F
fulloftruth
Guest
Many Protestants when pushed to give an answer on the Canon state that they(the early Church) all agreed on what was scriptural and what was not and that the Church was ratifying what everyone already believed was inspired. Yet the original source’s tell us a different story. The early church held different views on how many books were included in the New Testament. Not all of the communities agreed on what came from the Apostles.
All of the lists agree on the four Gospels, at least. In the 170-180’s Muritorian Canon or Fragment accepted the Acts of the Apostles, 13 Epistles of Paul (excluding Hebrews), Jude, 2 letters of John(not 3), the Apocolypse(Revelation),and the apocolypse of Peter(which was later rejected), and the book of Wisdom.
St Clement of Alexandria in his Stromateus Book 3 included 14 Letters of Paul , Acts, 1 Peter, 1 and 2 John, Jude, Revelation, the Apocolypse of Peter, The preaching Of Peter, the Sheppard Of Hermas, The letter of St.Barnabus, The 1st Letter of Clement the pope of Rome.
St Iraneus in his Book 2 Against Heresies, had 12 Letters of Paul, did not Philemon, and with some reserve he mentions Hebrews. He includes 1 Peter ,1 and 2 John, Revelation, but includes the Sheperd of Hermas as well
Tertulian of Carthage had 13 Epistles of Paul, did not include Acts, did include 1 Peter, 1 John, Jude, but not Revelation.
These are the first 4 lists we have.
Origen, Who was the first Scripture Scholar in the Church, working with Hebrew and Greek Translations,accepted Hebrews and Revelation, was the first to accept the letter of James and 2 Peter, also 2 and 3 John, though he mentions they are disputed, and also accepts the Didache and St Barnabas.
Dionysis who became the Patriarch of Alexandria in 231, questioned the book of Revelation but accepted it.
Lucian, who was the head of a scripture school at Antioch rejected the Book of Revelation.
In the East the Book of Revelation was not widely accepted.
Bishop Eusebius of Ceasaria had doubts about James, Jude, 2 Peter, 2 and 3 John, and Revelation but includes them in the list he sends to the Emperor Constatine
St Ceril of Jerusalem and St Gregory Naziensus had 26 books but not Revelation.
Epiphanius of Constantia did Accept Rev.
St. Athenasius the Patriarch of Alexandria, finally accepts 27 books of the New Testament
But St John Chrisistom did not use 2 Peter, 3 John, Jude, and Rev.
The Council at Laodicea in approx 343 also cmae up with a list with the same new test but a slightly diff old test.
St. Jerome had 27 books after he was charged with doing the research and made his report to the Synod of Rome which came up with the same list Cathoilcs use today, even though Jerome himself did not think the OT had 46 Books He only thought 39
The Synod of Rome in 382 and the Synods of Hippo and Carthage finally agreed on the Canon.
My question is what source does a Protestant have to substantiate the claim that Scripture was self evident and if so why did it take so long for a Canon to be finalized. And under what Authority did they eliminate some texts and include others. If it was the Spirit who led them. Where is that in the Bible #1 and if it was the Apostolic Church that Christ estabolished that determined the canon, where does it say in Scripture that that Church would lose its Authority after the 4th century?
All of the lists agree on the four Gospels, at least. In the 170-180’s Muritorian Canon or Fragment accepted the Acts of the Apostles, 13 Epistles of Paul (excluding Hebrews), Jude, 2 letters of John(not 3), the Apocolypse(Revelation),and the apocolypse of Peter(which was later rejected), and the book of Wisdom.
St Clement of Alexandria in his Stromateus Book 3 included 14 Letters of Paul , Acts, 1 Peter, 1 and 2 John, Jude, Revelation, the Apocolypse of Peter, The preaching Of Peter, the Sheppard Of Hermas, The letter of St.Barnabus, The 1st Letter of Clement the pope of Rome.
St Iraneus in his Book 2 Against Heresies, had 12 Letters of Paul, did not Philemon, and with some reserve he mentions Hebrews. He includes 1 Peter ,1 and 2 John, Revelation, but includes the Sheperd of Hermas as well
Tertulian of Carthage had 13 Epistles of Paul, did not include Acts, did include 1 Peter, 1 John, Jude, but not Revelation.
These are the first 4 lists we have.
Origen, Who was the first Scripture Scholar in the Church, working with Hebrew and Greek Translations,accepted Hebrews and Revelation, was the first to accept the letter of James and 2 Peter, also 2 and 3 John, though he mentions they are disputed, and also accepts the Didache and St Barnabas.
Dionysis who became the Patriarch of Alexandria in 231, questioned the book of Revelation but accepted it.
Lucian, who was the head of a scripture school at Antioch rejected the Book of Revelation.
In the East the Book of Revelation was not widely accepted.
Bishop Eusebius of Ceasaria had doubts about James, Jude, 2 Peter, 2 and 3 John, and Revelation but includes them in the list he sends to the Emperor Constatine
St Ceril of Jerusalem and St Gregory Naziensus had 26 books but not Revelation.
Epiphanius of Constantia did Accept Rev.
St. Athenasius the Patriarch of Alexandria, finally accepts 27 books of the New Testament
But St John Chrisistom did not use 2 Peter, 3 John, Jude, and Rev.
The Council at Laodicea in approx 343 also cmae up with a list with the same new test but a slightly diff old test.
St. Jerome had 27 books after he was charged with doing the research and made his report to the Synod of Rome which came up with the same list Cathoilcs use today, even though Jerome himself did not think the OT had 46 Books He only thought 39
The Synod of Rome in 382 and the Synods of Hippo and Carthage finally agreed on the Canon.
My question is what source does a Protestant have to substantiate the claim that Scripture was self evident and if so why did it take so long for a Canon to be finalized. And under what Authority did they eliminate some texts and include others. If it was the Spirit who led them. Where is that in the Bible #1 and if it was the Apostolic Church that Christ estabolished that determined the canon, where does it say in Scripture that that Church would lose its Authority after the 4th century?