Why are Catholics leaving?

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JohnCarroll

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I had posed this in another thread but got little response. I hope you can tell me what you think.
Please read this first: ic.net/~erasmus/RAZ196.HTM

This is THE issue. Because , for all the objections we hear here on line , all the arguments between us and our protestant inquirers, it is this problem that needs the MOST attention. Millions of Catholics are leaving the Church over this one little thing: They have said the mass their whole life, and never knew what they were saying!

They could never mean in their heart what the liturgy is saying when they did not understand it. Like this woman in the above link , they obviously did not KNOW they did not understand it. Why is this? Is it that the homily did not explain it? Have the cutting angles of the truth in the Liturgy been dulled by so much wishy-washy preaching that the clear message of the Gospel has become lost? Did she not know, or had no opportunity to spend time with Catholics to whom Jesus was their reason for being?

This is not primarily an intellectual problem. This is a Spiritual problem. They aren’t leaving because the Protestant, Jehovah-Witness, Mormon churches have better arguments than us. They leave because they do not know Jesus–and sadly did not know they could know Him.

To me this is the issue of all issues : unless the simple concept that we MUST meet Jesus and give ourselves to Him totally is communicated at Mass, none of the rest of what the Church wants to communicate will make ANY since. The Mass is obviously just a comforting ritual, or a boring ritual, or an habitual ritual to people like this woman. Let’s take her at her word, she never met Jesus, she didn’t think she knew people who knew Him, and when she did in what ever church, He was so beautiful and the shared love between brothers and sisters was so strong, that she accepted any other theology she had to, just to be near Him and His friends. Why didn’t it happen for her in the Catholic Church?

What can we do?
 
We need to really pray for the Church and better catechesis of the faithful.

:gopray2: Dear God, bless Your church that it might better reach out to people and help them both understand the knowledge of the faith and develop a deep spirituality through it. Grant us charismatic homilies that touch our hearts revealing the Truth and bringing us closer to God. Bless the Bishops and the Priests that they may tend the spiritual needs of their flocks. Bless the Holy Father with the wisdom to lead the Church into a deeper overall spirituality. We ask this in the name of the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit. :amen: :gopray2:
 
Good Morning Church

AMEN!

I agree, this is the primary reason folks, especially young people leave the Church.
In my opinion, much of this is because of lazy and maybe unbelieving Priests. It is pretty hard to fool anyone. If a Priest does not have a great personal conversion, does not believe in the Power of Prayer, in fact in the real Power of the Holy Spirit, does not show real joy in everything God has done in his life, can’t take the time to say a real prayer over someone in need, he cannot preach a good homily. How could he.?
If he doesn’t take the time to prepare a homily and either reads what he is written or worse yet a canned one that someone else has written, who will listen intently?
If he doesn’t know how, then he should go back to school.

Besides that, most folks judge the Church by the Catholics they see. If folks are continually gossiping, judging and bickering or continually complaining about the Pastor and writing the Bishop, they have just witnessed to shaky Catholics.

If we do not welcome folks with a nice smile, care for them when they need company or sympathy we have just invited them to attend a Church that will.
 
"The lady reached back into her purse to pull out a little tract and said, "This tracts explains the simple gospel of salvation. It can be broken down into four easy steps. (highlights are mine)

I think the key terms are simple and easy. As a society we want the maximum amount of result for the minimal amount of effort.

We want one step car wax, one-coat paint, and heat and eat dinners. We get results, maybe not as good as if we used “good old fashion elbow grease” or if we made it from scratch “like grandma used to” but as long as we feel good about ourselves and we are recognizing “the man up stairs” we’re ok. This philosophy of consumerism has made its way into our spirituality.

Reason why people leave the Catholic Church, at first they don’t believe they need God.

They may have been raised “Catholic”, been to Mass, CCD, Catholic School, etc, but they did so out of habit or because mommy or daddy made them or the thought God would get them if they didn’t. Many of these people leave the church while they are still attending. They are there in body, but in mind and spirit they are still in the world.

For some of these people during the journey of life, the need for God arises. Personal loss through the death of a loved one, financial loss, loss of prestige, power, position or disaster, the reasons are numerous, the person gets knocked down a few pegs in life and they turn to God.

Now they can (and some do) turn back to the faith of their fathers. Others think they will find an easier answer in other beliefs. Some times going back home is to hard, it would mean that the Church was right and they would have to admit they were wrong.

So the church is blamed, “they are cold”, “they are hypocrites”, and “all they do is make you feel guilty” or “I disagree with a lot of what the church teaches”.

It doesn’t take a lot to say generically that “I am a sinner” if we don’t have to identify our sins.

It takes a lot of humility to identify our sins individually and take responsibility for them. Don’t believe me? How hard is it for you to go up to a stranger and say the words (or make a post) " I am a sinner" or I am not perfect" now how hard is it for you to go to confession and identify your sins to a priest?

What becomes a danger is that church and God becomes a commodity. We attend a church or follow a belief system that we “get something out of” or we feel that “it meets our needs”.

We want to “feel” saved, we want to “feel OK” about ourselves. We want a faith that is purchased fully developed like we were buying vegetables from the grocery store. We don’t want to tend to our faith, as we would lovingly tend to a garden. A garden takes work, patience, persistence and discipline. A garden takes constant vigilance to remove weeds and pests. So does a healthy faith.

Actually some people spend a lot of time and energy holding on their “easy” faith. They spend a lot of energy attacking or running away from the Church.

What can we do?

Those of us in the Church should pray for her and keep her strong. People will need a family to come back to.

Those of us in the Church should work at our own Faith. When our Faith is strong we will be able to help others with humility and love instead of greeting them with arrogance.

We should not loose Hope. There is a reason why the Church is target number one.

We should learn to explain the faith simply, it’s really great to be able to quote scripture chapter and verse. It’s great to be able to quote the catechism and the councils but if we can’t put these things accurately into our own words and have them etched into our own hearts we will not be able to show others the Faith. It’s no good just to hear and say the words we have to live them.

Bill
 
This makes the parable of the Prodigal Son even more relevant today. It is true that many Catholics have left the faith, but the faith was not there to begin with. The old faith must be shed and a new faith must be gained. Eventually the son returned and knew what he had left behind and how shameful his behavior was. He knows he is not worthy but what happens … the Father rejoices at his return. The son squandered his riches but the Father always hoped his son would return. I was a prodigal son and the conversion is most powerful. Like other posters have said do not fret and worry about it. Pray for the re-conversion of those Catholics.

It may be that to strengthen the Church it must become smaller. Necessary pruning must take place to allow new growth to bloom.
 
I suppose different people learn in different ways but It seems to me there should be a simple Gospel presented at first. How else can simple people like me be saved. The Divine Liturgy is a Phd course. It needs to be explained. That’s why ,to me, it seems best to present Christianity as a relationship with God, and not as a list of dogmas. After all, dogmas, the magisterium, the pope, Bishops, priests, the Parish building, every word ever uttered by every Saint is for one purpose : to help us know God better.

As I say , until we establish that necessary relationship, everything in Catholicism is just a boring list of things to do and things to memorize. After we meet Jesus, all those lists become a way to know the Person we love better.
 
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JohnCarroll:
Why didn’t it happen for her in the Catholic Church?

What can we do?
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  1. I Think it is the fallen nature each of has. I belong to a parish where the pastor is very clear about teaching that the rituals are particularly meaningless to young people if the isn’t equal treat on who God is and why is important. He is also clear that the primary educators of these things are the parents. Our faith formation programs, from grade school through high school are based on these premises. Despite all of this, I have seen one of my own children and many children of other faithful homes decide to “go their own way”.
  2. Now, what to do? - Depends on what is wrong. Is it poor parenting? - Pray. Provide charitible guidance to parents who you interact with. Is it poor catechesis? Get involved with your parish’s faith formation program. Tap into your diocese’s resources as needed. Is it rejection of the truth? Pray. Be prepared to be to share your story in love when the occasions arise.
 
Greetings Church

Greetings John Carrol
Great post. You are absolutely right.
As long as some of these answers go neglected, Catholics will continue to leave.
I don’t think this is what Jesus had in mind.
 
davidv said:
1) I Think it is the fallen nature each of has. I belong to a parish where the pastor is very clear about teaching that the rituals are particularly meaningless to young people if the isn’t equal treat on who God is and why is important. .
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Thanks for responding Davidv. I hope you will clarify something for me. You say your Parish does stress " God is and why He is important". This is almost what i am saying but not quite. I may know something about God and know He is important , but not really KNOW Him. It is that Conversion that happens when we meet the God we have studied that i am talking about. When He is no longer the distant intellectual curiosity of the student and becomes the Real Person who is my friend. People don’t easily leave friends . For this to happen the Holy Spirit must draw us and we must respond with " be it done unto me according to your word"
 
catholiceducation.org/articles/religion/re0252.html
“While a lot of people leave the Church, they tend not to be good Catholics,” says Curtis Martin, president of Catholics United for the Faith, who himself returned to the Church after spending five years as an evangelical Protestant. “The Protestants [now] coming into the Church are the most devoted Protestants, people deeply committed to Scripture and prayer. We’re losing the numbers game but we are winning the quality game in spades.”
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Oh yeah.

I say, let the dissenters leave. At least they won’t lie anymore about being Catholic, which is a step forward.
 
I had left ‘the Church’ and entered the pagan world but came back 7 years ago. It was a step by step progress in these last 7 years. I pray that those who left and then come back will more appreciate what they lost in the first place.

What may strengthen the Church is the influx of Protestant Ministers coming to the Church in the testimonies on The Journey Home.
The former Protestants bring that LOVE they experienced in Christ to give us that spark as well.
It is taking the former Protestants to re-evangelize the Catholic Church! Who would have thought this could happen!?

IMO the Catholic Church will be stronger when the ‘wheat’ (The faithful) is separated from the ‘chaft’ (the fallen away). But we need to waken the spiritually dead and lost.

Go with God!
Edwin
 
There are so many good thoughts here, so I don’t need to add much. In my own situation, I thought that once I was confirmed, I didn’t have to work at it anymore. I spent most of my adult life being lukewarm about my faith, & in a way that’s worse than openly rejecting it. While I’ve made significant strides in the past 2 years, I’m still struck by how much more I should learn & do regarding my faith. In one sense, it’s discouraging, but ultimately it’s fascinating. Our faith is so wonderfully rich in dimension that we could spend all of our collective lifetimes trying to learn & never exhausting the possibilities!

It takes a lot to absorb the Truth, and I really feel that people leave it because they can’t take it or refuse to take it. Someone else mentioned “The Journey Home” & I think all of us cradle Catholics should watch it. I’ve learned so much from the converts on that program who, unlike me, didn’t take our faith for granted.
 
don’t think this is what Jesus had in mind.How do you know what Jesus had in mind? Are you another member of the Holy Trinity?
 
I’m sure there are alot of reasons people have left the Church. I’ll tell you the experience I’ve had with alot of the people I know. It was just easier to be in a protestant church for the friends I know who left the Church. They can go to church on Sunday, listen to their pastor preach, yell Amen and head on back to their lives. If they sinned, no big deal, say a quick “sorry” to Jesus and forget about it because “once saved, always saved”. That is what that article reminded me of. Four points and POW, you have the full Gospel.

Now personally I don’t think this is Biblical for a minute. I’ve had quite a few long dialoges with my former Catholic friends about this. By the grace of God a few came back, but the ones that have not still have this attitude.

Disclaimer: I am not saying all protestants are like this!!! This is just my individual circle of friends.
 
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