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CalCatholic
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I like the Little Rock Catholic Study Bible! Here is a review from the Catholic Bibles Blog: www.catholicbibles.blogspot.com/2011/06/guest-review-little-rock-catholic-study.html
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David2010
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I recommend the Douay Rheims too.
If you are comfortable with the King James version, you should be comfortable with the Douay Rheims
Do not get a Good News version. That is one of the few Bibles a priest once told me specifically NOT to get. Apparently it is one of the loosest (most inaccurate) translations.
Actually, there is a little booklet that may interest you. I recently reviewed it in the “Book Club” section of these forums:
“Which Bible Should You Read?”
You should be able to find it in a local Catholic bookstore. It compares ten Bibles and is very informative. I think you’d find it good reading.
If you are comfortable with the King James version, you should be comfortable with the Douay Rheims
Do not get a Good News version. That is one of the few Bibles a priest once told me specifically NOT to get. Apparently it is one of the loosest (most inaccurate) translations.
Actually, there is a little booklet that may interest you. I recently reviewed it in the “Book Club” section of these forums:
“Which Bible Should You Read?”
You should be able to find it in a local Catholic bookstore. It compares ten Bibles and is very informative. I think you’d find it good reading.
M
Mr_Smith
Guest
Hi Patrick,IMHO the original 1572 Rheims NT-1609/10 Douai OT beats the Challoner.
Can you please “talk” about this a bit more I have read this page on Wikipedia, I know hardly a scholarly source but they are saying…
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Douay-Rheims_Bible
I am genuinely interested in this subject as without learning Hebrew, Greek and Latin I would like to obtain a Bible that is in its truest form, in the bounds of translation into the English language.Much of the text of the 1582/1610 bible, however, employed a densely latinate vocabulary, to the extent of being in places unreadable; and consequently this translation was replaced by a revision undertaken by bishop Richard Challoner; the New Testament in three editions 1749, 1750, and 1752; the Old Testament (minus the Vulgate apocrypha)
P
patrick457
Guest
Just as the page says, the reason why the translators of the Rheims NT and the Douai OT employed such a woodenly literal translation method is because of their belief that the original texts should be rendered as faithfully as possible, even if it means preserving the ambiguities present in the source texts and producing a stilted, ungrammatical translation as a result. This was in fact their point of contention with previous Protestant English translations: they felt that they had improperly imputed clear meanings for obscure passages in the originals by translating them in clear and understandable English, where the Latin Vulgate - which they used - had often tended to render the Greek literalistically, even to the extent of generating improper Latin constructions.Hi Patrick,
Can you please “talk” about this a bit more I have read this page on Wikipedia, I know hardly a scholarly source but they are saying…
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Douay-Rheims_Bible
I am genuinely interested in this subject as without learning Hebrew, Greek and Latin I would like to obtain a Bible that is in its truest form, in the bounds of translation into the English language.
In effect the translators argue that where the source text is hard to understand, then a faithful English translation should also be ambiguous or obscure lest “the sense of the holy Ghost” be missed, with various options for understanding the text given somewhere else, such as in a marginal note.
IN THIS OVR TRANSLATION, because we wish it to be most sincere, as becometh a Catholike translation, and haue endeuoured so to make it: we are very precise & religious in folowing our copie, the old vulgar approued Latin: not only in sense, which we hope we alwaies doe, but sometimes in the very words also and phrases, which may seeme to the vulgar Reader and to common English eares not yet acquainted therewith, rudenesse or ignorance: but to the discrete Reader that deeply weigheth and considereth the importance of sacred wordes and speaches, and how easily the voluntarie Translatour may misse the true sense of the Holy Ghost, we doubt not but our consideration and doing therein, shal seeme reasonable and necessarie: yea and that al sortes of Catholike Readers wil in short time thinke that familiar, which at the first may seeme strange, and wil esteeme it more, when they shal* [Note at margin: *See the laste Table at the end of the booke.] otherwise be taught to vnderstand it, then if it were the common knowen English. …] Moreouer, we presume not in hard places to mollifie the speaches or phrases, but religiously keepe them word for word, and point for point, for fear of missing, or restraining the sense of the holy Ghost to our phantasie.
P
patrick457
Guest
For a small sample, here’s Mark 14:12-52 from the Rheims NT (spelling modernized):
And the first day of the Azymes when they sacrificed the Pasch, the Disciples say to him, Wither wilt thou that we go, and prepare for thee to eat the Pasch? And he sendeth two of his Disciples, and saith to them, Go ye into the city: and there shall meet you a man carrying a pitcher of water, follow him: and whithersoever he entreth, say to the master of the house, that the Master saith, Where is my refectory, where I may eat the Pasch with my Disciples? And he will shew you a great chamber, adorned: and there prepare for us. And his Disciples went their ways, and came into the city: and they found as he had told them, and they prepared the Pasch.
And when even was come, he cometh with the Twelve. And when they were sitting at the table and eating, Jesus said, Amen I say to you, that one of you shall betray me, he that eateth with me. But they began to be sad, and to say to him severally, Is it I? Who said to them, One of the Twelve, he that dippeth with me his hand in the dish. And the Son of man indeed goeth, as it is written of him, but woe to that man by whom the Son of man shall be betrayed. It were good for him, if that man had not been born.
And whilst they were eating, Jesus took bread: and blessing brake, and gave to them, and said, Take, this is my body. And taking the chalice, giving thanks he gave to them, and they all drank of it. And he said to them, This is my blood of the new testament, that shall be shed for many. Amen I say to you, that now I will not drink of the fruit of the vine until that day when I shall drink it new in the kingdom of God. And an hymn being said, they went forth into Mount-olivet.
And Jesus saith to them, You shall all be scandalized in me in this night: for it is written, I will strike the Pastor, and the sheep shall be dispersed. But after that I shall be risen again, I will go before you into Galilee. And Peter said to him, Although all shall be scandalized: yet not I. And Jesus saith to him, Amen I say to thee, that thou this day in this night, before the cock crow twice, shalt thrice deny me. But he spake more vehemently, Although I should die together with thee, I will not deny thee. And in like manner also said they all.
And they come into a farm-place called Gethsemani. And he saith to his Disciples, Sit you here, until I pray. And he taketh Peter and James and John vvith him: and he began to fear and to be heavy. And he saith to them, My soul is sorrowful even unto death: stay here, and watch. And when he was gone forward a litle, he fell flat upon the ground: and he prayed that if it might be, the hour might pass from him: and he said, Abba, Father, all things are possible to thee, transfer this chalice from me. But not that which I will, but that which thou. And he cometh, and findeth them sleeping. And he saith to Peter, Simon, sleepest thou? Couldst thou not watch one hour? Watch ye, and pray that you enter not into temptation. The spirit indeed is prompt, but the flesh infirm. And going away again, he prayed, saying the selfsame word. And returning, again he found them asleep (for their eyes were heavy) and they wist not what they should answer him. And he cometh the third time, and saith to them, Sleep ye now, and take rest, it sufficeth, the hour is come: behold the Son of man shall be betrayed into the hands of sinners. Arise, let us go. Behold, he that shall betray me, is at hand.
And as he was yet speaking, cometh Judas Iscariot one of the Twelve, and with him a great multitude with swords and clubs, from the chief Priests and the Scribes and the Ancients. And the betrayer of him had given them a sign, saying, Whomsoever I shall kiss, it is he, lay hold on him, and lead him warily. And when he was come, immediately going to him, he saith, Rabbi, and he kissed him. But they laid hands upon him: and held him. And one certain man of the standers about, drawing out a sword, smote the servant of the chief priest, and cut off his ear. And Jesus answering, said to them, As to a thief are you come out with swords and clubs to apprehend me? I was daily with you in the temple teaching, and you did not lay hands on me. But, that the Scriptures may be fulfilled. Then his disciples leaving him, all fled. And a certain young man followed him clothed with sindon upon the bare: and they took him. But he casting off the sindon, fled from them naked.
And the first day of the Azymes when they sacrificed the Pasch, the Disciples say to him, Wither wilt thou that we go, and prepare for thee to eat the Pasch? And he sendeth two of his Disciples, and saith to them, Go ye into the city: and there shall meet you a man carrying a pitcher of water, follow him: and whithersoever he entreth, say to the master of the house, that the Master saith, Where is my refectory, where I may eat the Pasch with my Disciples? And he will shew you a great chamber, adorned: and there prepare for us. And his Disciples went their ways, and came into the city: and they found as he had told them, and they prepared the Pasch.
And when even was come, he cometh with the Twelve. And when they were sitting at the table and eating, Jesus said, Amen I say to you, that one of you shall betray me, he that eateth with me. But they began to be sad, and to say to him severally, Is it I? Who said to them, One of the Twelve, he that dippeth with me his hand in the dish. And the Son of man indeed goeth, as it is written of him, but woe to that man by whom the Son of man shall be betrayed. It were good for him, if that man had not been born.
And whilst they were eating, Jesus took bread: and blessing brake, and gave to them, and said, Take, this is my body. And taking the chalice, giving thanks he gave to them, and they all drank of it. And he said to them, This is my blood of the new testament, that shall be shed for many. Amen I say to you, that now I will not drink of the fruit of the vine until that day when I shall drink it new in the kingdom of God. And an hymn being said, they went forth into Mount-olivet.
And Jesus saith to them, You shall all be scandalized in me in this night: for it is written, I will strike the Pastor, and the sheep shall be dispersed. But after that I shall be risen again, I will go before you into Galilee. And Peter said to him, Although all shall be scandalized: yet not I. And Jesus saith to him, Amen I say to thee, that thou this day in this night, before the cock crow twice, shalt thrice deny me. But he spake more vehemently, Although I should die together with thee, I will not deny thee. And in like manner also said they all.
And they come into a farm-place called Gethsemani. And he saith to his Disciples, Sit you here, until I pray. And he taketh Peter and James and John vvith him: and he began to fear and to be heavy. And he saith to them, My soul is sorrowful even unto death: stay here, and watch. And when he was gone forward a litle, he fell flat upon the ground: and he prayed that if it might be, the hour might pass from him: and he said, Abba, Father, all things are possible to thee, transfer this chalice from me. But not that which I will, but that which thou. And he cometh, and findeth them sleeping. And he saith to Peter, Simon, sleepest thou? Couldst thou not watch one hour? Watch ye, and pray that you enter not into temptation. The spirit indeed is prompt, but the flesh infirm. And going away again, he prayed, saying the selfsame word. And returning, again he found them asleep (for their eyes were heavy) and they wist not what they should answer him. And he cometh the third time, and saith to them, Sleep ye now, and take rest, it sufficeth, the hour is come: behold the Son of man shall be betrayed into the hands of sinners. Arise, let us go. Behold, he that shall betray me, is at hand.
And as he was yet speaking, cometh Judas Iscariot one of the Twelve, and with him a great multitude with swords and clubs, from the chief Priests and the Scribes and the Ancients. And the betrayer of him had given them a sign, saying, Whomsoever I shall kiss, it is he, lay hold on him, and lead him warily. And when he was come, immediately going to him, he saith, Rabbi, and he kissed him. But they laid hands upon him: and held him. And one certain man of the standers about, drawing out a sword, smote the servant of the chief priest, and cut off his ear. And Jesus answering, said to them, As to a thief are you come out with swords and clubs to apprehend me? I was daily with you in the temple teaching, and you did not lay hands on me. But, that the Scriptures may be fulfilled. Then his disciples leaving him, all fled. And a certain young man followed him clothed with sindon upon the bare: and they took him. But he casting off the sindon, fled from them naked.
P
patrick457
Guest
And now, a little of St. Paul. Romans 5 (again, modernized spelling):
Being justified therefore by faith, let us have peace toward God by our Lord Jesus Christ: by whom also we have access through faith into this grace wherein we stand, and glory, in the hope of the glory of the sons of God. And not only this: but also we glory in tribulations, knowing that tribulation worketh patience: and patience, probation: and probation, hope, and hope confoundeth not: because the charity of God is poured forth in our hearts, by the holy Ghost which is given us. +
For why did Christ, when we as yet were weak, according to the time die for the impious? For, scarce for a just man doth any die: for perhaps for a good man durst some man die. But God commendeth his charity in us: because, when as yet we were sinners, Christ died for us. Much more therefore now being justified in his blood, shall we be saved from wrath by him. For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son: much more being reconciled, shall we be saved in the life of him. And not only this: but also we glory in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom now we have received reconciliation.
Therefore, as by one man sin entered into this world, and by sin death: and so unto all men death did pass, in which all sinned. For even unto the Law sin was in the world: but sin was not imputed, when the law was not. But death reigned from Adam unto Moyses, even on them also that sinned not after the similitude of the prevarication of Adam, who is a figure of him to come.
But not as the offence, so also the gift, for if by the offence of one, many died: much more the grace of God and the gift, in the grace of one man Jesus Christ, hath abounded upon many. And not as by one sin, so also the gift, for judgement indeed is of one, to condemnation: but grace is of many offences, to justification. For if in the offence of one, death reigned by one: much more they that receive the abundance of grace and of donation and of justice, shall reign in life by one, Jesus Christ.
Therefore as by the offence of one, unto all men to condemnation: so also by the justice of one, unto all men to justification of life. For as by the disobedience of one man, many were made sinners: so also by the obedience of one, many shall be made just. But the Law entered in, that sin might abound. And where sin abounded, grace did more abound, that as sin reigned to death: so also grace may reign by justice to life everlasting, through Jesus Christ our Lord.
Ephesians 3:
For this cause, I Paul the prisoner of Jesus Christ, for you Gentiles: if yet you have heard the dispensation of the grace of God, which is given me toward you, because according to revelation the sacrament was made known to me, as I have written before in brief: according as you reading may understand my wisdom in the mystery of Christ, which unto other generations was not known to the sons of men, as now it is revealed to his holy Apostles and Prophets in the Spirit.
The Gentiles to be co-heirs and concorporate and comparticipant of his promise in Christ Jesus by the Gospel: whereof I am made a minister according to the gift of the grace of God, which is given me according to the operation of his power. To me the least of all the saints is given this grace, among the Gentiles to evangelize the unsearchable riches of Christ, and to illuminate all men what is the dispensation of the sacrament hidden from worlds in God, who created all things: that the manifold wisdom of God, may be notified to the Princes and Potestates in the celestials by the Church, according to the prefinition of worlds, which he made in Christ Jesus our Lord. In whom we have affiance and access in confidence, by the faith of him.
For the which cause I desire that you faint not in my tribulations for you, which is your glory. For this cause I bow my knees to the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, of whom all paternity in the heavens and in earth is named, that he give you according to the riches of his glory, power to be fortified by his Spirit in the inner man. Christ to dwell by faith in your hearts, rooted and founded in charity, that you may be able to comprehend with all the saints, what is the breadth, and length, and height, and depth, to know also the charity of Christ, surpassing knowledge, that you may be filled unto all the fullness of God. And to him that is able to do all things more abundantly than we desire or understand, according to the power that worketh in us: to him be glory in the Church, and in Christ Jesus, unto all generations world without end. Amen.
Being justified therefore by faith, let us have peace toward God by our Lord Jesus Christ: by whom also we have access through faith into this grace wherein we stand, and glory, in the hope of the glory of the sons of God. And not only this: but also we glory in tribulations, knowing that tribulation worketh patience: and patience, probation: and probation, hope, and hope confoundeth not: because the charity of God is poured forth in our hearts, by the holy Ghost which is given us. +
For why did Christ, when we as yet were weak, according to the time die for the impious? For, scarce for a just man doth any die: for perhaps for a good man durst some man die. But God commendeth his charity in us: because, when as yet we were sinners, Christ died for us. Much more therefore now being justified in his blood, shall we be saved from wrath by him. For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son: much more being reconciled, shall we be saved in the life of him. And not only this: but also we glory in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom now we have received reconciliation.
Therefore, as by one man sin entered into this world, and by sin death: and so unto all men death did pass, in which all sinned. For even unto the Law sin was in the world: but sin was not imputed, when the law was not. But death reigned from Adam unto Moyses, even on them also that sinned not after the similitude of the prevarication of Adam, who is a figure of him to come.
But not as the offence, so also the gift, for if by the offence of one, many died: much more the grace of God and the gift, in the grace of one man Jesus Christ, hath abounded upon many. And not as by one sin, so also the gift, for judgement indeed is of one, to condemnation: but grace is of many offences, to justification. For if in the offence of one, death reigned by one: much more they that receive the abundance of grace and of donation and of justice, shall reign in life by one, Jesus Christ.
Therefore as by the offence of one, unto all men to condemnation: so also by the justice of one, unto all men to justification of life. For as by the disobedience of one man, many were made sinners: so also by the obedience of one, many shall be made just. But the Law entered in, that sin might abound. And where sin abounded, grace did more abound, that as sin reigned to death: so also grace may reign by justice to life everlasting, through Jesus Christ our Lord.
Ephesians 3:
For this cause, I Paul the prisoner of Jesus Christ, for you Gentiles: if yet you have heard the dispensation of the grace of God, which is given me toward you, because according to revelation the sacrament was made known to me, as I have written before in brief: according as you reading may understand my wisdom in the mystery of Christ, which unto other generations was not known to the sons of men, as now it is revealed to his holy Apostles and Prophets in the Spirit.
The Gentiles to be co-heirs and concorporate and comparticipant of his promise in Christ Jesus by the Gospel: whereof I am made a minister according to the gift of the grace of God, which is given me according to the operation of his power. To me the least of all the saints is given this grace, among the Gentiles to evangelize the unsearchable riches of Christ, and to illuminate all men what is the dispensation of the sacrament hidden from worlds in God, who created all things: that the manifold wisdom of God, may be notified to the Princes and Potestates in the celestials by the Church, according to the prefinition of worlds, which he made in Christ Jesus our Lord. In whom we have affiance and access in confidence, by the faith of him.
For the which cause I desire that you faint not in my tribulations for you, which is your glory. For this cause I bow my knees to the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, of whom all paternity in the heavens and in earth is named, that he give you according to the riches of his glory, power to be fortified by his Spirit in the inner man. Christ to dwell by faith in your hearts, rooted and founded in charity, that you may be able to comprehend with all the saints, what is the breadth, and length, and height, and depth, to know also the charity of Christ, surpassing knowledge, that you may be filled unto all the fullness of God. And to him that is able to do all things more abundantly than we desire or understand, according to the power that worketh in us: to him be glory in the Church, and in Christ Jesus, unto all generations world without end. Amen.
J
JRRTFAN
Guest
Yes, Mike I have heard of it and done 1 and 2 Sam with it. It is, in my opinion, awful. There are a lot better studies around, Catholic Scripture Study International, Jeff Cavins “Great Adventure”, the Ignatius Press individual Scripture books are all good studies with questions. Little Rock is as close to being a BAD Protestant Bible study as you can get. I say bad because it is quite Protestant but no Protestant worth his salt would endorse it. It’s put together by Collegeville, which I consider a training ground for liturgical terrorists, Kumbaya and felt banners almost leap from the pages.Has anyone heard of the Little Rock Catholic Study Bible? If so, what are your thoughts.
Currently I have been using the New American with KJV and the Douy Rheims as a back up for references.
I also think I may buy the NJB. Relatively cheap on half.com.
Please let me know what your thoughts are on the Little Rock Catholic Bible, thank you!
Mike
littlerockscripture.org/en/Features.aspx?ID=148
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