Understanding the Sexes

[ClemtheCatholic]

I have a whole bunch of ideas and questions on this! I find it can be difficult talking about the Church’s understanding of gender because oftentimes we mix metaphors with real life.

So for instance, Peter Kreeft says that God is masculine (which, incidentally, explains why Jesus is male) and that we (both men and women) are therefore called to be feminine in how we relate to God. I’m wondering if we can unpack this a little more:

• What does masculinity mean in this context?
• What does femininity mean?
• How is a man like myself supposed to be feminine in his relationship with God?
• If God is masculine, does that mean men are more God-like than women?

If anyone has thoughts on this or related questions, I would love to hear them! These are such awesome and mysterious questions of anthropology, and I would dearly love to understand them better.

For reference, Peter Kreeft’s argument can be found here: peterkreeft.com/topics-more/sexual-symbolism.htm

 

[phil19034]

This one topic could easily be a graduate level Philosophy course and even a Ph.D dissertation.

Here is one good place to start: patrickcoffin.media/videos/tonyesolen/

What does masculinity mean in this context?

I THINK masculinity here means fatherhood and hierarchical authority. Men (esp with one another) tend to be very ritualistic, hierarchical, and frank. Two men can have a very blunt/confrontational conversation and still be close friends afterwards.

What does femininity mean?

to contrast the above, women tend to use nurturing methods while men tend to use disciplinary methods. “An eye for an eye” is a very “masculine” concept, but “love your enemy” is a more “feminine” concept. As a group, women also tend to show more empathy than men, and are usually more concerned with not hurting someone’s feelings. Therefore, as a group, they are often less blunt/frank then men are.

How is a man like myself supposed to be feminine in his relationship with God?

As Christians, esp as Catholic Christians, we are called to both Justice and Mercy equally. I think (this is just me) that Justice comes from the masculine while Mercy comes from the feminine. To be children of God, we men need to embrace Mercy (aka the proper feminine). While some women have a tendency to lean towards Mercy without enough focus on Justice, not being merciful is much worse than being too merciful.

If God is masculine, does that mean men are more God-like than women?

No, it doesn’t mean that. It simply means that FATHERHOOD is closer to the personhood of God the Father. But many say that MOTHERHOOD is closer to the personhood of God the Holy Spirit. It can also be argued that personhood of God the Son reflects both fatherhood and motherhood because a good son will reflect the positive attributes of both parents.

I pray this helps.

 

[AnneElizabeth]

I like your post and the questions…

I’m not sure we can ever really define masculine and feminine… I believe they are just about as mysterious as God is.

I believe we can only understand in concepts (like how Jesus spoke in parables about things) when it comes to this.  I don't think it can be defined or nailed down.. I believe when we do, we threaten what God created and make ourselves out to think we can know God so well...   It just can't be like that.   We can get a gist, or a simple understanding but I don't believe we can really know, as in its something set or some sort of scientific degree.

To take a stab at your question, here is my interpretation…

 The concepts would be receiving and giving, protector and helper/supporter,..  you see, each is doing the same thing, only in a different way (when it is doing what it should in the right way).    I'm reminded too (might seem far reaching out of this topic's scope, but bear with me...)   how people say that the Bible is full of contradictions, but really its not-  I've always seen these so called 'contradictions in the Bible"  as how blood vessels are made up of chambers-  on each end there is a closing and the other opens and when one is shut the other is open-  well which one is it?  Is it open or closed?  People want it to be one way or the other, but its like no one can ever admit that its indeed both.   This is how blood is pumped and for life's sake it takes what is needed, and passes along what it takes- pushes life (blood) through.   It goes together.. it fits and most of all it gives life- this open/closed, stop/go, take/give, working in sync is life... well, good life.   These things seemed opposed but they work together, fit perfectly, and give life.   When life constricts us, there is something to be taken (or to give), or when it is open to us, there is something to give (or something to take).   What is life?  A contradiction?  No!   Its ALL.  It is totality.   God is ALL, everything.   (By they way, I'm re-reading that paragraph and when I wrote it,  I did not intend for any part of it to sound sexual... :blush:  but it can be seen that way too! )

I believe masculine and feminine are parts of that ALL. But no one can really say where it ends or where it begins, just like people can’t say exactly where river water becomes sea water at the bay. Or when water disappears as condensation (is taken up) and then forms rain that then feeds the rivers and streams. Its a cycle. God knows where things are. Its always changing but always the same as well. It is ordered. Remarkably and frighteningly it can also be ordered in its perceived disorder: Example, the jack pine- the following excerpt taken from creationrevolution.com/plants-that-need-fire-to-survive/

“One example is the jack pine, found mostly in the very northern parts of central and eastern US and Canada. Their cones are very thick and hard. They are literally glued shut with a strong resin. These cones are referred to as serotinous which means, late blooming or opening. Serotinous cones can hang on a pine tree for years without opening up to release its seeds. When a fire sweeps through a forest of jack pines, the heat from the fire melts the resin, allowing the cones to open up and release the seeds.”

I also believe this is a part of the mystery of love. For when you ask what is masculine and feminine, its the same as asking “what is love?”. When we love, we are practicing the “ALL”… meaning we have learned to integrate (through love and by love) the masculine and feminine within ourselves in order to love, be love, transmit love. “God is love” (1 John 4:8) and God is life (John 14:6). I think for both sexes, the hard part of walking the faith is that integration- to become more whole, in God. Now which part of the ‘masculine’ and which part of the ‘feminine’ parts of God we need to integrate are as varied as there are species of beings on this earth!

You’ll have to excuse my lofty ideas there… I realize it might not be easily understood in what I meant by what I said… I’m be surprised if people can understand just a little as I hardly understand myself! But I’m just trying to answer your question, somehow… though did I actually answer anything at all?

   I'm partly wondering if you brought this topic up because of the recent talk about 'gender identity'?

EDIT: By they way, I realize what I said here might be taken that I’m saying God is both male and female. I realize this is a seeming contradiction to Scripture and I in no ways mean to teach against it… But here is also a seeming contradiction- If God is Masculine, how can He be “all”… Well, if you remember God took the rib from the side of Adam to create Eve… So there is an example that Eve is from the masculine… It also denotes this order of God- Masculine first, female from it. Ha… and just thought of another seemingly contradiction- with science- it is said that female came first, or at least when the fetus is growing in the womb it is said that we all start out as female. Reference: reference.com/family/babies-start-out-female-womb-6def66546d4fcd96