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q54332
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If you are debating the existence of God or the real presences what kind of objections would you expect to get and what are the best ones, and how would you refute the objection?
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What are the strongest objections to Eucharistic miracles and how do you refute them?
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Veritas6
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For the existence of God I hear a lot about “science refutes this or that”, but science cannot even “work” without first the assumption of change in the world. Change is a fundamental metaphysic of the world that cannot be proven or disproven by science, only by philosophy.
When it comes to Eucharistic miracles, I think we first need to convince someone God exists before we can prove miracles occur. Any ignorant person can belittle the Eucharist as a delusion, but they themselves probably hold delusional ideas about the God they reject.
When it comes to Eucharistic miracles, I think we first need to convince someone God exists before we can prove miracles occur. Any ignorant person can belittle the Eucharist as a delusion, but they themselves probably hold delusional ideas about the God they reject.
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ProdglArchitect
Guest
The only arguments I’ve heard against them are:
“That’s just not possible.” This misses the point of calling it a miracle.
“It’s just mold.” There have been a couple potential cases I’ve heard of that wound up being mold, but once that’s discovered they are no longer held up as miraculous.
“The priest switched out the Eucharist with something else to fool people.” - While you could technically claim this against pre-scientific miracles, modern instances of Eucharistic miracles have been examined in double-blind studies and proven to be genuine human tissue. What’s more, the blood types have been consistent, and at least two studies have found that the flesh from the miracle is from a human heart under extreme duress. The fact that modern miracles can be shown to be real lends validity to historical miracles, so I don’t buy this argument for most cases.
“That’s just not possible.” This misses the point of calling it a miracle.
“It’s just mold.” There have been a couple potential cases I’ve heard of that wound up being mold, but once that’s discovered they are no longer held up as miraculous.
“The priest switched out the Eucharist with something else to fool people.” - While you could technically claim this against pre-scientific miracles, modern instances of Eucharistic miracles have been examined in double-blind studies and proven to be genuine human tissue. What’s more, the blood types have been consistent, and at least two studies have found that the flesh from the miracle is from a human heart under extreme duress. The fact that modern miracles can be shown to be real lends validity to historical miracles, so I don’t buy this argument for most cases.
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0Scarlett_nidiyilii
Guest
It’s not a good idea to base your faith on miracles.
A miracle can strengthen your faith or lead one to ask questions that lead to faith, however
A miracle can strengthen your faith or lead one to ask questions that lead to faith, however
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TheLittleLady
Guest
Eucharistic Miracles are matters of private devotion. This is not a hill I’d battle on.
Christ never said “let your refutations be so strong before men that they see your good arguments and glorify your Father in heaven”.
He said “let your light so shine that they see your good works and glorify…”
Transubstantiation is a miracle that comes after knowing, and trusting God and the Church.
Work on that.
For talking with atheists in a civil, rational way, read the book list and articles at:
Christ never said “let your refutations be so strong before men that they see your good arguments and glorify your Father in heaven”.
He said “let your light so shine that they see your good works and glorify…”
Transubstantiation is a miracle that comes after knowing, and trusting God and the Church.
Work on that.
For talking with atheists in a civil, rational way, read the book list and articles at:
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annad347
Guest
However what?however
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0Scarlett_nidiyilii
Guest
In other words, there are many reasons and arguments to defend the idea that there is a God, a Creator of the Universe. They derive from observation and logic.
Miracles are among the weakest arguments, however, people have been lead to faith through them.
But even people who had seen Jesus’ healings and signs walked away from Him for various reasons.
Miracles are among the weakest arguments, however, people have been lead to faith through them.
But even people who had seen Jesus’ healings and signs walked away from Him for various reasons.
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annad347
Guest
Oh okay, it just looked like you had more to say after the however… because what you said is true
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