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auroraaustralis
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Is it the same as dictionary definition or is it something else?
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Francis
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There are worldly desire and Spiritual desire what do you want to know?
Like James 1:15 then, when that desire has conceived, it gives birth to sin, and that sin, when it is fully grown, gives birth to death.
Sin comes in 3 ways 1 John 2:15 Do not love the world or the things in the world. The love of the Father is not in those who love the world; 16 for all that is in the world—the desire of the flesh, the desire of the eyes, the pride in riches—comes not from the Father but from the world. 17 And the world and its desire are passing away, but those who do the will of God live forever.
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auroraaustralis
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desires of flesh means wanting to have materialistic things. I don’t think there’s anything wrong with that. If god didn’t want us to possess materialistic things. why hadn’t he created us as just souls?
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Francis
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@auroraaustralis
At the same time we should be detached from the heart 1 Timothy 6:10 For the love of money is a root of all kinds of evil, and in their eagerness to be rich some have wandered away from the faith and pierced themselves with many pains.
No flesh means pride selfishness sin of the flesh Galatians 5: 19 Now the works of the flesh are obvious: fornication, impurity, licentiousness, 20 idolatry, sorcery, enmities, strife, jealousy, anger, quarrels, dissensions, factions, 21 envy, drunkenness, carousing, and things like these. I am warning you, as I warned you before: those who do such things will not inherit the kingdom of God.
No, wanting to have materialistic things is not sinful as long as its for our sustenance ,we works hard and make our living ,and use them for the common good of the family in education, health,house and other needs ,we also have an obligation in society to share them according to our means for charity ,for the church and for the poor, according to your state of life and as the will of God ,but inordinate desires by unjust means and not helping you fellow humans, out of charity are sin full.God has blessed many who are rich but they are down to earth and help the poor much
At the same time we should be detached from the heart 1 Timothy 6:10 For the love of money is a root of all kinds of evil, and in their eagerness to be rich some have wandered away from the faith and pierced themselves with many pains.
No flesh means pride selfishness sin of the flesh Galatians 5: 19 Now the works of the flesh are obvious: fornication, impurity, licentiousness, 20 idolatry, sorcery, enmities, strife, jealousy, anger, quarrels, dissensions, factions, 21 envy, drunkenness, carousing, and things like these. I am warning you, as I warned you before: those who do such things will not inherit the kingdom of God.
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Francis
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@auroraaustralis
Psalms 139:13 For it was you who formed my inward parts;you knit me together in my mother’s womb.14 I praise you, for I am fearfully and wonderfully made.Wonderful are your works;that I know very well.15 My frame was not hidden from you,when I was being made in secret,intricately woven in the depths of the earth.16 Your eyes beheld my unformed substance.In your book were written all the days that were formed for me,when none of them as yet existed.17 How weighty to me are your thoughts, O God!How vast is the sum of them!
Ecclesiastes 11:5 Just as you do not know how the breath comes to the bones in the mother’s womb, so you do not know the work of God, who makes everything.
Psalms 8:3 When I look at your heavens, the work of your fingers,the moon and the stars that you have established;4 what are human beings that you are mindful of them,mortals that you care for them?5 Yet you have made them a little lower than God,and crowned them with glory and honor.6 You have given them dominion over the works of your hands;you have put all things under their feet,7 all sheep and oxen,and also the beasts of the field,8 the birds of the air, and the fish of the sea,whatever passes along the paths of the seas.9 O Lord, our Sovereign,how majestic is your name in all the earth!
Because he made us in the likeness and image of Him, and created us out of infinity love .Psalm 115:3 Our God is in the heavens;he does whatever he pleases.Genesis 1:27 So God created humankind in his image,in the image of God he created them male and female he created them.
Psalms 139:13 For it was you who formed my inward parts;you knit me together in my mother’s womb.14 I praise you, for I am fearfully and wonderfully made.Wonderful are your works;that I know very well.15 My frame was not hidden from you,when I was being made in secret,intricately woven in the depths of the earth.16 Your eyes beheld my unformed substance.In your book were written all the days that were formed for me,when none of them as yet existed.17 How weighty to me are your thoughts, O God!How vast is the sum of them!
Ecclesiastes 11:5 Just as you do not know how the breath comes to the bones in the mother’s womb, so you do not know the work of God, who makes everything.
Psalms 8:3 When I look at your heavens, the work of your fingers,the moon and the stars that you have established;4 what are human beings that you are mindful of them,mortals that you care for them?5 Yet you have made them a little lower than God,and crowned them with glory and honor.6 You have given them dominion over the works of your hands;you have put all things under their feet,7 all sheep and oxen,and also the beasts of the field,8 the birds of the air, and the fish of the sea,whatever passes along the paths of the seas.9 O Lord, our Sovereign,how majestic is your name in all the earth!
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auroraaustralis
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auroraaustralis
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you said in first place that desires are sinful
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Francis
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@auroraaustralis
James 1:15 then, when that desire has conceived, it gives birth to sin, and that sin, when it is fully grown, gives birth to death.
Evil desires and not good desires with good intention since Jesus looks at our hearts 1 Samuel 16:7 7 But the Lord said to Samuel, “Do not look on his appearance or on the height of his stature, because I have rejected him; for the Lord does not see as mortals see; they look on the outward appearance, but the Lord looks on the heart.”
The desires are coming from our hearts and thoughts Jeremiah 17:9 The heart is devious above all else;it is perverse—who can understand it?Matthew 6:21 For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also.Matthew 15:19 19 For out of the heart come evil intentions, murder, adultery, fornication, theft, false witness, slander.
James 1:15 then, when that desire has conceived, it gives birth to sin, and that sin, when it is fully grown, gives birth to death.
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Francis
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@auroraaustralis
The works of the flesh can be good and bad ,just as good desires and bad desires ,they are the same, flesh means our mind body and soul
Genesis 4:7 If you do well, will you not be accepted? And if you do not do well, sin is lurking at the door; its desire is for you, but you must master it.”
Genesis 6:5 The Lord saw that the wickedness of humankind was great in the earth, and that every inclination of the thoughts of their hearts was only evil continually.
Galatians 5:16 Live by the Spirit, I say, and do not gratify the desires of the flesh.
Galatians 5:19 Now the works of the flesh are obvious: fornication, impurity, licentiousness, 20 idolatry, sorcery, enmities, strife, jealousy, anger, quarrels, dissensions, factions, 21 envy, drunkenness, carousing, and things like these. I am warning you, as I warned you before: those who do such things will not inherit the kingdom of God.
The works of the flesh can be good and bad ,just as good desires and bad desires ,they are the same, flesh means our mind body and soul
Genesis 4:7 If you do well, will you not be accepted? And if you do not do well, sin is lurking at the door; its desire is for you, but you must master it.”
Genesis 6:5 The Lord saw that the wickedness of humankind was great in the earth, and that every inclination of the thoughts of their hearts was only evil continually.
Galatians 5:16 Live by the Spirit, I say, and do not gratify the desires of the flesh.
Galatians 5:19 Now the works of the flesh are obvious: fornication, impurity, licentiousness, 20 idolatry, sorcery, enmities, strife, jealousy, anger, quarrels, dissensions, factions, 21 envy, drunkenness, carousing, and things like these. I am warning you, as I warned you before: those who do such things will not inherit the kingdom of God.
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Hodos
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Which verse are you referring to?
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auroraaustralis
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You said desires of flesh can be good and bad. Flesh means our mind, body and soul…
But the bible says flesh’s desires are always sinful like fornication, idolatry, envy. etc. Isn’t it contradictory?
But the bible says flesh’s desires are always sinful like fornication, idolatry, envy. etc. Isn’t it contradictory?
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Francis
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@auroraaustralis
CCC 1601 "The matrimonial covenant, by which a man and a woman establish between themselves a partnership of the whole of life, is by its nature ordered toward the good of the spouses and the procreation and education of offspring; this covenant between baptized persons has been raised by Christ the Lord to the dignity of a sacrament."84
During baptism ,a spark of the Holy spirit is given us ,we become a child of God and of the Church and brothers and sisters of Jesus and the saints.It is our duty to strengthen our spiritual man(Women) in us ,God (Holy Trinity )dwells in us, our human spirit should be united to the spirit of God with in us and not with the evil spirits by sin,here again because of the affects of the original sin of Adam and Eve ,its weakened and always reclined towards evil and desires of the flesh and here the devil and the evil spirit also want to take control of us and do his bidding and ruin our souls to hell because of our sins and inclinations and obsessions and inordinate desires of the flesh and we fail to use our will the power to choose good and bad ,if we persist in sin the Holy Spirit will leave us and the evil one take over but God shows mercy and give us many chances till our last breath so let us use our will judiciously.God Bless
No, they are not contradictory ,for example , in the sacrament of matrimony union between Man and women is not sinful but a covenant ,and their fruit of their love are the children ,which God willing will have,but illegal union between couples without the sacrament of marriage is sinful and breaking of the commandments ,like wise same sex unions are sinful because they cannot procreate and against the will of God Mark 10:8 and the two shall become one flesh.’ So they are no longer two, but one flesh. The husband and wife think as one, co-operate and share everything with love, without any conditions because Jesus is their center of their lives ,in sickness and in joys only in death they are separated ,they are one mind and spirit,not just physical.
CCC 1601 "The matrimonial covenant, by which a man and a woman establish between themselves a partnership of the whole of life, is by its nature ordered toward the good of the spouses and the procreation and education of offspring; this covenant between baptized persons has been raised by Christ the Lord to the dignity of a sacrament."84
During baptism ,a spark of the Holy spirit is given us ,we become a child of God and of the Church and brothers and sisters of Jesus and the saints.It is our duty to strengthen our spiritual man(Women) in us ,God (Holy Trinity )dwells in us, our human spirit should be united to the spirit of God with in us and not with the evil spirits by sin,here again because of the affects of the original sin of Adam and Eve ,its weakened and always reclined towards evil and desires of the flesh and here the devil and the evil spirit also want to take control of us and do his bidding and ruin our souls to hell because of our sins and inclinations and obsessions and inordinate desires of the flesh and we fail to use our will the power to choose good and bad ,if we persist in sin the Holy Spirit will leave us and the evil one take over but God shows mercy and give us many chances till our last breath so let us use our will judiciously.God Bless
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Francis
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@auroraaustralis
Continuation
1 John 5:19 We know that we are God’s children, and that the whole world lies under the power of the evil one. the whole world is influenced by satan but Jesus doesn’t leaves us alone he gave his guardian angles ,saints and promised us to be with us till the end of our life and next also Matthew 28:20 and teaching them to obey everything that I have commanded you. And remember, I am with you always, to the end of the age.”
1 John 4:4 Little children, you are from God, and have conquered them; for the one who is in you is greater than the one who is in the world. so Jesus is inside us who is greater than one who is out side satan in the world.
By leading a holy life by avoiding sin and keeping the ,the Commandments ,Holy Mass Sacraments the teaching of the Church an doing good works by Giving first place to God and loving our neighbor and by doing the will of God in our state of life.we will be strengthening the inner spiritual person in us.
Here comes the spiritual warfare
Remember satan was already defeated Rev12:7 And war broke out in heaven; Michael and his angels fought against the dragon. The dragon and his angels fought back, 8 but they were defeated, and there was no longer any place for them in heaven. so he his jealous of us and is angry with us Rev12:12 Rejoice then, you heavens and those who dwell in them!But woe to the earth and the sea,for the devil has come down to you with great wrath,because he knows that his time is short!”
The decision is with us ,God has given us free will ,to decide either good or evil
Sirach 15:14 It was he who created humankind in the beginning,and he left them in the power of their own free choice.15 If you choose, you can keep the commandments,and to act faithfully is a matter of your own choice.16 He has placed before you fire (fire is for destruction Hell)and water(water is for life eternal);stretch out your hand for whichever you choose.17 Before each person are life and death,and whichever one chooses will be given.18 For great is the wisdom of the Lord;he is mighty in power and sees everything;19 his eyes are on those who fear him,and he knows every human action.20 He has not commanded anyone to be wicked,and he has not given anyone permission to sin.
Revelation 3:21 To the one who conquers I will give a place with me on my throne, just as I myself conquered and sat down with my Father on his throne.
Continuation
1 John 5:19 We know that we are God’s children, and that the whole world lies under the power of the evil one. the whole world is influenced by satan but Jesus doesn’t leaves us alone he gave his guardian angles ,saints and promised us to be with us till the end of our life and next also Matthew 28:20 and teaching them to obey everything that I have commanded you. And remember, I am with you always, to the end of the age.”
1 John 4:4 Little children, you are from God, and have conquered them; for the one who is in you is greater than the one who is in the world. so Jesus is inside us who is greater than one who is out side satan in the world.
By leading a holy life by avoiding sin and keeping the ,the Commandments ,Holy Mass Sacraments the teaching of the Church an doing good works by Giving first place to God and loving our neighbor and by doing the will of God in our state of life.we will be strengthening the inner spiritual person in us.
Here comes the spiritual warfare
Remember satan was already defeated Rev12:7 And war broke out in heaven; Michael and his angels fought against the dragon. The dragon and his angels fought back, 8 but they were defeated, and there was no longer any place for them in heaven. so he his jealous of us and is angry with us Rev12:12 Rejoice then, you heavens and those who dwell in them!But woe to the earth and the sea,for the devil has come down to you with great wrath,because he knows that his time is short!”
The decision is with us ,God has given us free will ,to decide either good or evil
Sirach 15:14 It was he who created humankind in the beginning,and he left them in the power of their own free choice.15 If you choose, you can keep the commandments,and to act faithfully is a matter of your own choice.16 He has placed before you fire (fire is for destruction Hell)and water(water is for life eternal);stretch out your hand for whichever you choose.17 Before each person are life and death,and whichever one chooses will be given.18 For great is the wisdom of the Lord;he is mighty in power and sees everything;19 his eyes are on those who fear him,and he knows every human action.20 He has not commanded anyone to be wicked,and he has not given anyone permission to sin.
Revelation 3:21 To the one who conquers I will give a place with me on my throne, just as I myself conquered and sat down with my Father on his throne.
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auroraaustralis
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so basically you mean. human desires are naturally sinful but if they are in limit and with accordance to God’s words. They’re fine. For example sexual desire is natural and to fulfil it. marriage is good but fornication/premature sex is a sin. Desire to earning for raising one’s standard of living is good but accomplishing it with evil means is wrong. So desire itself is not a sin. But sometimes it does become temptation. And we should not give in to it. Am I right?
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Francis
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@auroraaustralis
Proverbs 13:11 Wealth hastily gotten will dwindle,but those who gather little by little will increase it.
Jeremiah 17:11 Like the partridge hatching what it did not lay,so are all who amass wealth unjustly;in mid-life it will leave them,and at their end they will prove to be fools.
After the sin of Adam and Eve ,our human nature has changed in sense from the state of Grace to the fallen nature of sinful inclinations,and tendencies to sin ,our inordinate desires to sin is always present ,for that by the sacraments and the Mass ,by our prayers ,we practice our faith to that of holy desires and on the virtues as mentioned in Gal 5: 22 By contrast, the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, generosity, faithfulness, 23 gentleness, and self-control. There is no law against such things.
Yes ,but with in the bounds of the Sacrament of Matrimony
Yes, your right! remember sins has consequences
Right ,we need for our sustenance ,and if you earn well you also have the obligation to help other poor people who are in need according to your means
Not only wrong but sinful because it deprives others of their rights ,Money earned by unjust means will never sustain or remain at the time of calamity
Proverbs 13:11 Wealth hastily gotten will dwindle,but those who gather little by little will increase it.
Jeremiah 17:11 Like the partridge hatching what it did not lay,so are all who amass wealth unjustly;in mid-life it will leave them,and at their end they will prove to be fools.
No ,but inordinate desire are sinful
Yes your Right! Matthew 18:7 Woe to the world because of stumbling blocks! Occasions for stumbling are bound to come, but woe to the one by whom the stumbling block comes!
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