Was the excommunication of Martin Luther lifted?

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Is it true that John Paul ll lifted the excommunication of Martin Luther? I read this recently and was unsure. I figured I’d ask my Catholic family.
 
latinmass said:
Is it true that John Paul ll lifted the excommunication of Martin Luther? I read this recently and was unsure. I figured I’d ask my Catholic family.
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Can you tell us where you read it? If it was on the internet, please provide a link.
I haven’t heard anything about this, but I think excommunication only applies to living people, so you can’t lift an excommuncation after the person is dead. It wouldn’t make sense. However, it could be determined after death that a particular excommuniation was invalid for some reason. I don’t think that was case with Martin Luther, however.
 
latinmass said:
Is it true that John Paul ll lifted the excommunication of Martin Luther? I read this recently and was unsure. I figured I’d ask my Catholic family.
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No.

And it would only happen the same day it was lifted on men like Arius and Pelagius. (ie. Never)
 
I remember reading some nice things JPII said about Luther. And Luther wasn’t wrong about everything. Let’s be fair. There really were problems. But lifting the excommunication? No way.
 
WestonGrant said:
I remember reading some nice things JPII said about Luther. And Luther wasn’t wrong about everything. Let’s be fair. There really were problems. But lifting the excommunication? No way.
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I heard the point made on this forum recently that Luther proposed 95 theses, but Pope Leo’s condemnation only listed 41 points. It only takes one error to make a heresy, though…
 
cam100 said:
I heard the point made on this forum recently that Luther proposed 95 theses, but Pope Leo’s condemnation only listed 41 points. It only takes one error to make a heresy, though…
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Pope Leo X’s Bull came later than the theses after Luther began spinning out of control and professing additional errors. The number of bad theses in the 95 is probably even less than 41.
 
No, Luther wasn’t wrong about everything. But neither are Hindus, Shintoists, Muslims, pagans, etc.

Even a broken clock is right twice a day. So what?
 
cam100 said:
Can you tell us where you read it? If it was on the internet, please provide a link.
I haven’t heard anything about this, but I think excommunication only applies to living people, so you can’t lift an excommuncation after the person is dead. It wouldn’t make sense. However, it could be determined after death that a particular excommuniation was invalid for some reason. I don’t think that was case with Martin Luther, however.
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The site is:
www.trosch.org/jpi/history-ref-jp2.htm

The mention of JP2 being the first pope not to take the specific papal oath shown is interesting also. There are facts in this article, I don’t know about all of it though like these I mentioned.
 
latinmass said:
The site is:
www.trosch.org/jpi/history-ref-jp2.htm

The mention of JP2 being the first pope not to take the specific papal oath shown is interesting also. There are facts in this article, I don’t know about all of it though like these I mentioned.
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I wouldn’t take this website seriously. The first page consists mostly of an article by Brother Dimond of the Most Holy Family Monastery, which twists facts, repeats misinformation, and draws erroneous conclusions. There are a number of threads on this forum, both current and old, that deal with this organization and its teachings.
 
Excommunications can indeed be posthumously … well, declared wrongful, if not formally lifted (an invalid excommunication isn’t binding in the first place).

Prime example is St Joan of Arc, who died excommunicate. Of course the bishop who did so was in league with her English opponents, so it was easy to see he could’ve had corrupt motives.

But I do think it’d be a VERY cold day in heck before Brother Martin gets his excommunication lifted.
 
After the Church signed the Joint Declarations with the Lutherans there were rumors that the excommunication of Luther had been lifted. It hasn’t been lifted as far as I know.

JOINT DECLARATION
ON THE DOCTRINE OF JUSTIFICATION
by the Lutheran World Federation
and the Catholic Church
vatican.va/roman_curia/pontifical_councils/chrstuni/documents/rc_pc_chrstuni_doc_31101999_cath-luth-joint-declaration_en.html
5.The present Joint Declaration has this intention: namely, to show that on the basis of their dialogue the subscribing Lutheran churches and the Roman Catholic Church[9] are now able to articulate a common understanding of our justification by God’s grace through faith in Christ. It does not cover all that either church teaches about justification; it does encompass a consensus on basic truths of the doctrine of justification and shows that the remaining differences in its explication are no longer the occasion for doctrinal condemnations.
 
stmaria said:
After the Church signed the Joint Declarations with the Lutherans there were rumors that the excommunication of Luther had been lifted. It hasn’t been lifted as far as I know.

JOINT DECLARATION
ON THE DOCTRINE OF JUSTIFICATION
by the Lutheran World Federation
and the Catholic Church
vatican.va/roman_curia/pontifical_councils/chrstuni/documents/rc_pc_chrstuni_doc_31101999_cath-luth-joint-declaration_en.html
5.The present Joint Declaration has this intention: namely, to show that on the basis of their dialogue the subscribing Lutheran churches and the Roman Catholic Church[9] are now able to articulate a common understanding of our justification by God’s grace through faith in Christ. It does not cover all that either church teaches about justification; it does encompass a consensus on basic truths of the doctrine of justification and shows that the remaining differences in its explication are no longer the occasion for doctrinal condemnations.
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Here is a clarification on it which highlights the remaining differences:
vatican.va/roman_curia/pontifical_councils/chrstuni/documents/rc_pc_chrstuni_doc_01081998_off-answer-catholic_en.html
 
Genesis315 said:
Here is a clarification on it which highlights the remaining differences:
vatican.va/roman_curia/pontifical_councils/chrstuni/documents/rc_pc_chrstuni_doc_01081998_off-answer-catholic_en.html
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What exactly was the level of authority, if any, of the Joint Declaration in the first place? It always seemed a bit off to me - and the document you cite above (which I hadn’t seen before)seems to have some problems with it, and the note on the bottom of it says:
*This Note, which constitutes the official Catholic Response to the text of the Joint Declaration, has been prepared by common agreement between the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith and the Pontifical Council for Promoting Christian Unity. It is signed by the President of the same Pontifical Council, which is directly responsible for the ecumenical dialogue. *
If the document you cite was an “official Catholic response” to the Joint Declaration - what exactly was the Joint Declaration - something put out by private Catholic & Lutherna theologins?

Thanks, and Peace in Christ,

DustinsDad
 
LilyM said:
Excommunications can indeed be posthumously … well, declared wrongful, if not formally lifted (an invalid excommunication isn’t binding in the first place).

Prime example is St Joan of Arc, who died excommunicate. Of course the bishop who did so was in league with her English opponents, so it was easy to see he could’ve had corrupt motives.

But I do think it’d be a VERY cold day in heck before Brother Martin gets his excommunication lifted.
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Hey, Dante Alighieri mentioned that the lowest level in heck (where HE is) IS freezing cold…😃

As for the topic: I guess it’s not possible unless Luther comes back from the dead and make a public recantation.
 
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