will be on Châmite slaves for their submission to unjust masters. There is no other way for Châmites to inherit the nations than to fulfill the covenant of Genesis 9.

Martin Luther King was filled with every evil spirit there is to say Châm doesn’t have to serve Shem. All manner of evil filled that man. It is horrible that someone would rise up to abolish slavery. What a marvelous opportunity that blacks could be brought over here to be slaves so that they could be found worthy of the nations. A good master would work by the sweat of his brow. If his slaves were lazy and disrespectful, he would beat them, which is what he was supposed to do. When Châm is saved he is to be employed according to his natural endowments. We are all to be servants in Messiah, but Châm is somehow given natural endowment to be a servant. Any pride in him will be opposed until God can make him in His own image."

Source. Lots here > Twelve Tribes Teachings | Question 12 Tribes

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Twelve Tribes: The Church Preached Child Abuse & Slavery

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Fourteen year old girl given in marriage, and often younger than that
(wedding segment begins @ 10:00 )

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The Idyllic Restaurant Chain Owned by a Homophobic, Racist, Child-Beating Cult

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This expose’ from Australia’s Current Affair triggered several investigations. Lots of news stories online regarding those investigations and others in the US and abroad.

So, based on all of this and any other info you have seen, what do you think of Twelve Tribes?

 

[Tis_Bearself]

Why would any reasonable person think a group of child-abusing racists is “benign”?
Are you actually thinking you will find people supporting this extreme cult here?

 

[aroosi]

Never heard of them but after reading what you posted I would say any sane person should steer clear of them.

 

[EmilyAlexandra]

Do you believe this group is benign, or not?

Clearly they are anything but benign.

Are they following God’s commands and living out the faith according to the bible?

Quite possibly they think that that is what they are doing.

Child abusers and/or racists?

Both.

Do you believe Twelve Tribes is a safe environment for children?

Does it sound like a safe environment for children?!

Despicable though these people sound, they are sadly just one of the more obviously appalling manifestations of ideologies based on Christian fundamentalism.

Their ideas about disciplining children are also to be found in the book To Train Up a Child:

https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/To_Train_Up_a_Child

 

[Nigel7]

Why would any reasonable person think a group of child-abusing racists is “benign”?
Are you actually thinking you will find people supporting this extreme cult here?

My investigation into the group has found that most people are not aware of the abuses and racist teachings of TT, and they see the group as kind and warm-hearted people who live biblically and operate beautiful and delicious deli’s in the local community.

Prior to my posting this thread I searched these forums and found multiple Twelve Tribes threads from years past, and people generally thought TT was benign. Of course most weren’t aware of most or any of what I shared about TT in my initial posts here a few hours ago.

I posted this thread here on CA because I trust that this community will look at the info I provided (in addition possibly to any other info they may find) and give their honest assessment of Twelve Tribes.

 

[Tis_Bearself]

I believe the article states that TT is relatively unknown in USA. The Southern Poverty Law Center, which lists it as a hate group, even notes that most people in US are not familiar with it. To the extent it operates here in USA, it would go under some other name (as the article states) and based on the appearance and teaching of those involved, would likely be dismissed by most folks as just another extremist fundamentalist group.

If there were threads from years past, they may have been made at some point when TT was in the news (though I personally never heard of them), or they may have been made by people outside USA.

 

[Nigel7]

My investigation into the group has found that most people are not aware of the abuses and racist teachings of TT, and they see the group as kind and warm-hearted people who live biblically and operate beautiful and delicious deli’s in the local community.

Here’s a good example of this, and demonstrates the purpose of the deli’s for TT.
The young man dining at the deli who is convinced he wants to join the group admittedly doesn’t have a clue what the group’s beliefs even are.
Nice people. Good food. Young teenage girls for the breeding. He’s all in.

 

[Nigel7]

Indeed. You’d think they’d have at least a Katy Perry on there or something.

Especially considering that young college age kids are often the targets of recruitment at these deli’s (TT places these deli’s often in college towns), as seen in the case of the guy in the video above, as well as this girl in the video below, who was attending college nearby only to get swept up in TT via frequenting the local deli. Again, clueless of the realities before giving herself and all she owned over to these people and hiding herself away behind their walls.

 

[Nigel7]

The Twelve Tribes tries to keep its extremist teachings on race from novice members and outsiders, but former members and experts on fringe religious movements who’ve helped its followers escape paint a dark picture of life in the group’s monastic communities — especially for black members, who must reconcile the appalling teachings on race with their own heritage and skin color.

Into Darkness | Southern Poverty Law Center