Valid, Sacramental marriage?

[TheWarriorMonk]

A non-practicing Catholic marries an Episcopalian in an Episcopal ceremony (both had valid Christian baptisms, the husband baptized in infancy as a Catholic and the wife baptized in a Protestant church.)

The husband is a Catholic. As a result, the couple must marry in Catholic form. Various dispensations would be necessary in the case (for the wife not being Catholic and being married outside of a Catholic Church). If the dispensations were not granted, the marriage is invalid.

The wife goes through RCIA and converts to Catholicism. Both begin to practice their Catholic faith. Question: Does a “blessing” of the marriage on Holy Saturday actually validate (or con validate) the marriage?

 

[Phemie]

The husband is a Catholic. As a result, the couple must marry in Catholic form. Various dispensations would be necessary in the case (for the wife not being Catholic and being married outside of a Catholic Church). If the dispensations were not granted, the marriage is invalid.

They were both baptized, only one dispensation was required, for lack of canonical form.

To reiterate, the only way this couple is married is if the completed the required marriage prep and had a convalidation ceremony; i.e., received the sacrament of marriage. The couple would know the difference between a simple blessing and a wedding ceremony; simply ask them.

Please! You can’t state this categorically. Some parishes don’t require marriage preparation for a convalidation and if the husband refused to restate the vows the priest could have petitioned the Bishop for a radical sanation. In that case it could have been the Nuptial Blessing that was given at the Easter Vigil. We have no way of knowing.

 

[1ke]

They were both baptized, only one dispensation was required, for lack of canonical form.

Please! You can’t state this categorically. Some parishes don’t require marriage preparation for a convalidation and if the husband refused to restate the vows the priest could have petitioned the Bishop for a radical sanation. In that case it could have been the Nuptial Blessing that was given at the Easter Vigil. We have no way of knowing.

 

[TheWarriorMonk]

You can’t state this categorically. Some parishes don’t require marriage preparation for a convalidation

Well, if this is true, I’ve just learned something new. Do some parishes really not require marriage prep for convalidation under any circumstances, as a matter of policy?

I’m certainly aware of plenty of cases of a civilly married Catholic couples not being required to take marriage prep, but that’s a decision of the pastor based on the due to their particular circumstances of a particular couple. It just does not seem to make sense that a parish would allow a, say, non-practicing couple clueless about the Catholic concept of marriage to marry in Catholic Church.

 

[1ke]

Well, if this is true, I’ve just learned something new. Do some parishes really not require marriage prep for convalidation under any circumstances, as a matter of policy?

That is not what Phemie said at all.

Phemie correctly stated that requirements for convalidation vary, so you cannot state categorically that ‘everyone must attend Pre-Cana’.

The Bishop sets the requirements regarding marriage preparation. It could be that a meeting with the priest will suffice. If the priest is well acquainted with the couple, this may be all that is necessary to determine freedom to marry and ensure an understanding of the sacrament of marriage.

Further, as Phemie stated, radical sanation is an option-- which of course would preclude attending marriage prep or giving new consent.

 

[TheWarriorMonk]

If we’re going to be wordsmithing, it must be done properly

That is not what Phemie said at all.

Phemie correctly stated that requirements for convalidation vary, so you cannot state categorically that ‘everyone must attend Pre-Cana’.

Actually, what Phemie stated was:

Some parishes don’t require marriage preparation for a convalidation

That’s entirely differently from the manner in which you phrased it. I doubt any parish does not require marriage preparation for a convalidation (i.e., marriage). I should have clarified that everyone must attend marriage preparation unless the the pastor (or other person in charge) disposes of this requirement.

With regard to the radical sanation and nuptial blessing, the OP stated the following:

Is their first marriage actually valid due to the blessing on Holy Saturday when she entered the Church?

The OP is specifically linking the blessing with validation of the marriage; i.e., the invalid marriage becomes valid at the point. My answer was based on that OP’s statement. Of course, the blessing noted on Holy Saturday could have been a nuptial blessing if they were already married via simple convalidation or radical sanation, but that is not what the OP is talking about. In order for the invalid marriage to become valid at the point, obviously the “blessing” would have to be a marriage (convalidation) ceremony.

 

[Kathryn_Ann]

The only answer we can give is: maybe

All of this would have to be looked at through testimony of the petitioner, respondent (if participating), and witnesses.

I know you are just trying to help, but I think you need to stop asking if XYZ is grounds for nullity. We simply **cannot **tell you that. Please encourage her to sit down with her pastor and discuss the situation.

1ke, my most recent question was actually simply whether "these issues might be something to be brought up " when speaking to a priest, which I’ve already encouraged the person to do.:angel1: I didn’t ask for “XYZ” solutions, simply wisdom and experience. Many people come to these forums to welcome a good number of ideas from a large number of people, not expecting perfect answers. Yet most helpful are links to Church Doctrine on subjects of interest. I know you mean well too, but I wouldn’t tell someone to stop asking questions, and especially not because of their own perception of how the replies are being taken. These forums are wonderful ways to explore other people’s viewpoints, and I’m sure everyone here realizes that no one answer is taken as literal truth (unless they provide the above- mentioned links to solid Church doctrine Even then, we all realize each situation is unique. So I hope you won’t worry about anyone here depending solely on forum responses. But people are kind, and empathize when they reply. I appreciate that, and I’m sure you welcome that too.

 

[HoosMommie]

Well, if this is true, I’ve just learned something new. Do some parishes really not require marriage prep for convalidation under any circumstances, as a matter of policy?

I’m certainly aware of plenty of cases of a civilly married Catholic couples not being required to take marriage prep, but that’s a decision of the pastor based on the due to their particular circumstances of a particular couple. It just does not seem to make sense that a parish would allow a, say, non-practicing couple clueless about the Catholic concept of marriage to marry in Catholic Church.

Husband and I are having our marriage convalidated next week and have not been required to complete any marriage preparation. Perhaps having been married for 34 years helps

 

[TheWarriorMonk]

Husband and I are having our marriage convalidated next week and have not been required to complete any marriage preparation. Perhaps having been married for 34 years helps

We didn’t have to have it either. However, it does mean that marriage prep is not required by our Church; it absolutely is. The priest was well aware of our situation, but we still had to meet with him and fill in the blanks, at which point he decided that it would be unnecessary for us and dispensed us of this requirement.