Why should I abandon my liking for Transhumanism genetic engineering because of a man in the sky?

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Mere liking? or actually engaging in transhumanism genetic engineering? There’s a difference. If you mean you like it because it may lead to curing diseases without using unethical means to do so, I can see nothing wrong with such a goal. If however the goal is to make men into what you think men ought to be, then you have raised it to the level of a social movement or religion, and that is treading on moral grounds in which the Church has every right to take an interest.
 
Transhumanism is a vague concept. Genetic engineering is better. You can explore it all you like but my research shows that scientists don’t know as much as they thought about the human genome. Finally, the human body is not like a car. You can’t swap out parts if they aren’t the right size and shape. Protein folding is very precise, but scientists do not understand the process.

For example, if genetic engineering could improve the strength of your arms, all associated muscles and joints have to be strengthened as well. The body is an integrated system. I could add armor to a vehicle to protect it from small arms fire but the weight would mean less range and more fuel burned.

Perhaps certain interesting things will be found as research progresses but it has to be done in a humane way and with the full, knowledgeable consent of any test subjects.

The man in the sky is Jesus Christ. He is the Son of God and has set down the best way to live as a human being. He is worthy of devotion and worship, His laws and commands are just.

Ed
 
Genetic engineering cannot help you in any way, it can only improve subsequent generations, **if **its promises pan out.

Whereas the “man in the sky” has power to awaken you from death and take you with him.

The choice is obvious IMNAAHO.

ICXC NIKA
 
Because faith in man and his manmade things will inevitably let you down, while faith in God and His Church and His Sacraments will never disappoint you or lead you astray.
 
First of all, your argument is based on a falsehood and an ambiguity.
  1. God is neither a man, nor is he in the sky. God is not a being in the sky that treats us like a game of Sims. He is even beyond being. He existed before the universe. He existed before existence itself. He is not just loving, He is Love. He is not just true, He is Truth. It’s called divine simplicity. Look it up.
  2. What do you mean by your “liking of Transhumanism genetic engineering”? Not all Transhumanism is genetic engineering, and not all genetic engineering is Transhumanistic. Some Transhumanism is technological. Dr. Zola’s computerized brain in Captain America: The Winter Soldier, for instance. And not all genetic engineering is transhumanistic, like the corn growing down the street. So what are you talking about?
In Love & Truth,

Jeff
 
casabolg said:
Simple question, being very serious.
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If you believe God is a “man in the sky”, you can choose any liking you like. Doesn’t mean God isn’t real or that there aren’t real consequences but you are free to choose whatever you want to.
 
If you believe that God is merely a “man in the sky,” you’re free to believe whatever you like. :rolleyes:
 
casabolg said:
Simple question, being very serious.
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How about because of a man on the ground? You and the rest of us fellow human beings. Ever hear about how many cloned animals DIE and how many more are defective? Science is wonderful and fascinating, as well as VERY helpful to human life. What part of your humanity do you want to change? It may turn out that one thing cannot be changed without changing others that you DON’T want to. For instance, if you wanted to never feel pain, there are those than DON’T and constantly injure themselves (lepers have that problem) I’ve given extremely simple illustrations you might dismiss…Science makes mistakes and more importantly is an experiment, trial and error sort of thing. YOU cannot (so far) change much about your humanity, these things would have to be done to FUTURE humans, and what about you or any other scientist would confer on you the RIGHT to re-engineer another human’s humanity? It could well be left to science fiction and fantasy. Any other risks unforseen results as in the old movie “The Fly” That’s my take on it.
 
sugarcat said:
How about because of a man on the ground? You and the rest of us fellow human beings. Ever hear about how many cloned animals DIE and how many more are defective? Science is wonderful and fascinating, as well as VERY helpful to human life. What part of your humanity do you want to change? It may turn out that one thing cannot be changed without changing others that you DON’T want to. For instance, if you wanted to never feel pain, there are those than DON’T and constantly injure themselves (lepers have that problem) I’ve given extremely simple illustrations you might dismiss…Science makes mistakes and more importantly is an experiment, trial and error sort of thing. YOU cannot (so far) change much about your humanity, these things would have to be done to FUTURE humans, and what about you or any other scientist would confer on you the RIGHT to re-engineer another human’s humanity? It could well be left to science fiction and fantasy. Any other risks unforseen results as in the old movie “The Fly” That’s my take on it.
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This may occur using unwilling or unknowing test subjects by people who are less scrupulous than we’d like to think about. Possible scenarios already exist for treating certain conditions using adult stem cells, and it has been found that adult stem cells can be reprogrammed, to a degree.

Goals have been set. Already, genetic “knock out” experiments are occurring. That means a portion of a gene segment in say, a mouse is cut out and the ends are reattached. In classic ‘mad scientist’ style, the scientists monitor the animal for any changes. Now, they are trying genetic “knock in” experiments where a protein coding cDNA sequence in inserted “to see what happens.”

These tests may provide useful data to try on higher animals, like primates.

Ed
 
Some pretty strange things have happened and not just recently.

There are people out there who believe that head transplants will become a reality. The fact is they did head transplants in January 1959 by Vladimir Demikhov to graft multiple heads on dogs. They had to decapitate a dog and use his head to put on another dog. The animals apparently lived a while, but not for long. Transhumanism might be a possible experiment some day. Maybe they will find a way to graft a human head on a horse’s body.

This all sounds just awful. Be careful what you wish for because you may get it. In cryonics they keep heads frozen in liquid nitrogen for a day the heads can be grafted on to a healthy body.

Leave well enough alone. Monsters would not be a good thing.
 
Peter_Plato said:
Read The Abolition of Man by C.S. Lewis.

For a taste of where Lewis was going with his book, watch:

youtu.be/tX5e6eSkaMc

Also Transhuman and Subhuman by John C. Wright – full text available here… 🙂

scifiwright.com/xabout/transhuman-and-subhuman/
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I’ve read a number of proposed goals, and all it takes is an idea. Who thought we’d go from the first aircraft to the first combat jets and the A-bomb in 45 years?

Immortality, or rapid healing or redesign to survive in hostile or alien environments? It’s all been written about. Some of it may be useful but a lot of unknowns lurk in the shadows. Men building stronger or smarter men. Without an agreed upon ethical yardstick, the tools to move in this direction are being developed, some in total secrecy. May God help us.

Ed
 
edwest2 said:
I’ve read a number of proposed goals, and all it takes is an idea. Who thought we’d go from the first aircraft to the first combat jets and the A-bomb in 45 years?

Immortality, or rapid healing or redesign to survive in hostile or alien environments? It’s all been written about. Some of it may be useful but a lot of unknowns lurk in the shadows. Men building stronger or smarter men. Without an agreed upon ethical yardstick, the tools to move in this direction are being developed, some in total secrecy. May God help us.

Ed
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If the only yardstick is to do what is possible merely because it is possible, THAT poses a huge moral problem.

The PP videos point out that man’s inhumanity to man can become normalized very quickly.

We aren’t as morally good or knowing as we suppose we are which is why we shouldn’t delude ourselves into thinking whatever we want will be good just because we want it. Yet, that is the basic principle of libertarianism.

You are correct…

May God help us!
 
Peter Plato:

Thanks SO much for the reading list especially John C. Wright! (ps your Pink Floyd line is my favorite, among all of their quite liked songs!) There has to be a Natural Law plane on which to engage honest folks led astray by the power-mad, dumbed down, immoral society which seeks to ban faith in all but power and the State!
 
edwest2 said:
I’ve read a number of proposed goals, and all it takes is an idea. Who thought we’d go from the first aircraft to the first combat jets and the A-bomb in 45 years?

Immortality, or rapid healing or redesign to survive in hostile or alien environments? It’s all been written about. Some of it may be useful but a lot of unknowns lurk in the shadows. Men building stronger or smarter men. Without an agreed upon ethical yardstick, the tools to move in this direction are being developed, some in total secrecy. May God help us.

Ed
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I’d rather do without an ethical yardstick than trust the American government to provide one. IMNAAHO.

ICXC NIKA
 
It’s not a serious question because its presents a straw man. If you are willing to behave like an adult, we can discuss. It’s up to you.
 
sugarcat said:
Peter Plato:

Thanks SO much for the reading list especially John C. Wright! (ps your Pink Floyd line is my favorite, among all of their quite liked songs!) There has to be a Natural Law plane on which to engage honest folks led astray by the power-mad, dumbed down, immoral society which seeks to ban faith in all but power and the State!
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I would suggest that one way to counter this tendency is to reasonably and honestly point forwards down the road to where the “power-mad, dumbed down, immoral society” is leading and ask whether this is where we really wish to end up.

Personally, the answer is clear.

No one can be forced to listen, but if enough rational and thoughtful people abandon the bandwagon as it careens down the road, those left on it, hopefully, will have second thoughts about where they have fixed their rear ends.
 
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