What is Marriage

[BornInMarch]

What is Marriage? Where does it count as marriage, where does it not count as marriage?

If a man and a woman fill out a marriage counsel at their local courthouse but don’t preform any form of ceremony -religious or otherwise-, are then still married in the eyes of God?

In the Bible, did God approve of the polygamy practiced by The Jewish Kings? If He did not approve of it, then what statements or acts does He make to show this disapproval?

In Genesis, were Adam and Eve ever married? Were they created already wedded, or did they have a wedding ceremony which The Bible did not consider worth mentioning?

Is a marriage valid in the eyes of God if the couple can not have children (due to sterility, age, or health)?

 

[PaulfromIowa]

If a man and a woman fill out a marriage counsel at their local courthouse but don’t preform any form of ceremony -religious or otherwise-, are then still married in the eyes of God?

What is a “marriage counsel”? Do you mean a marriage license? Did they intend to be married?

Is a marriage valid in the eyes of God if the couple can not have children (due to sterility, age, or health)?

The answer is yes.

 

[808Catholic]

What is Marriage? Where does it count as marriage, where does it not count as marriage?

If a man and a woman fill out a marriage counsel at their local courthouse but don’t preform any form of ceremony -religious or otherwise-, are then still married in the eyes of God?

In the Bible, did God approve of the polygamy practiced by The Jewish Kings? If He did not approve of it, then what statements or acts does He make to show this disapproval?

In Genesis, were Adam and Eve ever married? Were they created already wedded, or did they have a wedding ceremony which The Bible did not consider worth mentioning?

Is a marriage valid in the eyes of God if the couple can not have children (due to sterility, age, or health)?

When challenged with this same question, Christ replied with the Genesis story. What God has put together no man may separate. God is in the marriage. If you go to a courthouse, fill out an application, pay your fee, where is God? When in doubt, ask your parish priest or call your Diocese.

 

[rossum]

What is Marriage?

Take your pick, there are plenty of versions to choose from:

• Marriage (Jacob) = 1 husband, 2 wives, 2 handmaidens.
• Marriage (Deuteronomy 21:15) = 1 husband, 2 wives.
• Marriage (David) = 1 husband, 8 wives.
• Marriage (Solomon) = 1 husband, 700 wives, 300 concubines.
• Marriage (Nehemiah 13:25) = 1 husband, 1 wife of the same people.
• Marriage (Muslim) = 1 husband, up to 4 wives.
• Marriage (Joseph Smith) = 1 husband, many wives.
• Marriage (mainstream Mormon) = 1 husband, 1 wife.
• Marriage (Catholic) = 1 husband not previously divorced, 1 wife not previously divorced.
• Marriage (Protestant) = 1 husband, 1 wife.
• Marriage (Virginia pre-1967) = 1 husband, 1 wife of the same race.
• Marriage (Netherlands since 2001) = two adults.
• Marriage (California June 2008 - November 2008, June 2013 on) = two adults.
• Marriage (California November 2008 - June 2013) = 1 husband, 1 wife.

There are many different versions of marriage recognised by different religious groups and by different legal entities at different times. There is no one single “marriage” but many different versions recognised by different religions and by different legal systems.

rossum

 

[808Catholic]

Take your pick, there are plenty of versions to choose from:

• Marriage (Jacob) = 1 husband, 2 wives, 2 handmaidens.
• Marriage (Deuteronomy 21:15) = 1 husband, 2 wives.
• Marriage (David) = 1 husband, 8 wives.
• Marriage (Solomon) = 1 husband, 700 wives, 300 concubines.
• Marriage (Nehemiah 13:25) = 1 husband, 1 wife of the same people.
• Marriage (Muslim) = 1 husband, up to 4 wives.
• Marriage (Joseph Smith) = 1 husband, many wives.
• Marriage (mainstream Mormon) = 1 husband, 1 wife.
• Marriage (Catholic) = 1 husband not previously divorced, 1 wife not previously divorced.
• Marriage (Protestant) = 1 husband, 1 wife.
• Marriage (Virginia pre-1967) = 1 husband, 1 wife of the same race.
• Marriage (Netherlands since 2001) = two adults.
• Marriage (California June 2008 - November 2008, June 2013 on) = two adults.
• Marriage (California November 2008 - June 2013) = 1 husband, 1 wife.

There are many different versions of marriage recognised by different religious groups and by different legal entities at different times. There is no one single “marriage” but many different versions recognised by different religions and by different legal systems.

rossum

There may be many interpretations but only one definition of marriage when it comes to Catholics. So, if the rest of the “world” chooses to “redefine” marriage, they are only playing with words.

 

[rossum]

There may be many interpretations but only one definition of marriage when it comes to Catholics. So, if the rest of the “world” chooses to “redefine” marriage, they are only playing with words.

The “rest of the world” had definitions of marriage long before the Catholic Church, see my points from the Old Testament. It was the Catholic Church that redefined marriage after all the other versions that had preceded the Catholic definition.

rossum

 

[on_the_hill]

There may be many interpretations but only one definition of marriage when it comes to Catholics. So, if the rest of the “world” chooses to “redefine” marriage, they are only playing with words.

Not a very convincing argument, I must say. The rest of the world is playing with words only from our Catholic perspective. From their perspective their definitions are as valid as ours.

 

[e_c]

Marriage is, first and foremost, an office of nature. It can’t be understood apart from this. The early Scriptural exceptions for polygamy (none of which worked out for the practitioners, by the way), are also understandable such as to be reconciled with the Christian vision only in the understanding of it as an office of nature.

An office of nature is an institution that is fundamental to the flourishing of any developed human society. Other examples would include a military, a government, doctors… You need these offices, because they provide essential goods to the community in a well ordered way.

We see certain rights and benefits derived from occupying certain offices of nature. Today’s world wants the rights and benefits without entering into the office, because they find certain things about the office distasteful. I can own a gun, fly the American flag in my front yard, and live an honorable life, but that does not mean I should get the military discount at the local restaurant. I would have to enter the office to get that benefit, because as of now, I can’t provide the goods, in a well ordered way, that I can as a member of the military. Same with the benefits of committing one’s life to a member of the opposite sex, because that is the kind of relationship that provides the world with new life and is ordered toward the proper care and upbringing of that new life.

Marriage isn’t acceptance at nature’s country club, it’s being employed by nature to do a job, and yes, it comes with perks and can be very rewarding but does carry responsibilities.

 

[808Catholic]

The “rest of the world” had definitions of marriage long before the Catholic Church, see my points from the Old Testament. It was the Catholic Church that redefined marriage after all the other versions that had preceded the Catholic definition.

rossum

So your intent is to follow the oldest tradition of marriage which is…?

 

[rossum]

So your intent is to follow the oldest tradition of marriage which is…?

No, that was not my intent. My intent was to correct your claim that the Catholic Church defined marriage, rather than merely providing its own definition to stand alongside the others.

Neither Christianity nor the Catholic Church own the definition of marriage.

rossum

 

[Bradski]

So your intent is to follow the oldest tradition of marriage which is…?

I think that discounting a legal definition, marriage is what the people who are getting married consider it to be.

If I were to define it, it would be a definition of what my partner and I consider it to be. Your mileage may vary.

 

[Joy2day]

Take your pick, there are plenty of versions to choose from:

• Marriage (Jacob) = 1 husband, 2 wives, 2 handmaidens.
• Marriage (Deuteronomy 21:15) = 1 husband, 2 wives.
• Marriage (David) = 1 husband, 8 wives.
• Marriage (Solomon) = 1 husband, 700 wives, 300 concubines.
• Marriage (Nehemiah 13:25) = 1 husband, 1 wife of the same people.
• Marriage (Muslim) = 1 husband, up to 4 wives.
• Marriage (Joseph Smith) = 1 husband, many wives.
• Marriage (mainstream Mormon) = 1 husband, 1 wife.
• Marriage (Catholic) = 1 husband not previously divorced, 1 wife not previously divorced.
• Marriage (Protestant) = 1 husband, 1 wife.
• Marriage (Virginia pre-1967) = 1 husband, 1 wife of the same race.
• Marriage (Netherlands since 2001) = two adults.
• Marriage (California June 2008 - November 2008, June 2013 on) = two adults.
• Marriage (California November 2008 - June 2013) = 1 husband, 1 wife.

There are many different versions of marriage recognised by different religious groups and by different legal entities at different times. There is no one single “marriage” but many different versions recognised by different religions and by different legal systems.

rossum

Clearly marriage is a ‘male’ institution.

 

[Bradski]

Clearly marriage is a ‘male’ institution.

It wasn’t that long ago that the marriage vows were, for a woman, to love, honour and obey.

Obey?

 

[rossum]

It wasn’t that long ago that the marriage vows were, for a woman, to love, honour and obey.

Obey?

And before that, in the 19th century and earlier, all the woman’s property passed to her husband when she married. It legally belonged to him, not to her.

rossum

 

[Bradski]

And before that, in the 19th century and earlier, all the woman’s property passed to her husband when she married. It legally belonged to him, not to her.

rossum

She even lost her name.

 

[808Catholic]

No, that was not my intent. My intent was to correct your claim that the Catholic Church defined marriage, rather than merely providing its own definition to stand alongside the others.

Neither Christianity nor the Catholic Church own the definition of marriage.

rossum

Does the majority of the world follow the precepts of Catholic/Christian marriage?

 

[808Catholic]

I think that discounting a legal definition, marriage is what the people who are getting married consider it to be.

If I were to define it, it would be a definition of what my partner and I consider it to be. Your mileage may vary.

Legal definitions vary by society and time so it’s logical for some to presume the definition of marriage can vary as well. This is why the Catholic/Christian view of marriage has stood for 2,000 years. People who feel strongly against our view have left the fold but it doesn’t change our view and adherence.

 

[808Catholic]

It wasn’t that long ago that the marriage vows were, for a woman, to love, honour and obey.

Obey?

Marriage vows are mutual. Obey is a good promise for both husband and wife. No obedience would result in chaos in the household. As we see in modern western marriages.

 

[rossum]

Does the majority of the world follow the precepts of Catholic/Christian marriage?

Many Christian denominations allow divorce, as do Judaism, Islam, Buddhism and Hinduism. Many civil law codes allow divorce.

Catholic marriage does not allow divorce, so I would say that the majority of the world does not follow Catholic marriage.

rossum

 

[808Catholic]

And before that, in the 19th century and earlier, all the woman’s property passed to her husband when she married. It legally belonged to him, not to her.

rossum

Before that, in the western world, the woman didn’t own any property. In parts of the world today, women still don’t own property.