What is wrong with the old testament?

[ReformedCatholic]

porthos11:

So you do not accept the New Testament’s (never mind the Church’s) declarations that the OT is inspired of God?

Sure, I think that some of it clearly is. Some of it is clearly questionable. It would help to know who in the NT was making the declarations about the OT and in what context they were making them. And no, I don’t automatically believe something just because the Church says so.

 

[Zeke2517]

I don’t know I’ve tried to read it. I usually get more wrapped up in the craziness of it all and can’t focus on finding anything useful, unless my goat is becoming a deamon.

So someone mentioned how it wasn’t made for a 200 AD New Yorker, I’ll buy that. Then what relevance could it have in 400 BC or whatever?

 

[kquinn]

Some Cathechism info:

CCC 121 The Old Testament is an indispensable part of the Sacred Scripture. Its books are divinely inspired and retain a permanent value, for the Old Covenant has never been broken.

CCC 123 Christians venerate the Old Testament as true Word of God. The Church has always vigorously opposed the idea of rejecting the Old Testament under teh pretext that the New has rendered it void (Marcionism).

Also see: CCC 122, & 128-30

It is important that we don’t make personal judgements on what “is inspired” and what “isn’t inspired”, for instance, what one person may personally feel to be inspired another may find to be clearly uninspired. The Church has deemed all the OT to be inspired and has an infinitely greater authority to determine this.

Hope the CCC refs help,
God bless,
k

 

[ReformedCatholic]

kquinn:

Some Cathechism info:

CCC 121 The Old Testament is an indispensable part of the Sacred Scripture. Its books are divinely inspired and retain a permanent value, for the Old Covenant has never been broken.

CCC 123 Christians venerate the Old Testament as true Word of God. The Church has always vigorously opposed the idea of rejecting the Old Testament under teh pretext that the New has rendered it void (Marcionism).

Also see: CCC 122, & 128-30

It is important that we don’t make personal judgements on what “is inspired” and what “isn’t inspired”, for instance, what one person may personally feel to be inspired another may find to be clearly uninspired. The Church has deemed all the OT to be inspired and has an infinitely greater authority to determine this.

Hope the CCC refs help,
God bless,
k

Thanks for the CCC info.

The church may have more “authority” to claim it with regards to the church, but doing so does not necessarily make the church correct on the issue, in my opinion.

It certainly doesn’t make it automatically valid to me when there is so much that just doesn’t make sense in the OT with regard to its relevance to today.

We were given a mind with which to reason, analyze, and scrutinize. This is how we arrive at what is true. This is how we develop our belief and values systems.

But I think it’s my own responsibility to discern what is true versus what isn’t for my life and how I choose to live.

I think the OT IS divinely inspired, and is probably particularly relevant to the Jewish faith. It actually probably makes a lot more sense to them. My issue is that the OT doesn’t “fit” with the NT in tone or content with regard to Christianity.

What if Marcion was right?

 

[kquinn]

We were given a mind with which to reason, analyze, and scrutinize. This is how we arrive at what is true. This is how we develop our belief and values systems.

I agree that the OT doesn’t necessarily fit with the NT in tone (or content as it only prophesied the coming of Christ, and the NT was composed after his coming/teachings). With regard to Marcion, he through out the entire OT, which makes no sense if even a fraction of it is inspired and relevant today (interestingly he also discarded all of the NT not clearly authored by Paul). Considering that Christ often referrenced the OT, Marcions method doesn’t seem that impelling. (for other oddities of Marcion see: catholic.com/thisrock/1994/9403hotm.asp)

Very true that we were given minds to reason, analyze, and scrutinize. It is important to get to know our faith and our God through our quests for truth. One thing that has helped me come to a better understanding of the OT is good studies involving it’s history, etc.

God bless,
k

 

[ReformedCatholic]

kquinn:

We were given a mind with which to reason, analyze, and scrutinize. This is how we arrive at what is true. This is how we develop our belief and values systems.

I agree that the OT doesn’t necessarily fit with the NT in tone (or content as it only prophesied the coming of Christ, and the NT was composed after his coming/teachings). With regard to Marcion, he through out the entire OT, which makes no sense if even a fraction of it is inspired and relevant today (interestingly he also discarded all of the NT not clearly authored by Paul). Considering that Christ often referrenced the OT, Marcions method doesn’t seem that impelling. (for other oddities of Marcion see: catholic.com/thisrock/1994/9403hotm.asp)

Very true that we were given minds to reason, analyze, and scrutinize. It is important to get to know our faith and our God through our quests for truth. One thing that has helped me come to a better understanding of the OT is good studies involving it’s history, etc.

God bless,
k

I agree with you that Marcion was not correct to exclude the OT in its entirety. And excluding the NT is nutty.And it is because Christ referenced the OT that I believe it to contain divine inspiration

Actually, I’m still irritated that ALL the books that were EVER considered part of the Bible are not in there! I would love to sift through some of that.

I agree that the OT has a wealth of great knowledge, culture, tradition, and history.