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pensmama87
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KnitNut, I just want to say I really appreciate your phrase “high-performing butts.” 
To us, it means providing a classical Catholic education for ourselves, children and parents learning together. Both parents teaching, using Catholic materials, including teacher manuals where appropriate. The only secular source we use is Saxon Math. We do our own field trips as a family. We incorporate playing outside with neighbors and park days with other homeschool families for fun and fresh air. We do religious education with the parish, in addition to religious studies and catechism memorization work that we do as a family at home. Next year, we hope to be able to do more, but we have been through a rough year and we are trying to build up our health and wellbeing and develop solid routines this year. At some point, we intend to learn a musical instrument as a family, maybe guitar, but we are starting with recorders this year.
So for us, it is more of a holistic lifestyle approach, relying upon wonderful curriculum that suits us, but creating our own lessons and assessments as appropriate, and making learning a family endeavor. Also, incorporating hobbies and interests as subjects/samples for their portfolios, instead of leaving those for outside of “school” boundaries. But above all, maintaining as our focus the purpose of man, “to know, love, and serve God in this life, and to be happy with Him forever in Heaven.”
When you get tired of paying all that tuition for classes that need to be supplemented, you should try homeschoolingThis isn’t really my turf, but I have been struck by the fact that our family does a number of things that I’ve heard homeschoolers mention.
I got deeply into the school curriculum wars about 9 years ago and used to hang out a lot with the excellent Kitchen Table Math online community–it was an “afterschooler” community at the time of parents talking about their kids’ school work and how to survive middle school. (Our oldest was just starting pre-K at the time.) One of the things I learned from my time with the math wars parents is the need to take a lot of responsibility for kids’ education, even when they are supposed to be in a good school.
Here are some of the things we’ve done at home:
–lots of reading instruction and practice for both of our older kids (I own a huge library of little phonics books) starting seriously around 4. With my middle child, there was a time where I was afraid he was going to learn to read before he potty trained…
–lots of Kumon workbooks (especially math–I really love their Geometry and Measurement series)
–a lot of home reading and audiobooks
–my husband reading “serious” books with the kids–Platonic dialogs, C.S. Lewis’s Mere Christianity, a book about catastrophic building failures, etc.
–Kindles for the kids, loaded with free classics (Dumas and huge fat Polish historical novels are less frightful on the Kindle)
–lots of nature documentaries (hey pandas, make an effort!)
–my husband does lots of documentary viewing with the kids–often on technical subjects
–we also have to do 100% of our sex ed ourselves (school doesn’t do it)
–there are also some shenanigans with PE at school (long story), so we need to keep our oldest active–we should be doing more than we are
The kids also do academic contests from time to time, which our oldest LOVES. The best is the county fair here, which offers cash prizes. We also have done the summer library reading program many times.
I was mostly able to relax on the reading and math once we had the kids settled into our current private school, but we still do a lot of enrichment type stuff. I’ve also pulled back a bit from supervising school stuff once we had our third child (the big kids had to be put on the honor system), but now that our youngest is 3, I’m more or less back in the loop. The online grade check system helps a lot.
Aside from the stuff we do at home, there are also some more or less necessary educational things we outsource:
–home ec (we’ve done cooking classes and sewing classes)
–music lessons
–computer programming (kinda sorta–my husband teaches a summer course and our oldest has taken the course)
I think it’s more than just funding, but parent-driven curriculum choices that should be considered. I know a few who home cyber school, using state education programs. They pick core subjects that suit their needs and wishes and supplement texts with additional reading. It allows them to homeschool 6+ kids, take care of toddlers and keep them all on a guided schedule. I’ll be using a cyber class for my 7th grader this year. I can’t teach aeronautics, but a Catholic gentleman in a state 10 hours away will be holding class and lending his expertise to help teach some kids.There are many different methods to homeschooling. online, unit studies, living books, parent led, child led, school at home, etc. So I don’t get hung up on method.
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I draw the line on who is funding it? If it’s private funded, parents paying 100% for it, directly out of their pocket, it’s homeschooling. If it’s funded by the government in any shape or form then it’s public school at home and no longer homeschooling.**
Many homeschool advocate groups like HSLDA draw the line in the sand at the same point. If you are using a public school at home option HSLDA will not allow you to join or will not cover you … because using public school at home is not homeschooling. So I look at the same way if a advocate group like HSLDA will let your join then you are homeschooling if they turn you down because of your schooling method then you are not actually homeschooling.
Oh, I know. By the time our youngest heads to kindergarten, we will have around $2,000 a month going out for just school tuition–not counting uniforms, the occasional hot lunch, teacher gifts, school project materials, music lessons, educational book purchases, extracurriculars and summer camps.When you get tired of paying all that tuition for classes that need to be supplemented, you should try homeschooling![]()
There’s also the factor that some parents will do a mix of cyber and homeschool options.I’m curious about the experiences of people using the hybrid or cyber options. Do you consider what you’re doing “homeschooling”? Are you accepted as homeschoolers within your local community at large?
To my uninformed mind, it would seem that the older kids (doing the cyber thing) would be fairly autonomous - read the lesson, watch the lecture, submit the assignment, take the quiz…that seems more like standard distance ed than homeschooling…sort of like how we call online college “distance education” or “alternative education” rather than “homeschooling”. The outside agency is doing the educating, from a distance. Thinking further, is cyber elementary school still “distance ed”? What percentage of parent involvement meets the critera for homeschooling versus distance education?
And one more comment on Mommyof2green’s use of finance in the definition - I think the government kind of agrees with her on this, in that the Coverdell ESA (Education Savings Account) can only be used for public/private school expenses from preschool through college. As of March 2015, only 14 states allowed a Coverdell to be used for home education expenses when the homeschool is registered as a private school. (It gets murky, because some states exclusively consider them private schools, other states have a mishmash of “non public school” options that HSers may fall under.) So, if you can get Coverdell coverage in any of the other 36 states that don’t do the “homeschool is a private school” thing, then I’d label it as an alternative public education…the parents seem sort of incidental in the education - they may or may not handle the instruction, but the curriculum, recordkeeping, requirements, etc, are developed and enforced by the public system. Does this make sense? I’m curious how the cyber program parents see their arrangement? To what degree to you maintain autonomy, once you’ve signed on that dotted line to join the program?
Once I begin using on line classes, I will still consider my son homeschooled. I’m setting the schedule and supervising the work and grading his papers. I’ll just be heavily relying on a computer screen to explain the concepts. It’s difficult to have cut and dried definition for homeschooling, in reality, each “home” school is as different as the home they reside.I’m curious about the experiences of people using the hybrid or cyber options. Do you consider what you’re doing “homeschooling”? Are you accepted as homeschoolers within your local community at large?
To my uninformed mind, it would seem that the older kids (doing the cyber thing) would be fairly autonomous - read the lesson, watch the lecture, submit the assignment, take the quiz…that seems more like standard distance ed than homeschooling…sort of like how we call online college “distance education” or “alternative education” rather than “homeschooling”. The outside agency is doing the educating, from a distance. Thinking further, is cyber elementary school still “distance ed”? What percentage of parent involvement meets the critera for homeschooling versus distance education?
And one more comment on Mommyof2green’s use of finance in the definition - I think the government kind of agrees with her on this, in that the Coverdell ESA (Education Savings Account) can only be used for public/private school expenses from preschool through college. As of March 2015, only 14 states allowed a Coverdell to be used for home education expenses when the homeschool is registered as a private school. (It gets murky, because some states exclusively consider them private schools, other states have a mishmash of “non public school” options that HSers may fall under.) So, if you can get Coverdell coverage in any of the other 36 states that don’t do the “homeschool is a private school” thing, then I’d label it as an alternative public education…the parents seem sort of incidental in the education - they may or may not handle the instruction, but the curriculum, recordkeeping, requirements, etc, are developed and enforced by the public system. Does this make sense? I’m curious how the cyber program parents see their arrangement? To what degree to you maintain autonomy, once you’ve signed on that dotted line to join the program?
I was curious why you asked the question. It’s a good question, but I could probably write an entire book (or more) on the topic. Trying to limit a response here with a readable sized post barely even skims the surface. To say it succinctly, I guess, to me overseeing a child’s education really is one of the primary aspect of parenting.The comments were the kind of thing I was looking for, the different definitions people operate under.
I have to think about it myself, I think for me it comes down to how much parent-management is happening. The parents don’t have to be the only or even primary ones teaching, they can simply be managing the people who do teach.
But it’s why I started the thread, to think about it more systematically.
I don’t know if most parents are involved in their children’s education. My experiences with some of the cultures I was raised with are that some groups are fire and forget-- enroll the kids in school, the school does it all. No after school reading, no enrichment outside of school, etc. But that also varies regionally.I was curious why you asked the question. It’s a good question, but I could probably write an entire book (or more) on the topic. Trying to limit a response here with a readable sized post barely even skims the surface. To say it succinctly, I guess, to me overseeing a child’s education really is one of the primary aspect of parenting.
Latin phrases relating to parents are found in education. We graduated from an “alma mater”; “mater” is Latin for mother. The term “in loco parentis” is a Latin phrase that translates as “in place of a parent” which has been used as a legal term relating to the relationship between teacher or school and the students in their care. Latin aside, high school students have a “home room”. Rather than homeschoolers trying to duplicate schools at home, it’s the schools that try to duplicate aspects of parenting at school.
By the definition you used for homeschooling in the quote above, I’d say it applies to every parent–because every involved parent manages their children’s education in some way, shape or form. Many manage it by carefully selecting in which public school district they live. Some manage it through selecting and paying for private schools. Then there’s all the homework and studying, reading all the information sent home, meeting with the teachers, the candy sales, the wrapping paper sales, the volunteering, and all the various other things that parents who send their children must do in order to try to manage and participate in helping their children to get a good education. If you are going to define homeschooling that way, most parents homeschool. And I *do *believe most parents “homeschool”–by which I mean they get involved in their children’s education.
Very few children get a good education without the support of their parents. Much of the learning of the “best and brightest” takes place outside a traditional classroom setting. Education frequently happens in enriched environments filled with music lessons, dance lessons, private lessons of every other kind, trips to museums and zoos and the world around them, and then coming back to homes filled with books and parents who care about what their children are learning. When children go to school, the ones with the personal experience on a topic understand the lessons and perform better in school overall; when they don’t go to school, people often call those same types of activities “homeschooling”.
Let’s say there is a large minority that is heavily involved.I don’t know if most parents are involved in their children’s education. My experiences with some of the cultures I was raised with are that some groups are fire and forget-- enroll the kids in school, the school does it all. No after school reading, no enrichment outside of school, etc. But that also varies regionally.
Growing up we got those kinds of projects all the time, but very few parents helped with them. We had to do them ourselves. The teachers actually took points off for the parental help in projects so none of us wanted parental help. I wonder when the change over from kids doing their best to parents doing their best actually happened or if it still varies by area. I don’t think it’s wrong for parents to help out and I actually like the idea of parents and kids working together. I think it’s a great opportunity to share something like that. But growing up this was a huge no no in our schools (southern Catholic run by nuns 1-12, no kindergarten). The project I remember most was when we had to make a 5th grade project of the Trail of Tears. Being Native American put extra pressure on my to make mine the best. We had two weeks to make the project and written report. Daddy gave me a slab of plywood and a pack of clothes pins. Mama took me to the store to by little horses and fabric to make clothes. I found the rest of my supplies in the garage. It was all the help they gave because no way was I getting points off for parental help. Even now as a homeschooling mom I’m pretty hands off when it comes to their projects. I teach, I grade, I keep records, I answer questions and I might offer (very limited) suggestions if asked for help, but the actual work is on them. I admire parents that are willing to make time to work on a project with their kids, but I don’t understand why the teachers allow that to happen these days. How is a teacher supposed to grade a student’s knowledge and abilities if the parents contribute so much? What about the students that don’t have parents that are able to help out? Are those kids graded on a different scale? Is this something that is common in schools now? My kids went to public school but they were mostly DODEA and the teachers didn’t allow parental help, so this is all a new way of looking at things. Truthfully I think it’s a great thing for parents to work with the kids. Sounds like a great family experience to have.Let’s say there is a large minority that is heavily involved.
From what I hear from the NE, in the “better” suburban public school districts, they really don’t give you the option of being uninvolved. Stuff keeps coming home that the child could not possibly do by himself. (That has been one of the big topics on Kitchen Table Math and the Out in Left Field blog.) For instance, when my oldest was in first grade, they had a project where the child was supposed to build a covered wagon. Our family phoned it in and turned in a paper craft covered wagon printed off the internet and assembled at home (which still required lots of daddy), but I saw the display of other families’ contributions canvas-and-wood versions, and there’s no way that a bunch of 1st graders did those projects by themselves or even 40% of the work. My oldest is a blessedly artsy crafty 8th grader, and we’ve finally been able to hand over 90-95% of her projects to her, but “good” schools routinely assign developmentally inappropriate projects. Apparently, these projects are especially unfortunate for a lot of middle school boys. (The blogger at Out in Left Field wrote an entire book entitled The Left-Brained Child that’s largely devoted to what a horror show middle school projects are.) A child without solid home support just can’t deal with this stuff.
Our oldest has actually enjoyed her projects a lot and she recently did a very nice job on a bird costume for a play, with some help from her dad. Our middle child (who is otherwise a solid, hard-working student) gets sad and whiny about any sort of artsy school project.Growing up we got those kinds of projects all the time, but very few parents helped with them. We had to do them ourselves. The teachers actually took points off for the parental help in projects so none of us wanted parental help. I wonder when the change over from kids doing their best to parents doing their best actually happened or if it still varies by area. I don’t think it’s wrong for parents to help out and I actually like the idea of parents and kids working together. I think it’s a great opportunity to share something like that. But growing up this was a huge no no in our schools (southern Catholic run by nuns 1-12, no kindergarten). The project I remember most was when we had to make a 5th grade project of the Trail of Tears. Being Native American put extra pressure on my to make mine the best. We had two weeks to make the project and written report. Daddy gave me a slab of plywood and a pack of clothes pins. Mama took me to the store to by little horses and fabric to make clothes. I found the rest of my supplies in the garage. It was all the help they gave because no way was I getting points off for parental help. Even now as a homeschooling mom I’m pretty hands off when it comes to their projects. I teach, I grade, I keep records, I answer questions and I might offer (very limited) suggestions if asked for help, but the actual work is on them. I admire parents that are willing to make time to work on a project with their kids, but I don’t understand why the teachers allow that to happen these days. How is a teacher supposed to grade a student’s knowledge and abilities if the parents contribute so much? What about the students that don’t have parents that are able to help out? Are those kids graded on a different scale? Is this something that is common in schools now? My kids went to public school but they were mostly DODEA and the teachers didn’t allow parental help, so this is all a new way of looking at things. Truthfully I think it’s a great thing for parents to work with the kids. Sounds like a great family experience to have.
Even parents who don’t read to their child or otherwise get involved with the child’s school work “teach” their child something. It may just teach the child his/her parents don’t value of formal education and learning, but that’s teaching something. It is much harder for a child to succeed in academics if his/her parents aren’t involved, yet it may also be hard for some parents to participate in their children’s formal education if the parents themselves don’t enjoy reading and/or didn’t learn much in school. Children learn largely through imitation–and two people children closely imitate are their mom and dad. By the very nature of the parent/child relationship, *all parents are teachers; the question left is what *are they teaching their children?I don’t know if most parents are involved in their children’s education. My experiences with some of the cultures I was raised with are that some groups are fire and forget-- enroll the kids in school, the school does it all. No after school reading, no enrichment outside of school, etc. But that also varies regionally.
We use a publicly funded charter school that is dedicated to parent choice. We choose our curriculum, and the charter school pays for anything that is non-sectarian. Our school gives us a budget to spend every year and we mostly use the budget for enrichment classes - music, theater, skiing, gymnastics, and some outside classes. We have also used our funds to purchase computers, supplies such as pencils, pens, computer ink and paper, as well as some of our curriculum. We buy from a number of secular and religious curriculum providers, so we use school funds to purchase from the secular companies, and our own funds to purchase religious curriculum. We meet once each month with our Education Specialist (credentialed teacher), who happens to be my husband. The job of the Education Specialist is to document the learning that has occurred during the month and apply it to the state standards. He also submits a portfolio of work each semester, which includes one work sample per subject. If we are using a religious curriculum, he just prints something off the computer and has the child complete it. We are required to do a minimum of state testing (one end-of-year test) and the school has an annual pre-test and post-test, taken in our home, on a computer. We are very satisfied with the school.I’m curious about the experiences of people using the hybrid or cyber options. Do you consider what you’re doing “homeschooling”? Are you accepted as homeschoolers within your local community at large?
To my uninformed mind, it would seem that the older kids (doing the cyber thing) would be fairly autonomous - read the lesson, watch the lecture, submit the assignment, take the quiz…that seems more like standard distance ed than homeschooling…sort of like how we call online college “distance education” or “alternative education” rather than “homeschooling”. The outside agency is doing the educating, from a distance. Thinking further, is cyber elementary school still “distance ed”? What percentage of parent involvement meets the critera for homeschooling versus distance education?
And one more comment on Mommyof2green’s use of finance in the definition - I think the government kind of agrees with her on this, in that the Coverdell ESA (Education Savings Account) can only be used for public/private school expenses from preschool through college. As of March 2015, only 14 states allowed a Coverdell to be used for home education expenses when the homeschool is registered as a private school. (It gets murky, because some states exclusively consider them private schools, other states have a mishmash of “non public school” options that HSers may fall under.) So, if you can get Coverdell coverage in any of the other 36 states that don’t do the “homeschool is a private school” thing, then I’d label it as an alternative public education…the parents seem sort of incidental in the education - they may or may not handle the instruction, but the curriculum, recordkeeping, requirements, etc, are developed and enforced by the public system. Does this make sense? I’m curious how the cyber program parents see their arrangement? To what degree to you maintain autonomy, once you’ve signed on that dotted line to join the program?