Who are the Free Masons and what did they do to the Faith?

[TheWarriorMonk]

It is a long video, but very interesting in it’s content.

Yes it is long, but I wouldn’t call it interesting. Much of it seems to be personal opinion. Do you have reference to official Church documents supporting his claims, such as, say, the direct connection between Fatima and Freemasonry?

 

[Pulvis]

Yes it is long, but I wouldn’t call it interesting. Much of it seems to be personal opinion. Do you have reference to official Church documents supporting his claims, such as, say, the direct connection between Fatima and Freemasonry?

I will not attempt to expand or define Mr. Salza’s dissertation. He did a proper job of that in the address. I merely pointed you to the comments of a former Mason, and a practicing Catholic who is warning other Catholics of the dangers within masonry. I did this in response to your allegations in your comment concerning “wild, baseless accusations”. You may reject Mr. Salza’s comments or not, your option.
Either way, the Church has not relented in Her admonitions and anathema against Catholics becoming involved in masonry.

 

[TEPO]

Which 32nd or 33rd degree Mason did you get this information from?

Obviously, masonic activity and ideas do not conform with those of Catholicism. But wild, baseless accusations by people who could have no knowledge of such things isn’t helpful to discussion of theses points. Fact is, it’s hearsay, and conspiracy-type nonsense.

You’re wrong.

Freemasonry is so much like Catholicism that its almost as if they used the Catholic Church as a template for their own structure. They have their own Rites, deacons, altars, temples, mysteries, etc, etc, etc… But most importantly, as I’ve pointed out here is that they have their own initiation process similar to our catechumens -its not until they reach the 32nd or 33rd degree that they become Master Masons, in other words they are then fully initiated into their cult. At that point, they might choose to remain in blue lodge to ‘teach’ or they might advance to the Scottish Rite or some other lodge to further their cause.

…I think you should do some research for yourself on this topic instead of lumping every detail into some self invented “conspiracy hoax” -especially when Masonic traditions and beliefs are so easy to get. What you are doing is very ignorant.

…you should study up on *Hiram Abiff *and Tubalcain for starters… That would be a good introduction in learning about the cult of Freemasonry.

 

[april32010]

http://chirho.me/memes/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/masonfishfry.jpg

 

[TheWarriorMonk]

I will not attempt to expand or define Mr. Salza’s dissertation. He did a proper job of that in the address. I merely pointed you to the comments of a former Mason, and a practicing Catholic who is warning other Catholics of the dangers within masonry. I did this in response to your allegations in your comment concerning “wild, baseless accusations”. You may reject Mr. Salza’s comments or not, your option.
Either way, the Church has not relented in Her admonitions and anathema against Catholics becoming involved in masonry.

I readily admit I was cringing at quite a few things he was saying, because he is reputedly an Apologist and seems to be making wild statements that seem to be personal opinions rather than reflecting the Church’s positions on such manners. All Apologists I’ve ever come across are very straightforward with the Church’s position on issues of faith and morals.

 

[TheWarriorMonk]

You’re wrong.

FWIW, I am no supporter of masonry. I know plenty of masons, and could become a mason in an instant. Besides having a strong independent streak, I utterly reject it.

The issue is simply that what is often stated about them does not match up with what is observed. And oftentimes the statements are baseless or suspect.

It’s not just limited to masonry either; it ubiquitous, covering all groups and peoples that we are not intimately familiar with.

…I think you should do some research for yourself on this topic instead of lumping every detail into some self invented “conspiracy hoax” -especially when Masonic traditions and beliefs are so easy to get. What you are doing is very ignorant.

I prefer to get my information firsthand, rather than reading someone’s opinion on the matter. One thing I’ve learned over the course of my years is that if one is not intimate with an issue, there perspective is often heavily biased toward a conclusion. It is rare that I meet a person the knows both sides of an issue and draws a conclusion based on the big picture.

 

[TEPO]

Freemasonry is a mockery of religion.

 

[mymamamary]

FWIW, I am no supporter of masonry. I know plenty of masons, and could become a mason in an instant. Besides having a strong independent streak, I utterly reject it.

The issue is simply that what is often stated about them does not match up with what is observed. And oftentimes the statements are baseless or suspect.

It’s not just limited to masonry either; it ubiquitous, covering all groups and peoples that we are not intimately familiar with.

I prefer to get my information firsthand, rather than reading someone’s opinion on the matter. One thing I’ve learned over the course of my years is that if one is not intimate with an issue, there perspective is often heavily biased toward a conclusion. It is rare that I meet a person the knows both sides of an issue and draws a conclusion based on the big picture.

**Pope Leo XIII condemned Masonry outright in His encyclical “Humanum Genus” (in fact the whole encyclical was devoted to masonry). If the voice of St. Peter and by virtue of the Petrine office, the Voice of CHRIST is not enough, then I do not know what could ever be. The big picture is that the tenets of masonry violate Catholicism. Not only that, but Masons have persecuted and still persecute Catholics outrightly in various countries. Mexico is an example. The anti-clerical laws are still in effect! Nothing would stop a Mexican police officer from doing what they were doing to Priests in “For Greater Glory” today, except that they do not enforce this law anymore. This is hardly an excuse. Masonry’s upper echelons are evil. Period. **

 

[jesuspsr]

This may be true in some countries, but I have not seen in here. In fact, it the complete opposite. They are not interested in politics, nor are they interested in persecuting anyone of any religion, Catholics include.

Once again, it depends on where. Here there are basically three degrees. It should also be noted that people with no knowledge of masonry seem to have great knowledge about the “32nd and 33rd” degrees. How did they get this knowledge…certainly not from anyone that is reputedly a 32nd or 33rd degree mason.

I have to kindly disagree with you here and your earlier post. Or should I say, I’ve had a different experience with men that tried to recruit me. First of all, They do, do lot of good for children in need. They’ve built hospitals just for children.

At work we had a volunteer in our department. It was he out of the others that I knew that tried to recruit me into free masonry. He told me he was 33rd degree, and showed me his ring, then he showed me his neckless that here wore.

He got more interested in me after I told him that I was a 4th degree in the Knights of Columbus. He shared with me a hand shake. He said that we’re everywhere around the world and in very high place in government and that if I got into trouble and ended up in front of the judge all I would have to do was give him a hand sign, if he was a member he would help in my favor. He never showed me the hand sign though.

I could go on but Im not good at making anything I type make sence so i’ll leave it at that.

God bless

jesus g

 

[Edward_H]

I know a very solid thinking priest who says Free Masonry in one derivative form or another is responsible for just about all the major assaults on Christianity…even the militant gay agenda. Including Bolshevism, nearly all strains of Atheism

 

[TheWarriorMonk]

He got more interested in me after I told him that I was a 4th degree in the Knights of Columbus. He shared with me a hand shake. He said that we’re everywhere around the world and in very high place in government and that if I got into trouble and ended up in front of the judge all I would have to do was give him a hand sign, if he was a member he would help in my favor. He never showed me the hand sign though.

This is highly inconsistent with the masons I know. Maybe they don’t know the hand sign, because they sure could use a whole lot of help with a whole lot of things. To put it bluntly, I’m in a lot better shape in my life then they are in theirs.

 

[Elizium23]

This just in:

Freemasonry and Christianity are incompatible

Also in the headlines:

Bear poops in woods
Water is wet
Death is fatal.

 

[jesuspsr]

This is highly inconsistent with the masons I know. Maybe they don’t know the hand sign, because they sure could use a whole lot of help with a whole lot of things. To put it bluntly, I’m in a lot better shape in my life then they are in theirs.

I agree with you there.

 

[gamewell45]

From what I’m told the Freemasons were a order formed after the pope disbanded the Templar order. With that said these Templars were mad so the formed the Freemasons that try to abolish and cause trouble directed towards the Catholic Church. That is why we can’t be masons they seek to be rid of our church and what it stands for. Their order also has beliefs that are entirely contrary to Catholics and all of Christianity .

Modern Freemasonry was formed in 1717. I’ve been a Freemason for many years and I’ve yet to hear any discussion whatsoever of the Catholic Church in our lodges. In fact, the discussion of religion and/or politics is strictly forbidden in open lodge. While it is true that some of our beliefs are in conflict with the teachings Roman Catholic Church, we respect the church’s position on Freemasonry, although we do not necessarily agree with it.

Interestingly, over 40% of my lodge is comprised of Roman Catholics; moreover it is not uncommon for us to hold event’s in conjuction with the KofC for fund raisers, etc. We even have had breakfast’s together to show that both groups can live in harmony.

 

[gamewell45]

I have to kindly disagree with you here and your earlier post. Or should I say, I’ve had a different experience with men that tried to recruit me. First of all, They do, do lot of good for children in need. They’ve built hospitals just for children.

At work we had a volunteer in our department. It was he out of the others that I knew that tried to recruit me into free masonry. He told me he was 33rd degree, and showed me his ring, then he showed me his neckless that here wore.

He got more interested in me after I told him that I was a 4th degree in the Knights of Columbus. He shared with me a hand shake. He said that we’re everywhere around the world and in very high place in government and that if I got into trouble and ended up in front of the judge all I would have to do was give him a hand sign, if he was a member he would help in my favor. He never showed me the hand sign though.

I could go on but Im not good at making anything I type make sence so i’ll leave it at that.

God bless

jesus g

Based on what you said here, I highly doubt he was a Freemason. Anyone can buy Masonic jewelerly and claim to be a Freemason. Furthermore, no Freemason can go in front of a judge and “give him a handsign” in order to curry favor. That goes against the teachings of Freemasonry. I think you’ve been mislead by this volunteer.

 

[Pulvis]

Modern Freemasonry was formed in 1717. I’ve been a Freemason for many years and I’ve yet to hear any discussion whatsoever of the Catholic Church in our lodges. In fact, the discussion of religion and/or politics is strictly forbidden in open lodge. While it is true that some of our beliefs are in conflict with the teachings Roman Catholic Church, we respect the church’s position on Freemasonry, although we do not necessarily agree with it.

Interestingly, over 40% of my lodge is comprised of Roman Catholics; moreover it is not uncommon for us to hold event’s in conjuction with the KofC for fund raisers, etc. We even have had breakfast’s together to show that both groups can live in harmony.

Then, unfortunately, 40% of your lodge are Catholics in disobedience to the Church and Her teachings. Which, by the way, was what was spelled out in this document from the Freemasons in Italy as to the infiltration and destruction of the Catholic Church:
scribd.com/doc/31483053/Permanent-Instruction-of-the-Alta-Vendita

“A lie is still a lie, even if everyone believes it. And the Truth is still the Truth, even if no one believes it!” Venerable +Archbishop Fulton J. Sheen

FYI, i do not subscribe to the views of the parent site from which the Alta Vendita was posted.

 

[1AugustSon7]

Modern Freemasonry was formed in 1717. I’ve been a Freemason for many years and I’ve yet to hear any discussion whatsoever of the Catholic Church in our lodges. In fact, the discussion of religion and/or politics is strictly forbidden in open lodge.

Which

Is

Exactly

The

blinking]

Problem.

bang head repeatedly against table

This is the mother of secularization. It habitualizes the dupe into practical atheism. The hoodwinked is now fully accustomed to environments devoid of Christ and even acquires an animus against the mentioning of Christ: IOW, God is made to be practically irrelevant.

It is so obviously not a coincidence that Freemasonry took its modern form in England in 1717; a nation torn by perpetual religious controversies for already more than 1.5 centuries that often broke out into civil strife and even civil bloodshed up to civil war. Thus the lodge appeared as a format that could ostensibly replace Christianity as a locus for cultural unity applicable to the ordinarily and necessarily religious domains of, e.g., the arts and learning but even social and political deliberations. In other words, the lodge taught men how to get on without Christ - without God. That - as Pope Francis was quoted earlier above as saying - is the great sweeping out of the carpet underneath your feet. To build on anything other than Christ (or Truth) is a doomed project and a vanity. It will make susceptible to shipwreck even whole nations.

Learning to get on without God (Christ) or Christianity (religion) was hitherto unthinkable for the mind and habit of most Britains and Europeans, even if He was controversial. It was a true novelty.

 

[gamewell45]

Which

Is

Exactly

The

blinking]

Problem.

bang head repeatedly against table

This is the mother of secularization. It habitualizes the dupe into practical atheism. The hoodwinked is now fully accustomed to environments devoid of Christ and even acquires an animus against the mentioning of Christ: IOW, God is made to be practically irrelevant.

It is so obviously not a coincidence that Freemasonry took its modern form in England in 1717; a nation torn by perpetual religious controversies for already more than 1.5 centuries that often broke out into civil strife and even civil bloodshed up to civil war. Thus the lodge appeared as a format that could ostensibly replace Christianity as a locus for cultural unity applicable to the ordinarily and necessarily religious domains of, e.g., the arts and learning but even social and political deliberations. In other words, the lodge taught men how to get on without Christ - without God. That - as Pope Francis was quoted earlier above as saying - is the great sweeping out of the carpet underneath your feet. To build on anything other than Christ (or Truth) is a doomed project and a vanity. It will make susceptible to shipwreck even whole nations.

Learning to get on without God (Christ) or Christianity (religion) was hitherto unthinkable for the mind and habit of most Britains and Europeans, even if He was controversial. It was a true novelty.

You and I will have to agree to disagree on this thread.