Who can "technically" celebrate mass other than a Priest?

[RioDR]

Ok, I ran into something a bit odd for the first time in 38 years of attending mass.

Here’s a little background. Without naming a specific church, I have semi-regularly attended a weekly, Wednesday night Novena at 6:30, followed by a mass at 7:00 for the past 5+ years. Occassionally, I am late coming from work, but usually make it at least to the mass.

Well last Wednesday, I arrived a bit past 7:00. At the lectern, was a regular attendee giving a reading. I thought to myself, “Am I that late?” As I sat down in the pew, I noticed that there was NO Priest present, only the reader and one I supposed is called the “Master of Ceremonies” or in spanish “San Cristian” kind of like a Priest’s assistant.

Ok, so I thought, maybe the Priest went in back to get something or possibly, though unlikely, went to the restroom … an emergency or something.

Well low and behold, after the reader gave the reading, she went over to the Tabernacle, and removed the Eucharist. She did not do the traditional washing of the hands, but she did proceed to Pray over the Gifts to make them holy and acceptable.

I WAS IN SHOCK. I had never ever seen anyone other than a Priest do this. I mean I’ve been to church enough to know the words but I also know those certain words should be coming from a Priest.

We went on to say the Our Father, Sign of Peace, and then she proceeded to give out communion. Now I must say that I DO NOT believe she was EVEN a Eucharistic Minister. I had never in my 5+ years at this service, seen her give out communion until this day.

Everything felt so WRONG! So wrong that my family and I DID NOT go up to recieve communion. Though other people did.

Afterwards, she thanked everyone for attending and said that the Priest would be back next week. The service was over by 7:15

It was like a bad dream that I was waiting to wake up from but never did. I mean it was like in elementary school, when the teacher would leave the class for a few minutes, and the big bully took over and acted like the teacher. I feel like she did something sneaky behind the Priest’s back.

Can she be arrested for impersonating a Priest? Shouldn’t she be reprimanded? Can she be kicked out of the church for that? I don’t think she meant to do anything intentionally malicious, she probably felt she was doing us all a favor for holding service since we all were gathered and the Priest could not attend.

But really, she should have just led a prayer or rosary, actually, she should have ended everything after the Novena.

What are your thoughts? Am I way off base, was she in her right to do what she did? I didn’t think just anyone could Celebrate Mass and Eucharist.

 

[MusicMan]

It sounds to me like you attended a Word and Communion Service, which can occur in place of Mass on Sunday should a priest not be available to celebrate Mass in your area. A Word and Comunion Service can be presided over by a layperson, although it is preferable to have a Deacon do it if one is available. However, I do not know about the propriety of it happening in place of a Daily Mass, and you will likely get a continuum of answers on this topic.

A Word and Communion Service begins with the Liturgy of the Word, and then has a Communion Rite that includes the Lord’s Prayer, the Sign of Peace, and distribution of the Eucharist from the Tabernacle (which means that a priest already consecrated it at a prior Mass). This woman didn’t consecrate anything, nor did she impersonate a priest, as long as she was following the rubrics for a Word and Communion Service, and it sounds like she was. The only thing that I question is the propriety of having a Word and Communion Service in place of Daily Mass.

I would prefer to see someone lead Evening Prayer if a priest is unavailable to say Mass.

Although I indicated that from your description, she did not celebrate Mass, I should point out that a layperson attempting to confect the Sacrifice of the Mass is automatically ex communicated. Of course, one must know that is the penalty for the penalty to occur.

 

[Resurrexit]

Well low and behold, after the reader gave the reading, she went over to the Tabernacle, and removed the Eucharist. She did not do the traditional washing of the hands, but she did proceed to Pray over the Gifts to make them holy and acceptable.

As the other poster said, it may have been a Word and Communion Service. BUT, why on earth did she take the CONSECRATED host out of the tabernacle, and say the prayer over the gifts, as if it was a piece of bread, and she was priest celebrating Mass???

What are your thoughts? Am I way off base, was she in her right to do what she did? I didn’t think just anyone could Celebrate Mass and Eucharist.

Only a priest or someone higher (Monsignor, Bishop, Archbishop, Cardinal or Pope) can celebrate Mass. Technically, a lay person can lead a Word and Communion service, but personally, I think this is an abomination. You don’t get any of that nonsense at the TLM…

 

[Melanie01]

I bought a keyring and pocket rosary ring today in the cathedral shop. I was startled when the shopman then “blessed” the items. I thought it peculiar he just did it, and of course I have no idea if he was an ordained priest or not ( I would not expect a priest at a till).

When I get items blessed my my local priest…by goodness it is more than a casual wave of a cross by the hand…all very odd indeed

 

[1ke]

The Liturgy of the Word with Distribution of Holy Communion is allowable under canon law when the priest is unavailable and it is not possible to attend a Mass.

This type of service is found in Rite for Distributing Holy Communion Outside Mass, which covers several different rites.

 

[prv]

As the other poster said, it may have been a Word and Communion Service. BUT, why on earth did she take the CONSECRATED host out of the tabernacle, and say the prayer over the gifts, as if it was a piece of bread, and she was priest celebrating Mass???

Only a priest or someone higher (Monsignor, Bishop, Archbishop, Cardinal or Pope) can celebrate Mass. Technically, a lay person can lead a Word and Communion service, but personally, I think this is an abomination. You don’t get any of that nonsense at the TLM…

Just a side note—a monsignor is a priest (presbyter), as is a bishop. An archbishop is a bishop. A cardinal is usually a bishop, with the current exception of one, who is a presbyter. See the above. The Pope, properly installed, is the bishop of Rome. So technically speaking, it would be perfectly okay to say that only a priest may celebrate Mass.

That being said, why did the leader say the prayers over the Gifts if they were already consecrated as the body and blood of our Savior?

 

[chicago]

That being said, why did the leader say the prayers over the Gifts if they were already consecrated as the body and blood of our Savior?

Can someone with access to the texts of how these services are supposed to go offer us what “comes next” in prayers for such a service. Perhaps it is possible that what was done is not the “preparation of the gifts” prayer but something similar sounding?

 

[decn2b]

C-A-P Celebration in the Absence of a Priest.

What you witnessed was not a mass…and likely a communion service.

 

[decn2b]

I bought a keyring and pocket rosary ring today in the cathedral shop. I was startled when the shopman then “blessed” the items. I thought it peculiar he just did it, and of course I have no idea if he was an ordained priest or not ( I would not expect a priest at a till).

When I get items blessed my my local priest…by goodness it is more than a casual wave of a cross by the hand…all very odd indeed

A deacon can bless items as well. The priest gets his faculties to bless when he is ordained into the diaconate.

 

[Deacon_Ed]

Can someone with access to the texts of how these services are supposed to go offer us what “comes next” in prayers for such a service. Perhaps it is possible that what was done is not the “preparation of the gifts” prayer but something similar sounding?

Generally in a communion service there is a liturgy of the word (normally the readings for the day). These may or may not be followed by general intercessions. After that the people kneel while the Blessed Sacrament is taken from the tabernacle. This is followed immediately by the Lord’s Prayer and then the “Lord I am not worthy…” and distribution of communion. There is generally a closing prayer and, if the one leading the service is a deacon, a blessing and dismissal.

Deacon Ed

 

[1ke]

Can someone with access to the texts of how these services are supposed to go offer us what “comes next” in prayers for such a service. Perhaps it is possible that what was done is not the “preparation of the gifts” prayer but something similar sounding?

Here is the text for the diocese of Dubuque, IA, that I found online. It appears the bishop has some ability to designate particulars:

arch.pvt.k12.ia.us/Worship/PDFs/WkdayriteHCoutsideMass%20.pdf

arch.pvt.k12.ia.us/Worship/PDFs/PastoralnotesHCOM.pdf

This website had many documents listed:

therealpresence.org/eucharst/link/e-doc.html

perhaps one of those documents has the information you are searching for, I don’t have time to wade through them.

You can also buy the book that contains the rubrics.

 

[Deo_Volente]

Grace & Peace!

I bought a keyring and pocket rosary ring today in the cathedral shop. I was startled when the shopman then “blessed” the items. I thought it peculiar he just did it, and of course I have no idea if he was an ordained priest or not ( I would not expect a priest at a till).

When I get items blessed my my local priest…by goodness it is more than a casual wave of a cross by the hand…all very odd indeed

To my knowledge, the Catechism (1669) says that sacramentals derive from the baptismal priesthood, saying that we are all called to be “a blessing and to bless.”

There is a distinction made, however, between the blessing of a priest and the blessing of a layman. A priest’s blessing, by virtue of his ordination, carries with it the authority of the entire church–whatever personal deficiencies the priest has in his blessing is made up for by the church. A layman’s blessing is done under his or her own authority, and its efficacy is dependent in part on the “sincerity and sanctity” of the person. In short, a blessing seems to be an ex opere operandis affair, with the virtue of the priest supplemented by the dignity of his office.

Some blessings are more appropriate for priests/deacons to perform. But in their absence, it looks like a layperson would indeed be qualified to bless, though the efficacy of the blessing may be questioned.

An alternative scenario: receiving a blessing from a holy monk does not carry with it the authority of a priest’s office, but I would argue it is efficacious nonetheless. The blessing of a pious friend I would argue is also efficacious (but perhaps to a lesser degree). The blessing of a store clerk? Difficult to say without knowing the condition of their soul, but I would argue that their sincerity is not in question.

Under the Mercy,
Mark

Deo Gratias!

 

[Ham1]

Just a side note—a monsignor is a priest (presbyter), as is a bishop. An archbishop is a bishop. A cardinal is usually a bishop, with the current exception of one, who is a presbyter. See the above. The Pope, properly installed, is the bishop of Rome. So technically speaking, it would be perfectly okay to say that only a priest may celebrate Mass.

That being said, why did the leader say the prayers over the Gifts if they were already consecrated as the body and blood of our Savior?

Are you saying there is currently a cardinal who is not a bishop??? Please post more info…Thanks

 

[axolotl]

Are you saying there is currently a cardinal who is not a bishop??? Please post more info…Thanks

Avery Dulles, I think.

 

[mystified]

Can’t say if he’s the only one, but Cardinal Dulles, a member of the Society of Jesus, asked to not be consecrated a bishop when he accepted the Red Hat.

 

[Ham1]

Can’t say if he’s the only one, but Cardinal Dulles, a member of the Society of Jesus, asked to not be consecrated a bishop when he accepted the Red Hat.

Thanks! I had no idea. I thought he had been consecrated after his appointment. Thanks for the info

 

[Rustyxcv]

To the poster who mentioned the store clerk blessing a Rosary Key Ring –
– Let’s use a little common sense here. If ANY baptized Christian (let alone a Roman Catholic!) can perform a canonically recognized valid BAPTISM, when using the proper form and proper matter, for an infant or adult unbeliever (in the absence of a priest or deacon), then certainly a devout R.C. shop clerk can give a perfectly good blessing to such an ordinary object as a Rosary Key Ring.
– Call me the world’s worst heretic, but I find it very hard to believe that a Rosary Key Ring blessed by a shop clerk and RE-blessed by a priest (bisop, cardinal, or even the Holy Father, himself) would have significantly more “power” or spiritual efficacy than a Rosary Key Ring that had only been blessed once by a clerk.
– After all, the “power” associated with the sacramental comes from Our Lord, Our Lady, and to a much smaller extent, from the one using it as an aid to prayer. (“MY Rosary is better that your Rosary, because MY Rosary was blessed by a Monsignor and your was ONLY blessed by a seminarian!”) It should be very easy for anyone of sincere heart to tell whose Rosary is going to bring the greater blessings, both to its intercessor and its intercessees – lol. Pax. --Rusty

 

[Phemie]

As the other poster said, it may have been a Word and Communion Service. BUT, why on earth did she take the CONSECRATED host out of the tabernacle, and say the prayer over the gifts, as if it was a piece of bread, and she was priest celebrating Mass???

But is that really what happened? In the Rite for the Sunday Celebration of the Word in Canada the EMHC goes to the get the ciborium from the tabernacle, brings it to the altar and places it on the corporal, takes a Host and shows it saying “This is the Lamb of God who takes away the sins of the world, happy are those who are called to his supper”, we give the usual response.

The rite in Canada, when it includes Communion, is not quite in the same order that it would be at Mass (i.e. the sign of peace comes before the Our Father) precisely to make it very different from Mass and there are no prayers included that could possibly be mistaken for the Eucharistic Prayer.

Even when the offering is taken up after the Prayer After Communion and is not brought forward since there is no ‘Offertory’.