Why can't God forgive sins by FIAT?

[juggernaut]

Hello

I hope this is the right category. I think this may be an advanced theological topic but I was wondering about it. My understanding was that before the resurrection there was no forgiveness of sin, thus, no one could enter into heaven. Now that Jesus has risen from the dead, all sins that have ever been committed and all sins that ever will be committed are forgiven and heaven is open to all mankind. Why go through all the trouble with coming down to earth? God can do ANYTHING, so whynot forgive sin?

My limited theological understanding is that even though God was reaching out his hand, mankind was incapable of reaching back and grasping it (i.e. faith and works). And that through Jesus, we are now have the capacity to respond to grace while before the resurrection, we were simply lacked to capacity to. However, even then God could have bypassed our limitation and forgiven sin by saying so.

Can anyone clarify or provide some links?

 

[Contarini]

Hello

I hope this is the right category. I think this may be an advanced theological topic but I was wondering about it. My understanding was that before the resurrection there was no forgiveness of sin, thus, no one could enter into heaven. Now that Jesus has risen from the dead, all sins that have ever been committed and all sins that ever will be committed are forgiven and heaven is open to all mankind. Why go through all the trouble with coming down to earth? God can do ANYTHING, so whynot forgive sin?

My limited theological understanding is that even though God was reaching out his hand, mankind was incapable of reaching back and grasping it (i.e. faith and works). And that through Jesus, we are now have the capacity to respond to grace while before the resurrection, we were simply lacked to capacity to. However, even then God could have bypassed our limitation and forgiven sin by saying so.

Can anyone clarify or provide some links?

This is indeed one of the most basic questions in Christian soteriology. For my money, the best response is in Athanasius’s On the Incarnation, which you can read online. Anselm’s Cur Deus Homo is another very famous attempt to deal with this, though I prefer Athanasius.

Edwin

 

[sambos671]

Hello

I hope this is the right category. I think this may be an advanced theological topic but I was wondering about it. My understanding was that before the resurrection there was no forgiveness of sin, thus, no one could enter into heaven. Now that Jesus has risen from the dead, all sins that have ever been committed and all sins that ever will be committed are forgiven and heaven is open to all mankind. Why go through all the trouble with coming down to earth? God can do ANYTHING, so whynot forgive sin?

My limited theological understanding is that even though God was reaching out his hand, mankind was incapable of reaching back and grasping it (i.e. faith and works). And that through Jesus, we are now have the capacity to respond to grace while before the resurrection, we were simply lacked to capacity to. However, even then God could have bypassed our limitation and forgiven sin by saying so.

Can anyone clarify or provide some links?

I am probably the least apt person to respond to your question. But I’ll give it a good ol’ college try. Fiat; will. Just will it. God created the Heavens and the Earth. By necessity of Creation things are establish by laws. Laws govern the Natural Order and they of course are limitedly based on law established in the Spiritual Order. Now God creates Man in his image and thus man has free will and is able to make decisions for himself. Man decides to sin and (in my personal view) dies Spiritually (his body will follow 930 years latter). Due to his rejection of God He reaps the consequences of the spiritual order for breaking the command of God. The natural order follows suite. God is unchangeable or immutable. God has created in accordance with his character (not that creation is immutable its not its changeable) with regard to the laws upon which all things are built. In order to restore things to their proper order the consequences of that law must be fulfilled namely the Destruction of the Cosmos and specifically of Man (mankind). Instead of this the Creator himself incarnated and offered himself to satisfy the natural and spiritual consequences of Man’s disobedience. Otherwise everything must unravel. That’s just my guess.

 

[Island_Oak]

Wish I had a good cite to provide…but as a practical matter would this not remove the critical element of free will from the equation? For that matter why doesn’t an all-powerful God simply conform hearts and minds to the faith? Why not conform conduct of believers perfectly to the faith? It ultimately comes down to us as individuals, created with free will, to seek relationship–and repair to broken relationships–with God. Removing this critical element really makes us nothing more than robots or pre-programmed computers.

 

[Eucharisted]

Hello

I hope this is the right category. I think this may be an advanced theological topic but I was wondering about it. My understanding was that before the resurrection there was no forgiveness of sin, thus, no one could enter into heaven. Now that Jesus has risen from the dead, all sins that have ever been committed and all sins that ever will be committed are forgiven and heaven is open to all mankind. Why go through all the trouble with coming down to earth? God can do ANYTHING, so whynot forgive sin?

My limited theological understanding is that even though God was reaching out his hand, mankind was incapable of reaching back and grasping it (i.e. faith and works). And that through Jesus, we are now have the capacity to respond to grace while before the resurrection, we were simply lacked to capacity to. However, even then God could have bypassed our limitation and forgiven sin by saying so.

Can anyone clarify or provide some links?

Heaven was closed not because God did not forgive sins but because of Original Sin. God promised man a Redeemer, and through the prophets He promised a Savior, a man who would save Israel. God further promised through the prophets that He would redeem Israel and reopen Heaven. In the ancient times, God would forgive sins when sin offerings were made, such as on the Day of Atonement. Now, if put all that God had said and ordered together, you realize the Redeemer could only be God, made Man, offered as a sin offering for the Redemption of man. But God ordered all of this Himself so He could prove His Love to man: by dying for him.

Heaven has been reopened, but those who do not wash themselves in the baptismal water which gushed forth from Jesus’ Heart when it was pierced by the lance are still stained with Original Sin, which means they can’t enter Heaven. Likewise, those who do not drink the eucharisted blood which gushed forth from Jesus’ Heart when it was pierced by the lance are still lacking in sanctifying grace, which means they can’t enjoy the Divine Life. The Water and Blood, Baptism and the Eucharist, make the Catholic Church: this is why the Church is called the Sacrament of Salvation. Just as it is with a Body that Jesus redeemed man on the Cross, so too, it is with His Body - us believers in Heaven, in Purgatory, and in the world - that He dispenses His graces to man, which we obtain for all men by our prayers.

 

[Ahimsa]

Only the Chrysler Corporation can have their sins forgiven by Fiat.

I know, it’s unfair.

 

[Ahimsa]

Hello

I hope this is the right category. I think this may be an advanced theological topic but I was wondering about it. My understanding was that before the resurrection there was no forgiveness of sin, thus, no one could enter into heaven. Now that Jesus has risen from the dead, all sins that have ever been committed and all sins that ever will be committed are forgiven and heaven is open to all mankind. Why go through all the trouble with coming down to earth? God can do ANYTHING, so whynot forgive sin?

My limited theological understanding is that even though God was reaching out his hand, mankind was incapable of reaching back and grasping it (i.e. faith and works). And that through Jesus, we are now have the capacity to respond to grace while before the resurrection, we were simply lacked to capacity to. However, even then God could have bypassed our limitation and forgiven sin by saying so.

Can anyone clarify or provide some links?

My 2 cents:

God, in fact, can NOT do anything, because of kenosis. Kenosis is the ‘self-emptying’ in which God relinquishes some of His Power, or in which God limits Himself in some way.

When God created the cosmos, that involved a type of kenosis. This kenosis involved God limiting himself in various ways, because the very existence of the cosmos requires that God limit Himself in some way. Thus, one of the ways God limited Himself related to how forgiveness of sins would be accomplished. This kenosis involved God setting up the structure, guidelines, and rules for how forgiveness would be accomplished.

One of those rules demanded that God the Son undergo another sort of kenosis before forgiveness would be accomplished: the kenosis of becoming Man, and dying.

So that’s why (I believe) God could not forgive sins by fiat – because God is a kenotic God, a self-limiting God. Without God’s kenosis, the universe couldn’t exist. Now that the universe exists, God cannot forgive without God the Son’s kenosis.

 

[RainbowGirl82]

God can forgive wrongdoing or sin in any way that he/she/it wants to. God is not limited by how he/she/it can forgive someone.

By the way, if you ever notice me referring to God as “he” it’s just a force of habit. I honestly don’t know the gender of God or if “he” even has a gender.