Why am I, the what I am?

[Dfdo]

Friends in Christ,

I am a Catholic from a country whose major religious following is Theravada Buddhism.

I blv the gist of my question may have already been addressed in a more broader manner in some other thread as to the basic differences in the 2 religions. But I am seeking a more simplistic explanation, if one exist!

As my thread’s heading suggests, I am seeking an explanation in to the well founded and well exhibited (in real world) ‘HUMAN INEQUALITIES’ amongst us (be it health,wealth,mindfulness,sanity,piety etc etc)

In my understanding of this in a ‘very simplistic manner’ (yes, I understand that it is a broad subject)…

Catholic Philosophy says…

“It IS the God’s will. Thou shall accept it without any reservation just as the savior Jesus Christ accepted it. Have faith in the divinity of the Holy Trinity. Follow the teachings of the church as to the faith, prayer and works and thou shall gain salvation and eternal life in Jesus in the Holy Trinity”

The Buddhist philosophy…

“It is a broader cause-and-effect type situation. Best and simply explained by the five orders or processes (niyama) which operate in the physical and mental realms…Utu, Bija, Karma,Dhamma and Chitta. Understand it, accept it and be mindful that you are your own salvation. Follow the other precepts of the philosophy and thou shall find eternity and ultimate salvation in the detached and enlightened status of mind”

Simply put, for my secular mind, it looks that the cause and effect explanation in the Buddhist Philosophy gives a simpler straight fwd answer for the q of ‘human inequalities’ !!

This is NOT what I want you my friends to focus at.
But how should I refine my thoughts with the Catholic faith?

Should I not question the cause for this inequality but just accept it in faith?

Why is it if (irrespective of ones color, creed, faith etc) the whole mankind was CREATED in the IMAGE of God, we are made with inequalities?

Is it God’s punishment and my penance to pay for my sins in a ‘past life’ and this world is nothing but a branch of Hell for me? (if so that means I am a ‘re-birth’ to pay penance for my past life’s sins…Karma?)

If at least, as a Christian (in general) my PAST sins are forgiven once and for all at the Baptism as an infant, why was there were no miracle/s for at least to make me part of an ‘elite’ group without ‘suffering’?

If there is no common cause for it, why then the uncommon and different effects?

I can understand the COMMON salvation and ‘the eternal life’ in the refuge of Jesus in the Holy Trinity, but why the path so in-equal?

Is it really there is no cause for this effect?

Hope some of you will find time to answer my thoughts.

Thank you and May God Bless You !

 

[davidv]

Friends in Christ,

I am a Catholic from a country whose major religious following is Theravada Buddhism.

I blv the gist of my question may have already been addressed in a more broader manner in some other thread as to the basic differences in the 2 religions. But I am seeking a more simplistic explanation, if one exist!

As my thread’s heading suggests, I am seeking an explanation in to the well founded and well exhibited (in real world) ‘HUMAN INEQUALITIES’ amongst us (be it health,wealth,mindfulness,sanity,piety etc etc)

In my understanding of this in a ‘very simplistic manner’ (yes, I understand that it is a broad subject)…

Catholic Philosophy says…

“It IS the God’s will. Thou shall accept it without any reservation just as the savior Jesus Christ accepted it. Have faith in the divinity of the Holy Trinity. Follow the teachings of the church as to the faith, prayer and works and thou shall gain salvation and eternal life in Jesus in the Holy Trinity”

The Buddhist philosophy…

“It is a broader cause-and-effect type situation. Best and simply explained by the five orders or processes (niyama) which operate in the physical and mental realms…Utu, Bija, Karma,Dhamma and Chitta. Understand it, accept it and be mindful that you are your own salvation. Follow the other precepts of the philosophy and thou shall find eternity and ultimate salvation in the detached and enlightened status of mind”

Simply put, for my secular mind, it looks that the cause and effect explanation in the Buddhist Philosophy gives a simpler straight fwd answer for the q of ‘human inequalities’ !!

This is NOT what I want you my friends to focus at.
But how should I refine my thoughts with the Catholic faith?

Should I not question the cause for this inequality but just accept it in faith?

Why is it if (irrespective of ones color, creed, faith etc) the whole mankind was CREATED in the IMAGE of God, we are made with inequalities?

Is it God’s punishment and my penance to pay for my sins in a ‘past life’ and this world is nothing but a branch of Hell for me? (if so that means I am a ‘re-birth’ to pay penance for my past life’s sins…Karma?)

If at least, as a Christian (in general) my PAST sins are forgiven once and for all at the Baptism as an infant, why was there were no miracle/s for at least to make me part of an ‘elite’ group without ‘suffering’?

If there is no common cause for it, why then the uncommon and different effects?

I can understand the COMMON salvation and ‘the eternal life’ in the refuge of Jesus in the Holy Trinity, but why the path so in-equal?

Is it really there is no cause for this effect?

Hope some of you will find time to answer my thoughts.

Thank you and May God Bless You !

Welcome to CAF.

It seems that your statement of Catholic philosophy focuses on the wrong thing. The first acticle of the Catechism of the Catholic Church states:

1 God, infinitely perfect and blessed in himself, in a plan of sheer goodness freely created man to make him share in his own blessed life. For this reason, at every time and in every place, God draws close to man. He calls man to seek him, to know him, to love him with all his strength. He calls together all men, scattered and divided by sin, into the unity of his family, the Church. To accomplish this, when the fullness of time had come, God sent his Son as Redeemer and Savior. In his Son and through him, he invites men to become, in the Holy Spirit, his adopted children and thus heirs of his blessed life.

Based on the fact the our original parents chose to disobey, we have the muddle of inequality that you describe. The Church provides an antidote to that by asking us individually to be drawn closer to God, thereby becoming closer to each other.

 

[Dfdo]

…
Based on the fact the our original parents chose to disobey, we have the muddle of inequality that you describe…

Well, the ‘cause’ may be, IMO broader than a sinful couple of people of the ‘past’ but it may be as I said in my OP more closer to the ‘past’-present concept, cause and effect concept as described more theologically in the Buddhist philosophy.

I know CC vehemently deny the re incarnation, but then teaches us a concept of sins of the ‘original parents’ ie our own blood and soul in the past!!

 

[davidv]

Well, the ‘cause’ may be, IMO broader than a sinful couple of people of the ‘past’ but it may be as I said in my OP more closer to the ‘past’-present concept, cause and effect concept as described more theologically in the Buddhist philosophy.

I know CC vehemently deny the re incarnation, but then teaches us a concept of ‘original parents’ ie our own blood and soul in the past!!

The Church teaching on the creation of the individual soul

366 The Church teaches that every spiritual soul is created immediately by God - it is not “produced” by the parents - and also that it is immortal: it does not perish when it separates from the body at death, and it will be reunited with the body at the final Resurrection

The fact of an original pair of parents in no way contradicts the presence of the soul specifically created at our conception.

 

[Monica4316]

I hope I’ve understood your post in the right way…

Inequality and other forms of human oppression result from sin in the world… it’s not a “punishment” for a person’s sins. Many innocent people suffer from poverty, illness, etc, and so did the Saints. It’s a result of sin, which comes from human free will… God allows us because suffering will be gone once sin is gone, but He’s waiting till the end of the world to get rid of sin, because that would involve the Last Judgement. He’s actually giving us a chance to repent and come back to Him - at the Judgement, it will be too late.

In Catholic theology, suffering is an opportunity to share in Christ’s pain on the Cross… if we willingly endure our suffering and offer it to the Father, He will use it to help souls, and to convert sinners.

THe only way to get rid of inequality is for each person to come to God. There’s sin in the world because of our rebellion against God.

 

[Dfdo]

The sin and the sinners…

Well, I remember in my catechism classes teachers were firm that the ‘catholic church’ is of 2 branches; the Divine and ‘flawless’ branch and the one that consist of the ‘flawed sinners’.

Isn’t it ironic that for our guidance on most of the stuff we have to look up what ever is written by the ‘church’ (the branch that is…) !!

If I am to ‘beleive’ how the ‘debate’ of ‘original sin’ has flowed in the church, (newadvent.org/cathen/11312a.htm) what guarantee I have it is not a ‘flawed’ idea??

My ‘free will’ which I believe I gained with deep faith, prayer and adoration to the Divinity of the Church…the God Head/Holy Trinity, am I to worry that it is tainted with ‘sin’ any more than the sin of the people whose ‘thinking’ led to most of church ‘teachings’ ?

Is my thirst for ‘inquiry’ any less divine or more sinful than that of my church fathers? and the conclusions I gain by it are outright ‘heretic’ that on the judgment day I may be cast aside once and for all? OR is that a chance worth taking for the grace of God for whose image I am a witness??

 

[Neil_Anthony]

Catholic Philosophy says…

“It IS the God’s will. Thou shall accept it without any reservation just as the savior Jesus Christ accepted it. Have faith in the divinity of the Holy Trinity. Follow the teachings of the church as to the faith, prayer and works and thou shall gain salvation and eternal life in Jesus in the Holy Trinity”

The Buddhist philosophy…

“It is a broader cause-and-effect type situation. Best and simply explained by the five orders or processes (niyama) which operate in the physical and mental realms…Utu, Bija, Karma,Dhamma and Chitta. Understand it, accept it and be mindful that you are your own salvation. Follow the other precepts of the philosophy and thou shall find eternity and ultimate salvation in the detached and enlightened status of mind”

Hi,

Could you tell us a bit more about these five processes?

There is a huge depth in the Christian teachings on suffering. While your summary isn’t wrong, there is so much more. Here are just a few points off the top of my head

1. God only allows an evil if it can be used to achieve a greater good. For example, the suffering could be redemptive for you, or it could achieve good in many other ways that we will never know.
2. Suffering is a result of sin and the fall of man.
3. Each soul is different and may require different graces to help it achieve salvation. Sometimes suffering can be a grace.
4. Suffering in this life helps us to come to see through real experiences that sin leads to suffering, and goodness helps reduce suffering. This is a lesson of great value for our souls.

There are more, sorry I have to go!

 

[davidv]

The sin and the sinners…

Well, I remember in my catechism classes teachers were firm that the ‘catholic church’ is of 2 branches; the Divine and ‘flawless’ branch and the one that consist of the ‘flawed sinners’.

Are you speaking of Jesus as the Head, and the Church as the Body of Christ?

Isn’t it ironic that for our guidance on most of the stuff we have look up what ever is written by the ‘church’ (the branch that is…) !!

Why is it ironic? Jesus established the Church and instructed it to teach all nations. And He promised to send the Holy Spirit to guide the Church to the whole truth.

If I am to ‘beleive’ how the ‘debate’ of ‘original sin’ has flowed in the church, (newadvent.org/cathen/11312a.htm) what guarantee I have it is not a ‘flawed’ idea??

You have no guarantee if you are attempting to define things on your own.

My ‘free will’ which I believe I gained with deep faith, prayer and adoration to the Divinity of the Church…the God Head/Holy Trinity, am I to worry that it is tainted with ‘sin’ any more than the sin of the people whose ‘thinking’ led to most of church ‘teachings’ ?

How do you give yourself (free will) that which is given only by God in the human nature that you have. This is one of the principle attributes of being created in God’s image.

Is my thirst for ‘inquiry’ any less divine or sinful than that of my church fathers? and the conclusions I gain by it are outright ‘heretic’ that on the judgment day I may be cast aside once and for all? OR is that a chance worth taking for the grace of God for whose image I am a witness??

Anyone willing to submit themselve to the will of God will receive God’s grace abundantly.

 

[Garyjohn2]

Deja Vu!!!

This thread already exists lol!