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FCEGM
Guest
:nope: They are God’s messengers to us, not our messengers to Him. This is not a point of East-West conflict.
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DavidKays
Guest
I am glad you do sir. And If you were more informative about us I will use any language I believe will be helpful. You are not informed at all about us. I bring useful information and I am sorry you believe this not to be so. I am not your superior sir but an equal. It is sad that you cannot except us as we truly are. The Orthodox Church will one day be shown as she truly is. She will have her day. Too long have the Catholic Church not recognized her. God will by His providence return the OC to her rightful place alongside Rome as an equal. He is tired by these statements that the OC needs to be corrected. Soon you will see that the OC were right all along and the Popes will acknowledge this. Even John Paul II has formally apologized to the East for all the wrongful actions Rome has committed against the Orthodox. Time will come when the Truth will be revealed and the Orthodox will have her status restored as in the Early Church. No longer will we have to hear people who are so un-informed and the dialogue between the 2 Churches will be established as it was in the Early Church. The Truth sir is this. It is Rome that has deviated from God’s original plan for the Church and soon you see Rome come back to her original place that she had in the Early Church. The OC has always pleased God in her understanding of her role in governing the Church from the early days. However it is Rome that has displeased God for she decided to go on her own way without the East. The Popes have discovered this and are trying to rectify this problem. They have initiated the process of reconciliation and soon you will discover that the OC were always right and that the Church of Rome was the one in need of correction. God Bless!
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MtnDwellar
Guest
You are probably right! I really didn’t think that it was a point of East-West conflict. I know that angels will petition God on our behalf. I took that to mean that they were bringing messages in both directions.
I still do not know whether angels hear our silent prayers. For that matter, do saints hear our silent prayers? If the answer is yes, then it will mean that they can read our thoughts.
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Samson01
Guest
This sparks an interest in me. Is there any prayers that should be said aloud, thinking of the office by clergy…?
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exoflare
Guest
Regarding silent prayers to angels, this is different because they are only able to “hear” those of our thoughts that we willingly direct to them. It’s not like they can read our minds in the general sense.I have also read that demons cannot read thoughts. I am not sure if I believe it. It may be wishful thinking.I know that angels can read our thoughts, in terms of silent prayers.
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Samson01
Guest
Is this fact, respectfully, I’m interested. Aquines write on this or someone else?
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MtnDwellar
Guest
Do they hear our prayers directly? Or, is it like our Eastern friend said? Are our thoughts directed to them from God?
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BluesPicker
Guest
All I know is that our active thoughts can be detected by electronic instruments to some extent. Your Guardian Angel is united to you by God. Many times I ask that my prayers be carried to the Throne of God. I can only tell you that the devil can impinge thoughts onto your mind ie. temptations. From my experience he can’t hear when you Pray and can’t hear when God speaks to you.
"Then listen well you Christians; the Mother of Jesus Christ is all powerful and she can save her servants from falling into hell. She is the Sun which destroys the darkness of our wiles and subtlety. It is she who uncovers our hidden plots, breaks our snares and makes our temptations useless and ineffectual.
"We have to say, however reluctantly, that not a single soul who has really persevered in her service has ever been damned with us; one single sigh that she offers to the Blessed Trinity is worth far more than all the prayers, desires and aspirations of all the saints.
"We fear her more than all the other saints in heaven together and we have no success with her faithful servants. Many Christians who call upon her when they are at the hour of death and who really ought to be damned according to our ordinary standards are saved by her intercession.
"Oh if only that Mary (it is thus in their fury that they called her) had not pitted her strength against ours and had not upset our plans, we should have conquered the Church and should have destroyed it long before this; and we would have seen to it that all the Orders in the Church fell into error and disorder.
“Now that we are forced to speak we must also tell you this: nobody who perseveres in saying the Rosary will be damned, because she obtains for her servants the grace of true contrition for their sins and by means of this they obtain God’s forgiveness and mercy.”
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I know that Satan fears one Saint greatly and this Saint has power over him. Here the devils in a man confessing to St. Dominic of this Saint:"We have to say, however reluctantly, that not a single soul who has really persevered in her service has ever been damned with us; one single sigh that she offers to the Blessed Trinity is worth far more than all the prayers, desires and aspirations of all the saints.
"We fear her more than all the other saints in heaven together and we have no success with her faithful servants. Many Christians who call upon her when they are at the hour of death and who really ought to be damned according to our ordinary standards are saved by her intercession.
"Oh if only that Mary (it is thus in their fury that they called her) had not pitted her strength against ours and had not upset our plans, we should have conquered the Church and should have destroyed it long before this; and we would have seen to it that all the Orders in the Church fell into error and disorder.
“Now that we are forced to speak we must also tell you this: nobody who perseveres in saying the Rosary will be damned, because she obtains for her servants the grace of true contrition for their sins and by means of this they obtain God’s forgiveness and mercy.”
They are speaking of our Blessed Mother.
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exoflare
Guest
In all honesty, this has just been my implicit understanding for a very long time and I don’t remember exactly where it was that I first read it or heard it. It just makes sense to me anyway since this is how spirits communicate amongst themselves (through their thoughts) even though they may not necessarily be able to read each other’s minds completely.
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exoflare
Guest
I don’t know, but I don’t think it matters anyway. To me it sounds like a distinction without a difference. Ultimately, everything that any created being ever does is through God in some way or form since it is only through God that we even continue to exist out of nothingness from moment to moment.
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MtnDwellar
Guest
It matters only because we are discussing whether angels and demons can “hear” our thoughts.
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Samson01
Guest
IMHO angels may know what they are allowed to know by God so they can better serve Him. On the other hand, fallen angels may hear sinful thoughts and know there own…
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GaryTaylor
Guest
Exactly, and through this very ideal that detestable demon is able to destroy souls.
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BluesPicker
Guest
I know that Aquinas said “No” the devil can’t read your mind. However, now we know that brain waves can be detected and even some lie dector being devised with different centers of the brain being activated. Some exorcists are convinced that they can hear active thoughts with no access to stored memories. They apparently don’t even know the State of Grace of even the most hardened sinners because many times they are fooled. But they can’t hear you praying to God. And they can’t hear God.
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I guess we don't know because exorcisms are poor sources of knowledge or theology. I believe the mind is layered like an oninon and they can hear to a limited extent. Then others would say they read your actions. They cause bad dreams. And in these dreams if you pray they go.
I don't think it matters. What matters is our relantionship with God and State of Grace.
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BluesPicker
Guest
Oh, I meant to say that I don’t believe that demons can hear when the Holy Spirit when He gives us Inspiration or Word of Knowledge. They obviously can hear God when God rebukes or fusses at them. That must be a terrible thing when the Lord God of all Creation fusses at something or some one.
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