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catholica
Guest
Websites like that are a dime a dozen.
We don’t deny historical truths.
…but if one wants to learn the truth of these events, they certainly can’t learn it from that site. Do some digging. You will find that indeed there were Popes that sinned publicly.
I wonder if your Anti-Catholic friend thinks all Protestants are bad because of What’s-His-Name that visited the prostitute…or because of Jim Baker’s sin.
…or maybe that all Emron employees are bad…
…or all Brits are bad…just look at the evil Henry VIII…
We don’t deny historical truths.
…but if one wants to learn the truth of these events, they certainly can’t learn it from that site. Do some digging. You will find that indeed there were Popes that sinned publicly.
I wonder if your Anti-Catholic friend thinks all Protestants are bad because of What’s-His-Name that visited the prostitute…or because of Jim Baker’s sin.
…or maybe that all Emron employees are bad…
…or all Brits are bad…just look at the evil Henry VIII…
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Sean_O_L
Guest
Sirach directed the readers to
conspiracyarchive.com/Commentary/popes.htm
It appears that the main source of that website’s data is:
“According to Catholic historian Peter de Rosa in his book Vicars of Christ”
Fr. Paul Stenhouse, M.S.C., Ph.D. and others have published several articles on Peter de Rosa and his Vicars of Christ
Editorial - A Wolf in Wolf’s Clothing VICARS OF CHRIST The Dark Side of the Papacy By Peter de Rosa CORGI BOOKS In a Note to the reader, the author claims to be a ‘friend’ of the Catholic Church. …
jloughnan.tripod.com/voc.htm
… Papacy, prepares us for the contents, but not completely — this is a sick book. The author. Peter de Rosa, studied for the priesthood at the Pontifical Gregorian University, Rome. After ordination he …
jloughnan.tripod.com/voc1.htm
… Adventist prophet Ellen White’s The Great Controversy: Nino Lo Bello’s The Vatican Empire; Peter de Rosa’s Vicars of Christ: The Dark Side of the Papacy; Michael Baigent’s The Holy Blood and the Holy …
jloughnan.tripod.com/voc2.htm
… posing as dispassionate commentators; Vicars of Christ: The Dark Side of the Papacy, by Peter de Rosa; and Papal idolatry by Pastor Chiniquy, both former Catholic priests. These latter works were looked …
jloughnan.tripod.com/voc3.htm
conspiracyarchive.com/Commentary/popes.htm
It appears that the main source of that website’s data is:
“According to Catholic historian Peter de Rosa in his book Vicars of Christ”
Fr. Paul Stenhouse, M.S.C., Ph.D. and others have published several articles on Peter de Rosa and his Vicars of Christ
Editorial - A Wolf in Wolf’s Clothing VICARS OF CHRIST The Dark Side of the Papacy By Peter de Rosa CORGI BOOKS In a Note to the reader, the author claims to be a ‘friend’ of the Catholic Church. …
jloughnan.tripod.com/voc.htm
… Papacy, prepares us for the contents, but not completely — this is a sick book. The author. Peter de Rosa, studied for the priesthood at the Pontifical Gregorian University, Rome. After ordination he …
jloughnan.tripod.com/voc1.htm
… Adventist prophet Ellen White’s The Great Controversy: Nino Lo Bello’s The Vatican Empire; Peter de Rosa’s Vicars of Christ: The Dark Side of the Papacy; Michael Baigent’s The Holy Blood and the Holy …
jloughnan.tripod.com/voc2.htm
… posing as dispassionate commentators; Vicars of Christ: The Dark Side of the Papacy, by Peter de Rosa; and Papal idolatry by Pastor Chiniquy, both former Catholic priests. These latter works were looked …
jloughnan.tripod.com/voc3.htm
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dcmac
Guest
“An anti-Catholic asked me to post this for you all.”
What I don’t understand is why, during this time especially, would you post it for them at all?
Would you do anything/everything an anti-Catholic asked you?
What reason(s) lie behind doing such a thing now?
Is there some sort of profit of any kind in it for you to do so?
I am obviously confused…
What I don’t understand is why, during this time especially, would you post it for them at all?
Would you do anything/everything an anti-Catholic asked you?
What reason(s) lie behind doing such a thing now?
Is there some sort of profit of any kind in it for you to do so?
I am obviously confused…
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Exporter
Guest
Sirach14,
**You say an anti-Catholic asked you to post that site address. Here is the first paragraph."**On the evening of Saturday April 2, 2005, after receiving the Rite of Extreme Unction, Pope John Paul II passed away. At this time his chamberlain would have gone to the papal hospital bed and asked the Bishop of Rome a question, “Are you dead?” There would be no reply from the Pope. The chamberlain would then pick up a silver hammer and strike the Pope on the head and repeat his question, “Are you dead?” Again there would be no reply. The chamberlain would then thrice call out the Pope’s baptismal name. He would then declare the Pope to be dead. "
Isn’t that stupid? Yes it is. The writer was very lax. It says the chamberlain taps the Pope on the head and asks,“Are you dead?”
If he was dead does anyone think he would answer? What a stupid question. If you were dead and I asked you if you were dead, would I expect an answer? Oh my, what a dumb question. So when we see an article started like this then the remainder can be discounted.
**You say an anti-Catholic asked you to post that site address. Here is the first paragraph."**On the evening of Saturday April 2, 2005, after receiving the Rite of Extreme Unction, Pope John Paul II passed away. At this time his chamberlain would have gone to the papal hospital bed and asked the Bishop of Rome a question, “Are you dead?” There would be no reply from the Pope. The chamberlain would then pick up a silver hammer and strike the Pope on the head and repeat his question, “Are you dead?” Again there would be no reply. The chamberlain would then thrice call out the Pope’s baptismal name. He would then declare the Pope to be dead. "
Isn’t that stupid? Yes it is. The writer was very lax. It says the chamberlain taps the Pope on the head and asks,“Are you dead?”
If he was dead does anyone think he would answer? What a stupid question. If you were dead and I asked you if you were dead, would I expect an answer? Oh my, what a dumb question. So when we see an article started like this then the remainder can be discounted.
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maryalene
Guest
I had a friend who was very insistent that the Catholic Church wasn’t worth believing in because of all the horrible popes in the past. I told him that I felt that knowing about those popes only strengthened my resolve that the Holy Spirit guides and protects the Church. A man-made institution surely would have fallen to pieces during those dark years. However, the Holy Spirit has been with us and ensured that God’s Church is not destroyed by man’s sinfulness. The fact that we survived those times and are still here today proves to me that the Church truly is guided by a higher power.
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Gracie2004
Guest
My question just echoes what’s already been said…WHY would you post such a thing for some anti-catholic friend…and why now??? I would refuse…but that’s just my sense of morality at play.
Gracie
Gracie
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Fidelis
Guest
Sirach14 seems to do this a lot. I’ve questioned him (or her) about it in other threads but have yet to get a reply.
With “Catholics” like this, the anti-Catholics don’t have to work half as hard.
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HagiaSophia
Guest
Perhaps these will be of help in describing the ritual:
CNN reports that the Vatican announced the Pope’s death by email and also has this detail of a decidedly old-fashioned ritual:
The Vatican’s chamberlain … verifies the papal death – which in the past was done by striking the pope’s forehead with a silver hammer. The chamberlain, or camerlengo, then calls out to the pope three times by his baptismal name. When the pope does not respond, the camerlengo then announces “the pope is dead.”
and here’s another for your ready reference on the duties of the camerlengo:
Chief among the present responsibilities of the Camerlengo is the formal determination of the death of the reigning Pope;** the traditional procedure for this was to strike gently the Pope’s head three times with a silver hammer and to call his name.** After the Pope is declared to be dead, the Camerlengo removes the Ring of the Fisherman from his finger and cuts it with shears in the presence of the Cardinals, and also destroys the face of the Pope’s seal with the silver hammer. These acts symbolize the end of the late Pope’s authority. The Camerlengo then notifies the appropriate officers of the Roman Curia and the Dean of the College of Cardinals. He is then involved with the preparations concerning the conclave and the Pope’s funeral.( Wikipedia)
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HagiaSophia
Guest
Perhaps they are not Catholic.
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Mysty101
Guest
The report I was watching said they no longer strike the forehead with the silver hammer, but the do call the name three times.
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Sirach14
Guest
dcmac said:“An anti-Catholic asked me to post this for you all.”
What I don’t understand is why, during this time especially, would you post it for them at all?
Would you do anything/everything an anti-Catholic asked you?
What reason(s) lie behind doing such a thing now?
Is there some sort of profit of any kind in it for you to do so?
I am obviously confused…
I confess it was a stupid move.
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Sirach14
Guest
As I mentioned already, it was a stupid move on my part.
The individual says he is not anti-Catholic, but he played a major part in taking his Catholic wife out of the Catholic Church.
I really believe that he and his wife are still guility over this move; this is why he continues to attack the Catholic Church.
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Sirach14
Guest
When anti-Catholics tell us about the bad popes, I usually will tell them to check out Jesus’ family tree, in the first chapter of St. Matthew.
JUDAH was involved in an incestuous relationship.
DAVID was guilty of adultery and murder.
SOLOMON was given to womanizing and idolatry.
MANASSEH ’ shed so much innocent blood that he flooded Jerusalem.’
AMON ’ worshipped idols and forsook the Lord.’
Mind you, these were the leaders of God’s chosen people.
JUDAH was involved in an incestuous relationship.
DAVID was guilty of adultery and murder.
SOLOMON was given to womanizing and idolatry.
MANASSEH ’ shed so much innocent blood that he flooded Jerusalem.’
AMON ’ worshipped idols and forsook the Lord.’
Mind you, these were the leaders of God’s chosen people.
If the anti-Catholic can't believe that the likes of those "bad popes" were the forebears of the incarnate Son of God-- guess what? But they were.- Status