who wrote the quran

[rtconstant]

Muhammad lived his hard life till he died although the Muslim treasury was at his disposal, the greater part of the Arabian Peninsula was Muslim before he died, and the Muslims were victorious after eighteen years of his Mission.

Well he had some discomforts sure. However, it would seem that the rest of Arabia had it much worse once he began his ascension.

Is it possible that Muhammad might have claimed Prophethood in order to attain status, greatness, and power?

Entirely possible as he gained great amounts of all three.

The desire to enjoy status and power is usually associated with good food, fancy clothing, monumental palaces, colorful guards, and indisputable authority. Do any of these indicators apply to Muhammad? A few glimpses of his life that may help answer this question follow.

Not always. In fact luxury is usually sought after more by descendants of great warlords than the warlords themselves. History shows us that the mightiest commanders and generals are often quite disciplined. In short great leaders “work for a living”. They may all still be blood thirsty but mighty generals are seldom fops.

Despite his responsibilities as a Prophet, a teacher, a statesman, and a judge, Muhammad used to milk his goat, mend his clothes, repair his shoes, help with the household work, and visit poor people when they got sick. He also helped his Companions to dig a defensive trench by moving sand with them. His life was an amazing model of simplicity and humbleness.

I’ve often said that in my view Mohammed’s record as a warlord has merit to it. I wouldn’t call his life simple or humble though. No one who who takes as many lives as the Mohammed is humble. No one takes it upon himself to impose a unified social/political system of his own devising on the whole of his people is simple. Anyway, while I don’t begrudge Mohammed’s conquests anymore than I would any other warlord, it is in his role as a prophet that I think most take exception.

 

[famdigy]

mohammed (pbuh) was illiterate , How can an illiterate person come up with such a rich, poetic, intellectual, and inspiring text that it rocked the entire Arabia?

Sorry bro, he was not illiterate, There are lots of evidence to the contrary. Even in Bukhari there are hadiths where the prophet (pbuh&hf) requested they bring him a pen and paper so he would write them a document they would never go astray after him.

He didn’t pen the Quran with his own hands so that people won’t accuse him of writing it. He learned it, memorized it and taught it to others.

Mohammad (pbuh) never went to school! No one taught him. He had no teacher of any kind in any subjects.

yes no human taught him, but as he was taught by Allah (swt), he had a far superior education than any one before or after him.

[Yusufali 53:2] Your Companion is neither astray nor being misled.
[Yusufali 53:3] Nor does he say (aught) of (his own) Desire.
[Yusufali 53:4] It is no less than inspiration sent down to him:
[Yusufali 53:5] He was taught by one Mighty in Power.

 

[famdigy]

I’ve often said that in my view Mohammed’s record as a warlord has merit to it. I wouldn’t call his life simple or humble though. No one who who takes as many lives as the Mohammed is humble. No one takes it upon himself to impose a unified social/political system of his own devising on the whole of his people is simple. Anyway, while I don’t begrudge Mohammed’s conquests anymore than I would any other warlord, it is in his role as a prophet that I think most take exception.

What you fail to mention is that all of the battles fought by The Prophet Muhammad (pbuh&hf) were defensive wars, and whenever the opportunity for peace presented itself the Prophet would accept it even if the Muslims had to agree to unfavorable terms.

A good example of this is the treaty of Hudaybiyyah

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Treaty_of_Hudaybiyyah#Background

 

[atman]

which problem ?
do you consider the agreement of science with quran to be a problem with muslims ? how is that , i thought that it’s advantage not problem

I will agree that it was put rather bluntly and inconsiderately, but this is a serious point. Scripture and science will never contradict one another, but that does not mean they are one another. God, in composing Scripture, did not try to answer questions such as “What is the composition and structure of a given chemical atom?” but rather the one, rather significant question of “how are we to be saved?” Why would God need to inform us of evolution? Spiritually, is an evolutionary biologist better off than a baptized adolescent?

 

[elwill]

There is an enteresting passage in a hadith… it’s rather long but I’ll just post the importance of it…

Volume 3, Book 47, Number 755: Narrated 'Urwa from 'Aisha:

…
He then said to her, “Do not hurt me regarding Aisha, as the Divine Inspirations do not come to me on any of the beds except that of Aisha.” …

Are these “divine inspirations” which created the koran?

Did Gabriel appear to mohamad while in bed wtih Aisha? Hmmmmm!!!

Volume 4, Book 54, Number 440:

Narrated Abu Salama:

’Aisha said that the Prophet said to her “O ‘Aisha’ This is Gabriel and he sends his (greetings) salutations to you.” 'Aisha said, “Salutations (Greetings) to him, and Allah’s Mercy and Blessings be on him,” and addressing the Prophet she said, "You see what I don’t see."

let me say yes , then
your point ?

The koran was made up by mohamad, written down by scribes, later on many years after mohamads death, all bits & pieces gathered and thrown into a book that Uthman put together.

the quran was memorized by hundreds of companions before his death

No one today has the “real koran” as it was written down by the scribes.

prove it

And the “Mary” stories in the koran, they are all butchered and taken from Apocryphal Gospels. Link is enclosed so you may research these books and compare them to the koran.

was this book written in arabic in the time of mohammed (pbuh) , or you suggest that he studied the hebrew languge or may be somone teach him , so i have to know if you have historic records about that teacher , may be his name if you don’t mind

 

[elwill]

I will agree that it was put rather bluntly and inconsiderately, but this is a serious point. Scripture and science will never contradict one another, but that does not mean they are one another. God, in composing Scripture, did not try to answer questions such as “What is the composition and structure of a given chemical atom?” but rather the one, rather significant question of “how are we to be saved?” Why would God need to inform us of evolution? Spiritually, is an evolutionary biologist better off than a baptized adolescent?

i said in later post , that i believe also that quran not scientific book , it’s holy book either
but it contains just indications for the disbelievers as a sign for them that it’s from God
God says in quran
53 - We will show them Our Signs in the (furthest) regions (of the earth), and in their own souls, until it becomes manifest to them that this is (quran) the Truth. Is it not enough that thy Lord doth witness all things?

 

[elwill]

Mohammed could have been sincere in thinking he was a prophet - probably deluded, like you said - but we all know he wasn’t one. He was said to be simple at home. Still, even Hitler was simple at home, to use an extreme example. Mohammed fails in being prophet precisely because he himself gave the revelations that said he was a prophet and because he did not give any signs of prophethood. The so-called “signs” in the Qu’ran are all pseudoscience, like fire being under the water (Muslims point to underwater volcanos as a fulfillment of this scientific knowledge, but those volcanos actually erupt hot gas, not fire).

let me then tell you what was the copanion of the prophet themselfs thought about this verse since 1400 years ago

ARABIC TEXT (Wal bahr al masjoor) (52/6)

ENGLISH VERSION. The ocean keeps heating.

The root word is Arabic for ‘al masjoor’ is ‘sajara’ means heating of the oven.

When we say ‘al bahr al masjoor’ it shall mean ocean keep heating.

Ibn Abbas ( uncle of the prophet) in the explanation of the verse ‘Wa iz al behar sujjerat’ meaning when the oceans will boil up, said, “Allah will send the winds from the west which will change them i.e. oceans into flaming heat.” (Ibn Kathir). This verse pertains to Doomsday when the sun will come close to the moon.

The above condition of the exegetes made it clear that the correct and the dictionary meaning are, ‘and the ocean keeps heating. ‘This is also note worthy that this is not a common statement of the Quran but has been given due emphasis God has adjured by five things in the beginning of this surah and the ocean keep heating being the fifth.

 

[Reuben_J]

jakazaki , i know blind writers , they wrote many books
how did they wrote it , may be someone else wrote for them , right ?
but it’s still when you ask about the writer , the answer will be the name of the blind man , not the name of the man who hold the pen for him

Fact is the Quran was written long after Mohammad’s death.

Since the Quran is word of Allah verbatim, what guarantee is there that what was written by the scribes was accurate word of Allah as revealed to Mohammad word for word? None. In order that it was truly as how Mohammad heard it, the written Quran must be recited back to him for proof reading which was not done as Mohammad was long dead and gone by then.

Remember, the Quran was not an idea or an inspiration but supposed to be a dictation. The Quran is therefore a failure if it were to adhere to the principle of dictation done correctly. Now, we even have not yet considered that there were other versions of the Quran that were burned by Caliph Uthman. Muslims can claim about the originality of the Quran but too bad I see it has nothing but full of holes.

Then of course as we move along we will see great discrepancy about the accuracy of narrative as compared to the Bible, the word of God before it which it supposed to confirm.

 

[elwill]

Fact is the Quran was written long after Mohammad’s death.

how long ?

Since the Quran is word of Allah verbatim, what guarantee is there that what was written by the scribes was accurate word of Allah as revealed to Mohammad word for word? None. In order that it was truly as how Mohammad heard it, the written Quran must be recited back to him for proof reading which was not done as Mohammad was long dead and gone by then.

Remember, the Quran was not an idea or an inspiration but supposed to be a dictation.

what you don’t know is that untill these days ,muslims learning the quran by dictation
there is somthing in islamic studies for quran called " ejaza " , which mean permission ( to learn the quran)
who have that “ejaza” in recite quran , means that he can read the quran exactly as mohammed (pbuh) teach his followers , and the chain of his “ejaza” is recorded from the name of this person to the name of our prophet himself

not every one read arabic can read quran correctly , the muslims must to study it and learn it by detication

The Quran is therefore a failure if it were to adhere to the principle of dictation done correctly. Now, we even have not yet considered that there were other versions of the Quran that were burned by Caliph Uthman. Muslims can claim about the originality of the Quran but too bad I see it has nothing but full of holes.

what is your view about what caliph Uthman did ?
by the way , do you use the same criteria with your bible?

Then of course as we move along we will see great discrepancy about the accuracy of narrative as compared to the Bible, the word of God before it which it supposed to confirm.

yes offcourse , your lost bible ( which is in languge of jesus (pbuh))

 

[Eucharisted]

elwill:
let me then tell you what was the copanion of the prophet themselfs thought about this verse since 1400 years ago

ARABIC TEXT (Wal bahr al masjoor) (52/6)

ENGLISH VERSION. The ocean keeps heating.

The root word is Arabic for ‘al masjoor’ is ‘sajara’ means heating of the oven.

When we say ‘al bahr al masjoor’ it shall mean ocean keep heating.

Ibn Abbas ( uncle of the prophet) in the explanation of the verse ‘Wa iz al behar sujjerat’ meaning when the oceans will boil up, said, “Allah will send the winds from the west which will change them i.e. oceans into flaming heat.” (Ibn Kathir). This verse pertains to Doomsday when the sun will come close to the moon.

The above condition of the exegetes made it clear that the correct and the dictionary meaning are, ‘and the ocean keeps heating. ‘This is also note worthy that this is not a common statement of the Quran but has been given due emphasis God has adjured by five things in the beginning of this surah and the ocean keep heating being the fifth.

Oh look at that, Islam changes the Qu’ran again! It’s a good thing we Christians don’t have a problem with the Bible being the uncreated, eternal word of God like Muslims do with their Qu’ran - it makes life so much easier.

 

[jakasaki]

Quote:
Originally Posted by jakasaki

There is an enteresting passage in a hadith… it’s rather long but I’ll just post the importance of it…

Volume 3, Book 47, Number 755: Narrated 'Urwa from 'Aisha:

…
He then said to her, “Do not hurt me regarding Aisha, as the Divine Inspirations do not come to me on any of the beds except that of Aisha.” …

Are these “divine inspirations” which created the koran?

Did Gabriel appear to mohamad while in bed wtih Aisha? Hmmmmm!!!

Volume 4, Book 54, Number 440:

Narrated Abu Salama:

'Aisha said that the Prophet said to her “O ‘Aisha’ This is Gabriel and he sends his (greetings) salutations to you.” 'Aisha said, “Salutations (Greetings) to him, and Allah’s Mercy and Blessings be on him,” and addressing the Prophet she said, “You see what I don’t see.”

let me say yes , then
your point ?

Quote:
The koran was made up by mohamad, written down by scribes, later on many years after mohamads death, all bits & pieces gathered and thrown into a book that Uthman put together.

the quran was memorized by hundreds of companions before his death

Quote:
No one today has the “real koran” as it was written down by the scribes.

prove it

Quote:
And the “Mary” stories in the koran, they are all butchered and taken from Apocryphal Gospels. Link is enclosed so you may research these books and compare them to the koran.

was this book written in arabic in the time of mohammed (pbuh) , or you suggest that he studied the hebrew languge or may be somone teach him , so i have to know if you have historic records about that teacher , may be his name if you don’t mind

Poster Elwil -

You need to study up on the creation of your koran, the 7 different readings, the origial books burned by Uthman and the current “master” Uthman koran versions that are in Turkey and in London and perhaps one more place which I don’t recal.

You need to study up on the Apocryphal Gospels. I gave you the link to the Catholic Encyclopedia.

You need to study your prophets life and behaviour outside of islamic sites - search un-bias historical sites from all sorts of scholars.

You need to read books from **all **of your islmamic scholars who have documented your prophets life and the creating of the koran.

My job is NOT to educate you on your religion, prophet and koran.

Google is your best friend and so is your local library and book store.

“Ask and it will be given to you;”
“Seek and you will find;”
“Knock and the door will be opened to you.”

Matthew 7:7

 

[planten]

**To whom it may interest.​

The Quran is a complete book of real guidance. It needs to be read like the bible. Whereas the bible is very brief, the Quran is comprehensive.
Quran is the word of God. Science is the work of God. There is no difference between the word of God and the work of God. There is nothing un-scientific in Quran. That was told by Maurice Bucaille, the Frenchman who wrote “Bible, Science and Quran.”
**

 

[elwill]

Poster Elwil -

You need to study up on the creation of your koran, the 7 different readings, the origial books burned by Uthman and the current “master” Uthman koran versions that are in Turkey and in London and perhaps one more place which I don’t recal.

You need to study up on the Apocryphal Gospels. I gave you the link to the Catholic Encyclopedia.

You need to study your prophets life and behaviour outside of islamic sites - search un-bias historical sites from all sorts of scholars.

You need to read books from **all **of your islmamic scholars who have documented your prophets life and the creating of the koran.

My job is NOT to educate you on your religion, prophet and koran.

Google is your best friend and so is your local library and book store.

“Ask and it will be given to you;”
“Seek and you will find;”
“Knock and the door will be opened to you.”

Matthew 7:7

why you didn’t answer my questions directly ?

 

[planten]

Fact is the Quran was written long after Mohammad’s death.

Since the Quran is word of Allah verbatim, what guarantee is there that what was written by the scribes was accurate word of Allah as revealed to Mohammad word for word? None. In order that it was truly as how Mohammad heard it, the written Quran must be recited back to him for proof reading which was not done as Mohammad was long dead and gone by then.

Remember, the Quran was not an idea or an inspiration but supposed to be a dictation. The Quran is therefore a failure if it were to adhere to the principle of dictation done correctly. Now, we even have not yet considered that there were other versions of the Quran that were burned by Caliph Uthman. Muslims can claim about the originality of the Quran but too bad I see it has nothing but full of holes.

Then of course as we move along we will see great discrepancy about the accuracy of narrative as compared to the Bible, the word of God before it which it supposed to confirm.

** Reuben, the fact is that Quran was written by the scribes as and when it was revealed. The prophet dictated it to the scribes. (here we do not talk about Jesus and bible. You know very well.)

Quran was written on pieces of wood and bones from the very first day. It was memorised and recited in five daily prayers. During the last Hajj, there were 1,24,000 muslims presnt at hajj and the prophet addressed them and told them that nobody was superior to another except by good morale. The white man had no superiority over the black man (and vice versa). At that time, there were 1,24,000 men women praying day and night and reciting the Quran. The revelation of the Quran was almost complete and well looked after.

When the prophet died, the first Caliph ordered the putting together of the Quran in proper order. Then the second Caliph did the same. The work was in progress. It was completed in the time of third Caliph (Uthman). Uthman had the Quran compiled. he got about six or seven copies made and circulated to distant Governors.

Quran was not written by Muhammad. It was all dictated by Muhammad. It was collected and compiled with the help of those many Hafizeen (who had memorised it completely) and made into the form of a book. The Quran was not in the form of a book in the time of Muhammad. The whole work of compilation in the form of a book took about 22 years.

But God/Allah had promised in the Quran that “He had revealed it and He will guard it well.”

Not to hurt you. But just for the comparison. What about bible? It came on the surface after 325 years. (325 A.D.) 325 years is a very long time.
**

 

[elwill]

Oh look at that, Islam changes the Qu’ran again! It’s a good thing we Christians don’t have a problem with the Bible being the uncreated, eternal word of God like Muslims do with their Qu’ran - it makes life so much easier.

we can change the translation , i admit that sometimes the translations are not accurate .
but never anyone can change even one character from original arabic quran .

 

[Hadi]

Elwill, Planten…thank you for your efforts in this forum

 

[Sam_777]

Political movement by his wife Khadija and her cousin Waraqa with the help of Bahira the monk, to make something of the Arabs infront of the Jews.

*Sahih Bukhari, Volume 1, Book 1, Number 3:
"The Prophet added, “The angel caught me (forcefully) and pressed me so hard that I could not bear it any more. He then released me and again asked me to read and I replied, ‘I do not know how to read.’ Thereupon he caught me again and pressed me a second time till I could not bear it any more. He then released me and again asked me to read but again I replied, ‘I do not know how to read (or what shall I read)?’ Thereupon he caught me for the third time and pressed me, and then released me and said, 'Read in the name of your Lord, who has created (all that exists) has created man from a clot. Read! And your Lord is the Most Generous.” (96.1, 96.2, 96.3) Then Allah’s Apostle returned with the Inspiration and with his heart beating severely. Then he went to Khadija bint Khuwailid and said, “Cover me! Cover me!” They covered him till his fear was over and after that he told her everything that had happened and said, “I fear that something may happen to me.” Khadija replied, “Never! By Allah, Allah will never disgrace you. You keep good relations with your Kith and kin, help the poor and the destitute, serve your guests generously and assist the deserving calamity-afflicted ones.”

Khadija then accompanied him to her cousin Waraqa bin Naufal bin Asad bin 'Abdul 'Uzza, who, during the PreIslamic Period became a Christian and used to write the writing with Hebrew letters. He would write from the Gospel in Hebrew as much as Allah wished him to write. He was an old man and had lost his eyesight. Khadija said to Waraqa, “Listen to the story of your nephew, O my cousin!” Waraqa asked, “O my nephew! What have you seen?” Allah’s Apostle described whatever he had seen. Waraqa said, “This is the same one who keeps the secrets (angel Gabriel) whom Allah had sent to Moses. I wish I were young and could live up to the time when your people would turn you out.” Allah’s Apostle asked, “Will they drive me out?” Waraqa replied in the affirmative and said, “Anyone (man) who came with something similar to what you have brought was treated with hostility; and if I should remain alive till the day when you will be turned out then I would support you strongly.” But after a few days Waraqa died and the Divine Inspiration was also paused for a while. "*
(E) (A).

 

[Jay53]

Khadija replied, “Never! By Allah, Allah will never disgrace you. You keep good relations with your Kith and kin, help the poor and the destitute, serve your guests generously and assist the deserving calamity-afflicted ones.”

Khadija then accompanied him to her cousin Waraqa bin Naufal bin Asad bin 'Abdul 'Uzza, who, during the PreIslamic Period became a Christian and used to write the writing with Hebrew letters. He would write from the Gospel in Hebrew as much as Allah wished him to write. He was an old man and had lost his eyesight. Khadija said to Waraqa, “Listen to the story of your nephew, O my cousin!” Waraqa asked, “O my nephew! What have you seen?” Allah’s Apostle described whatever he had seen. Waraqa said, “This is the same one who keeps the secrets (angel Gabriel) whom Allah had sent to Moses. I wish I were young and could live up to the time when your people would turn you out.” Allah’s Apostle asked, “Will they drive me out?” Waraqa replied in the affirmative and said, “Anyone (man) who came with something similar to what you have brought was treated with hostility; and if I should remain alive till the day when you will be turned out then I would support you strongly.” But after a few days Waraqa died and the Divine Inspiration was also paused for a while. "

(E) (A).

Off topic question: What religion was Khadija at the time of Muhammad’s revelations?

 

[Sam_777]

Off topic question: What religion was Khadija at the time of Muhammad’s revelations?

Nothing specific about that in the Islamic books, so you can assume she was hanif, same as her cousin, or without any.

 

[Jay53]

Nothing specific about that in the Islamic books, so you can assume she was hanif, same as her cousin, or without any.

OK. Thank you, Sam.