Vatican City and Germany Treaties

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Hello! My name is Danny I am 14 and this is my first forum post.
An older boy in my home school group told me that the Vatican City signed peace treaties with Hitler and Musolini, and that the Vatican City helped Nazis. I asked him if he was sure, and he said he was. But I just can’t belive the pope would do that!
Does anyone out there know about this? What happened?
:confused:
 
Hello! My name is Danny I am 14 and this is my first forum post.
An older boy in my home school group told me that the Vatican City signed peace treaties with Hitler and Musolini, and that the Vatican City helped Nazis. I asked him if he was sure, and he said he was. But I just can’t belive the pope would do that!
Does anyone out there know about this? What happened?
:confused:
Its kind of complicated, but the Pope did sign treaties with Hitler and Musolini, but there was nothing evil about these treaties. They were meant to protect the Church, though the Nazis ended up violating the treaties and sent thousands of Catholics to the concentration camps. The Nazi’s were attacking Catholics, Jews, and many others, but the Pope, thankfully wasn’t helping him.

The Pope did sign a treaty with Musolini, because Vatican City is located in Rome, and Rome is kind of in the center of Italy! He signed a treaty called a Concordat that defined the relationship between the Church and the Italian government.

The Concordat, and other treaties with Italy, simply created Vatican City as a separate micro country within Rome, thus allowing the Church function without being influenced by Mussolini.

And the Pope did sign similar treaties with Germany. He signed a Concordat with Germany that allowed Catholics to worship in Church and operate Catholic schools. However, Germany broke those treaties when it started persecuting Catholics, and sending priests to the concentration camps.

And no, despite persistent rumors, the Pope didn’t help Hitler. Some people criticize the Pope for not denouncing the Holocaust. These same people also admit that Hilter would have most likely ignored the Pope. So they are criticizing the pope for no particularly good reason.

In fact, the pope helped save thousands of Jews. He directed nuns and monks throughout Europe to provide shelter in their monasteries for Jews escaping the holocaust, and sheltered the Jews in Rome as best he could.

Basically, your friend is distorting the truth a bit. Yes, the Pope signed treaties with Germany and Italy, but there was nothing wrong about doing so. As it is, Germany ended up violating the treaties anyways. Also, Hilter killed thousands of Catholics, especially Priests, in addition to the millions of Jews, and the Pope certainly didn’t help him do so. In fact, the pope did what he could to protect the Jews and others being chased by the Nazis.

Hope I’ve reassured you and Welcome to Catholic Forums!
 
I believe there was a story that the head rabbi of Rome felt so indebted to the Catholic Church that he converted.
 
Thanks everyone! I showed my friend all your great answers, but then he just said that Hitler woiuldn’t have hurt catholics, because Hitler was catholic! He can’t be right, can he?
 
Thanks everyone! I showed my friend all your great answers, but then he just said that Hitler woiuldn’t have hurt catholics, because Hitler was catholic! He can’t be right, can he?
He may have been brought up Catholic, however, he sure did not act like it.
 
Thanks everyone! I showed my friend all your great answers, but then he just said that Hitler woiuldn’t have hurt catholics, because Hitler was catholic! He can’t be right, can he?
Yes, Hitler was baptised Catholic. Although he was so against the Church. He was more of an Athiest. He never acted as a Catholic.

In a book called Hitler’s Table Talk (Adolf Hitler, London, Weidenfeld & Nicholson, 1953)
Hitler stated;
10th October, 1941, midday
“Christianity is a rebellion against natural law, a protest against nature. Taken to its logical extreme, Christianity would mean the systematic cultivation of the human failure.” (p 43)
19th October, 1941, night
“The reason why the ancient world was so pure, light and serene was that it knew nothing of the two great scourges: the pox and Christianity.”
Although he did state quotes like;
“We were convinced that the people need and require this faith. We have therefore undertaken the fight against the atheistic movement, and that not merely with a few theoretical declarations: we have stamped it out”.
He probably said things like this so that he could pollute his audience with his evil. He was a master when it came to speeches with big audiences.
  1. He was baptised Catholic, although he did not act like a Catholic.
  2. Used Christianity, specially the Church for propaganda for people to support his cause.
The Catholic Church saved alot of Jewish people. Estimated around 900,000.

This is a good article to read;
catholic.com/library/HOW_Pius_XII_PROTECTED_JEWS.asp

The Church in no way helped Hitler.

God Bless.
 
Ask him about the following gentleman then who was one of the many Catholic victims of the death camp system. Hitler was indeed Catholic but if that is meant to prove some bizarre theory that Catholics will always look after their own your friend is very naive indeed. Hitler was Catholic in the sense that all who are baptised or chrismated as Catholics remain so regardless of personal acts of evil or good. But it most certainly doesn’t mean been Catholic must mean that individuals are also men or women of upstanding morals. If we applied the logic that Catholics would not hurt Catholics in such an illogical manner no Civil War could have occurred in my own country. It’s a silly argument which seems as I said to proceed from some notions that them Catholics are all one big club watching out for each other.
Couldn’t say it any better myself, spot on 👍

Rath Dé ort!
 
OP, go to the Catholic League for Religious and Civil Rights website and check out their section on Pius XII and WW II; there is quite a lot of material there which will IMO conclusively dispel any notion that PXII or the Church cooperated with the Nazis.

With regard to the concordats, going from memory here, all the other major ecclesial communities had signed agreements, and RCC signed last of all, as an alternative to having zero standing legally within Germany, and as noted, the Reich regularly ignored its obligations thereunder.
 
Thanks everyone! I showed my friend all your great answers, but then he just said that Hitler woiuldn’t have hurt catholics, because Hitler was catholic! He can’t be right, can he?
Firstly welcome to this forum. It is good to see one so young interested in acquiring the facts.

You are very young and probably do not yet realise the full meaning of what the Church is and consequently don’t quite understand why it attracts the hate it does. The Church is Christ’s body on Earth. As such it attracts intense Christophobia which is the irrational but nonetheless deeply rooted and radically satanic hatred of God and his Church which is the root of so many lies.

The Pope is Vicar of Christ. That is an awesome burden, a hugely heavy cross to bear standing for the Lord in the world. Pope Pius was dealing with atheist evil such as had never been seen. He was attempting, very successfully, to protect the Faith, the faithul and humanity from that evil. Many Jews recognise this fact. Many historians do. Some with an fixed agenda call him Hitler’s Pope. This is an ahistorical travesty.

Be aware that much of what you read and hear is propaganda. God bless you and I hope to converse again.

May I clear something up? Both Mussolini and Hitler were baptised Catholic just as Stalin was orthodox. All were in fact atheists who explicitly rejected Christ. Hitler in his adulthood was not a Catholic or a Christian. He was a kind of humanist fundamentalist. Mussolini loathed Christianity.
 
Michael Savage had this posted on his web site a while back.

Praise for Pope Pius XII’s Stand Against Nazism and the Holocaust

“Only the Church protested against the Hitlerian onslaught on liberty. Up till then I had not been interested in the Church, but today I feel a great admiration for the Church, which alone has had the courage to struggle for spiritual truth and moral liberty.”

Albert Einstein in Time Magazine 1940, quoted in Three Popes and the Jews by Pinchas E. Lapide (New York: Hawthorn, 1967), p. 251.

“The repeated interventions of the Holy Father on behalf of Jewish Communities in Europe has evoked the profoundest sentiments of appreciation and gratitude from Jews throughout the world.”

Rabbi Maurice Perlzweig, Political director of the World Jewish Congress. Written February 18 1944 in a letter to Msgr. Amleto Cicognani, the apostolic delegate in Washington, D.C.

“In the most difficult hours of which we Jews of Romania have passed through, the generous assistance of the Holy See…was decisive and salutary. It is not easy for us to find the right words to express the warmth and consolation we experienced because of the concern of the supreme pontiff, who offered a large sum to relieve the sufferings of deported Jews…. The Jews of Romania will never forget these facts of historic importance.”

Rabbi Alexander Safran, chief rabbi of Romania note to Monsignor Andrea Cassulo, Papal Nuncio to Romania, April 7 1944

“The people of Israel will never forget what His Holiness and his illustrious delegates, inspired by the eternal principles of religion, which form the very foundation of true civilization, are doing for our unfortunate brothers and sisters in the most tragic hour of our history, which is living proof of Divine Providence in this world.”

Rabbi Isaac Herzog, chief rabbi of the British Mandate of Palestine, March 1945.

“The Church and the papacy have saved Jews as much and in as far as they could save Christians… Six million of my co-religionists have been murdered by the Nazis, but there could have been many more victims, had it not been for the efficacious intervention of Pius XII.”

Dr. Raphael Cantoni, director of the Italian Jewish Assistance Committee, American Jewish Yearbook 1944-1945, 233.

“What the Vatican did will be indelibly and eternally engraved in our hearts. Priests and even high prelates did things that will forever be an honor to Catholicism.”

Israel [Zolli], former Chief Rabbi of Rome, 1948.

“More than anyone else, we have had the opportunity to appreciate the great kindness, filled with compassion and magnanimity, that the Pope displayed during the terrible years of persecution and terror when it seemed that for us there was no longer an escape.”

Elio Toaff, Chief Rabbi of Rome, 1951.

“We share in the grief of humanity at the passing away of His Holiness Pope Pius XII. In a generation affected by wars and discords, he upheld the highest ideals of peace and compassion. When fearful martyrdom came to our people in the decade of Nazi terror, the voice of the Pope was raised for the victims. The life of our times was enriched by a voice speaking out on the great moral truths above the tumult of daily conflict. We mourn a great servant of peace.”

Golda Meir, Israeli Prime Minister, message of condolence to the Vatican, sent 1958.

"With special gratitude we remember all he has done for the persecuted Jews during one of the darkest periods in their entire history”

Nahum Goldmann, president of the World Jewish Congress, message of condolence to the Vatican, sent 1958.

“In relation to the insane behavior of the Nazis, from overlords to self-styled cogs like Eichmann, he [Pius XII] did everything humanly possible to save lives and alleviate suffering among the Jews; that a formal statement would have provoked the Nazis to brutal retaliation, and would substantially have thwarted further Catholic action on behalf of Jews.”

Dr. Joseph Lichten, a Polish Jew who served as a diplomat and later an official of the Jewish Anti-Defamation League of B’nai B’rith in Rome. Written in his book A Question of Judgment (1963)

“The papal nuncio and the bishops intervened again and again on the instructions of the pope, and that as a result of these labors in the autumn and winter of 1944, there was practically no Catholic Church institution in Budapest where persecuted Jews did not find refuge.”

Jewish historian Jeno Levai, Hungarian Jewry and the Papacy: Pius XII Did Not Remain Silent (1965).

“Pius XI had good reason to make Pacelli (the future Pius XII) the architect of his anti-Nazi policy. Of the forty-four speeches which the Nuncio Pacelli had made on German soil between 1917 and 1929, at least forty contained attacks on Nazism or condemnations of Hitler’s doctrines. Pacelli, who never met the Führer, called it ‘neo-Paganism.’”

Pinchas E. Lapide, former Israeli diplomat and Orthodox Jewish Rabbi in Three Popes and the Jews (New York: Hawthorn, 1967) p. 118.

“The Catholic Church, under the pontificate of Pope Pius XII was instrumental in saving at least 700,000, but probably as many as 860,000, Jews from certain death at Nazi hands.”

Pinchas E. Lapide, Three Popes and the Jews (1967).

“No Pope in history has been thanked more heartily by Jews. Upon his death in 1958, several suggested in open letters that a Pope Pius XII forest of 860,000 trees be planted on the hills of Judea in order to fittingly honor the memory of the late Pontiff because the Catholic Church under the pontificate of Pius XII was instrumental in saving the lives of as many as 860,000 Jews from certain death at Nazi hands.”

Pinchas E. Lapide, Three Popes and the Jews (1967).

.
 
Tell your friend that approximately 10% of the people Hitler killed in the Nazi concentration camps were Catholic, mostly priests and nuns! And he killed about three million Catholic Polish men and women, too!
 
There is more…

I told [Pope Pius XII] that my first duty was to thank him, and through him the Catholic Church, on behalf of the Jewish public for all they had done in the various countries to rescue Jews…. We are deeply grateful to the Catholic Church."

Moshe Sharett (who later became Israel’s first foreign minister and second prime minister)

“Hitler distrusted the Holy See because it hid Jews. The Germans considered the Pope as an enemy.”

Jewish historian Richard Breitman, professor at American University in Washington, D.C. Statement made in Italian newspaper “Corriere della Sera” on June 29, 2000.

“My judgment cannot but be positive. Pope Pacelli was the only one who intervened to impede the deportation of Jews on 16 October 1943, and he did very much to hide and save thousands of us. It was no small matter that he ordered the opening of cloistered convents. Without him, many of our own would not be alive.”

October 25, 2000. Michael Tagliacozzo, Jewish historian and staff member at Beth Lohame Haghettaot (Center of Studies on the Shoah and Resistance).

“The Talmud teaches that ‘whosoever preserves one life, it is accounted to him by Scripture as if he had preserved a whole world.’ More than any other twentieth-century leader, Pius XII fulfilled this Talmudic dictum, when the fate of European Jewry was at stake. No other pope had been so widely praised by Jews — and they were not mistaken. Their gratitude, as well as that of the entire generation of Holocaust survivors, testifies that Pius XII was, genuinely and profoundly, a righteous gentile.”

Rabbi David G. Dalin, Ph.D. “Pius XII and the Jews.” Weekly Standard vol. 6 no. 23 (February 26 2001).

“Never, in those tragic days, could I have foreseen, even in my wildest imaginings, that the man who, more than any other, had tried to alleviate human suffering, had spent himself day by day in his unceasing efforts for peace, would - twenty years later - be made the scapegoat for men trying to free themselves from their own responsibilities and from the collective guilt that obviously weights so heavily upon them.”

rescuer John Patrick Carroll-Abbing, in his 1965 book

“During the Nazi occupation of Rome, three thousand Jews found refuge at one time at the pope’s summer residence at Castel Gandolfo. Amazingly, Castel Gandolfo is never mentioned or discussed in the anti-papal writings of many of the pope’s critics. Yet at no other site in Nazi-occupied Europe were as many Jews saved and sheltered for as long a period as at Castel Gandolfo during the Nazi occupation of Rome. Kosher food was provided for the Jews hidden there, where, as George Weigel has noted, Jewish children were born in the private apartments of Pius XII, which became a temporary obstetrical ward.”

Rabbi David G. Dalin, Ph.D., July 29, 2005 interview with Dr. Thomas E. Woods.
 
Hello! My name is Danny I am 14 and this is my first forum post.
An older boy in my home school group told me that the Vatican City signed peace treaties with Hitler and Musolini, and that the Vatican City helped Nazis. I asked him if he was sure, and he said he was. But I just can’t belive the pope would do that!
Does anyone out there know about this? What happened?
:confused:
The issue is frankly complicated.

Yes, the Vatican cooperated with the Nazis to some extent (as many people in Nazis occupied territory did). But its hard to say to how much of it was willing cooperation and how much of it was because they knew the Nazis would do dreadful things to them if Church officials openly defied the Nazi regime.

Most of the people involved are dead now, so we may never know the full story.
 
Yes, Hitler was baptised Catholic. Although he was so against the Church. He was more of an Athiest. He never acted as a Catholic.

In a book called Hitler’s Table Talk (Adolf Hitler, London, Weidenfeld & Nicholson, 1953)
Hitler stated;

Although he did state quotes like;

He probably said things like this so that he could pollute his audience with his evil. He was a master when it came to speeches with big audiences.
  1. He was baptised Catholic, although he did not act like a Catholic.
  2. Used Christianity, specially the Church for propaganda for people to support his cause.
The Catholic Church saved alot of Jewish people. Estimated around 900,000.

This is a good article to read;
catholic.com/library/HOW_Pius_XII_PROTECTED_JEWS.asp

The Church in no way helped Hitler.

God Bless.
Hitler was not an atheist.

He may not have been a practicing Catholic, but he clearly believed that God was on his side. His book Mein Kampf is full of statements that God wants this or that for him and the German people. Since the book was written by Adolf Hitler and he actually did most of things he promised to in it (such as invading Russia, exterminating the Jews, enslaving the ‘inferior’ races, etc.) it seems like the best authority on what his intentions and beliefs actually were.

Hitler obviously did not believe in any sort of compassionate and loving god, but he clearly thought that some sort of supernatural force was behind him.
 
^ Believing God to be on your side is just that—a belief. It means nothing unless you’re actually doing what God wants and the others are persecuting you for it. It’s easy to tell if you’re doing what God wants, and Hitler clearly was not doing it.
Wasn’t aware the actions of a few priests and monks spoke for the entire Church, especially when the vast majority of priests, monks, and nuns helped the Jews and were persecuted by Nazis, and especially when the Pope himself who denounced Hitler and directed Catholics to aid those he persecuted.
 
^ Believing God to be on your side is just that—a belief. It means nothing unless you’re actually doing what God wants and the others are persecuting you for it. It’s easy to tell if you’re doing what God wants, and Hitler clearly was not doing it.

Wasn’t aware the actions of a few priests and monks spoke for the entire Church, especially when the vast majority of priests, monks, and nuns helped the Jews and were persecuted by Nazis, and especially when the Pope himself who denounced Hitler and directed Catholics to aid those he persecuted.
My point was, he was not an atheist because he believed in supernatural forces.

Not believing in the Christian God doesn’t automatically make you an atheist. Otherwise there would be no Muslims, Jews, Hindus, Buddhists, etc.
 
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