Word Of Faith-olic?

[ez3714]

I may be one of the most unlikely of you. I am studying the Church and her teachings daily; praying the Rosary daily; and pretty much constantly during my workday offering up the Hail Mary, Our Father and prayers to two Saints who seem to have taken a particular interest in me. I also defend her vehemently to any Protestant who attacks her.

I also find great value in teachings which are hated by both the Protestant community, and I am learning, by the Catholic community. In short, I am finding that the Catholic Church is bringing fullness to my Word Of Faith beliefs.

What do you think: Is it possible we can be friends?

 

[tundramom]

Actually, I’m not quite sure what exactly your question is.

Of course we can be friends! I’m wondering who’s teachings you are finding good in that we would disagree with? I’m just assuming it’s someone like Joel Osteen?

in Christ
Steph

 

[Marsha_Adams]

I am finding that the Catholic Church is bringing fullness to my Word Of Faith beliefs.

How long has this been your experience? What is preventing you from becoming Catholic?

 

[ez3714]

How long has this been your experience? What is preventing you from becoming Catholic?

LOL! Ignorance! What else keeps a person from becoming Catholic.

Ok, let’s not get ahead of ourselves or make promises we might not be able to keep. Here’s the story:

I had always assumed Catholic beliefs were totally incompatible whith my own. In my 40’s, I picked up a copy of the Catechism and learned that a great deal of what I believed about the Church was a lie, but that there was still too much separating us.

In an ICU hospital bed just before Christmas, I sought and got new life directions. One of them was to learn more about the Catholic Church. I assumed this was so I could be a Protestant on friendly terms with Catholics in whatever environment I was being led to. I may have misinterpreted the intention of the instructions.

Today, I went to my second Mass ever; and this time, a man in a red hat was the Celebrant. We chatted, and he gave me instructions on whom to talk to about learning more. And he blessed my Rosary beads. Sweet man. He deserves press for being a gentle, faithful Shepherd, rather than being thrust into the national spotlight for being the Bishop in a region that has a Catholic University that recently made a dreadful error in judgement.

 

[SpiritMeadow]

You might find it profitable to concentrate on your desire to enter the RCC and stop worrying so much about Protestants, most of whom don’t hate the RCC or any other faith community. Sigh…

 

[Marsha_Adams]

Today, I went to my second Mass ever;

Keep going to Mass, you will learn a lot there. (You do know that you must not receive communion until you are Catholic, right?) But focus on the tabernacle before Mass begins. That is where Jesus is physically present in the Eucharist.

 

[ez3714]

Actually, I’m not quite sure what exactly your question is.

Of course we can be friends! I’m wondering who’s teachings you are finding good in that we would disagree with? I’m just assuming it’s someone like Joel Osteen?

in Christ
Steph

Hiya Steph (and all who answered). I’m not trying to bash the churches I grew up in, but there’s something I’ve noticed during my time of exploration: Catholics don’t duck Scripture. Bring up an “inconvenient” verse to a Protestant, and he’ll 1) deny it’s in the Bible, 2) accuse you of being led by satan, or 3) both. Then he may spit on you for fun.

Everytime I pose a question like that to a Catholic, it’s invariably something like, “Yes, that verse is in there, but let’s look at it in the context of the passage, and of the other verses in Scripture that support and/or modify it, then let’s look at the historical interpretations the Church has had…” and on and on.

What’s more, I durn near dislocated my TMJ when I heard Father Larry talking about a principle of WoF that I hold dear but that other Protestants reject, and he did that to another principle today. Not condeming them, but insisting they were important.

So, I’m wondering. Like Archbishop Sheen said: most people hate what they Think the Catholic church is; and if it were what they imagined it to be, he’d hate it too. So, are there Catholics who have examined WoF in the light of the teachings of the Church and of Scripture who see some truth? I’m not looking to proseletyze; I’m looking for common ground.

Joel Osteen? Nope. It was the teaching of the daddy John that helped me. I’d go further, but I’m not interested in anybody’s blood pressure going thru the roof.

 

[ez3714]

Keep going to Mass, you will learn a lot there. (You do know that you must not receive communion until you are Catholic, right?) But focus on the tabernacle before Mass begins. That is where Jesus is physically present in the Eucharist.

LOL, I just reviewed my very first post here on this site, and it was regarding how I should behave in this “foreign land.” Who woulda thunk I’d be chatting with a Bishop (in the headlines, no less!) on my second visit!

Yeah, Marsha. No Eucharist, no going up in the Eucharist line to be blessed, sit in the back pew and do like everybody else does and kneel when they kneel. I showed up early for Mass today, right in the middle of The Second Mystery and didn’t even know what hand to hold my Rosary in. I really gotta find a “guide” of sorts…

 

[Marsha_Adams]

I showed up early for Mass today, right in the middle of The Second Mystery and didn’t even know what hand to hold my Rosary in. I really gotta find a “guide” of sorts…

I’m left handed, learning to bless myself with my right hand was a minor challenge. As for rosary holding, I’ve never heard that there is a rule as to which hand so do as you please.

 

[ckempston]

LOL! Ignorance! What else keeps a person from becoming Catholic.

Ok, let’s not get ahead of ourselves or make promises we might not be able to keep. Here’s the story:

I had always assumed Catholic beliefs were totally incompatible whith my own. In my 40’s, I picked up a copy of the Catechism and learned that a great deal of what I believed about the Church was a lie, but that there was still too much separating us.

In an ICU hospital bed just before Christmas, I sought and got new life directions. One of them was to learn more about the Catholic Church. I assumed this was so I could be a Protestant on friendly terms with Catholics in whatever environment I was being led to. I may have misinterpreted the intention of the instructions.

Today, I went to my second Mass ever; and this time, a man in a red hat was the Celebrant. We chatted, and he gave me instructions on whom to talk to about learning more. And he blessed my Rosary beads. Sweet man. He deserves press for being a gentle, faithful Shepherd, rather than being thrust into the national spotlight for being the Bishop in a region that has a Catholic University that recently made a dreadful error in judgement.

I find it interesting that this is the experience of seemingly so many “Protestants.” The more “Protestants” learn about Catholicism and what it actually teaches, along with studying the history of the church, and getting into deeper Bible study in general, the more Catholic-like they become in their walk with God. Whether they all take that final step or resolve all differences is another story, but it is an interesting phenomena.

 

[ez3714]

This is as good a time as any to make a public confession of error. Y’all, I blew it.

I had always maintained that there was nothing more useless than a religious “argument.” All it ever accomplished was to annoy people. Nobody’s opinion was ever changed by “facts.” Nobody ever got “argued” into heaven.

My former position may or may not be true when it comes to unbelievers. However, I was completely wrong when it comes to people being brought back into the Mother Church. Patient, loving and thorough Catholic apologists can in fact bear fruit.

 

[steve_b]

In an ICU hospital bed just before Christmas, I sought and got new life directions. One of them was to learn more about the Catholic Church. I assumed this was so I could be a Protestant on friendly terms with Catholics in whatever environment I was being led to. I may have misinterpreted the intention of the instructions.

Could you expand on the particulars?

Example,

• who was giving you the nudge
• Why did you follow the instruction
• when/why did you start praying the Rosary
• etc etc?

apologies if this is a repeat for you

 

[ez3714]

Could you expand on the particulars?

Example,

• who was giving you the nudge
• Why did you follow the instruction
• when/why did you start praying the Rosary
• etc etc?

apologies if this is a repeat for you

Do I weary of proclaiming that God is great?

I was in a V-A hospital, and their tests determined a heart attack might be imminent. They set up an appointment for me to see a VA cardiologist 150-miles away in a week’s time. My Doctor, who hadn’t seen me at all that day, called in (for no particular reason?) to order me to stay for a few more hours so that I might re-take a blood test I had already passed. Upon seeing the results, they stripped off my clothes and pretty much threw me into an ambulance bound for a cross-town hospital where they installed a miniature beer can in a coronary artery.

(I later thanked the Doctor for saving my life; she claimed she did nothing. “God did it,” she said.)

I asked God why He saved a life that wasn’t worth saving; but that since He had, could He please make it clear to me what He wanted with it.

I obeyed because to make such a request and not follow through on your end is dishonourable. I always know I may misinterpret instructions, but I am too old to fear appearing stupid in front of others…and I have far too much experience at it.

The Rosary: Can NOT for the life of me explain why I was drawn to it. Never even heard it done before. I found myself in a Catholic bookstore buying a c-d of Mother Angelica et al reciting it, and I’d listen to a decade a day. Then one day when I should have been sleeping (I work 3rd shift), I found myself in the Cathedral Bookstore because I just Had to have a set of Rosary beads Right Now. The simple wood & string kind that a guy who smells bad after a day at work carries with him.

Basic principle from my past faith-walk: You do what you’re told, even when it doesn’t make sense to you. If you goober things up, you repent and keep walking.

 

[steve_b]

Do I weary of proclaiming that God is great?

I was in a V-A hospital, and their tests determined a heart attack might be imminent. They set up an appointment for me to see a VA cardiologist 150-miles away in a week’s time. My Doctor, who hadn’t seen me at all that day, called in (for no particular reason?) to order me to stay for a few more hours so that I might re-take a blood test I had already passed. Upon seeing the results, they stripped off my clothes and pretty much threw me into an ambulance bound for a cross-town hospital where they installed a miniature beer can in a coronary artery.

(I later thanked the Doctor for saving my life; she claimed she did nothing. “God did it,” she said.)

I asked God why He saved a life that wasn’t worth saving; but that since He had, could He please make it clear to me what He wanted with it.

I obeyed because to make such a request and not follow through on your end is dishonourable. I always know I may misinterpret instructions, but I am too old to fear appearing stupid in front of others…and I have far too much experience at it.

The Rosary: Can NOT for the life of me explain why I was drawn to it. Never even heard it done before. I found myself in a Catholic bookstore buying a c-d of Mother Angelica et al reciting it, and I’d listen to a decade a day. Then one day when I should have been sleeping (I work 3rd shift), I found myself in the Cathedral Bookstore because I just Had to have a set of Rosary beads Right Now. The simple wood & string kind that a guy who smells bad after a day at work carries with him.

Basic principle from my past faith-walk: You do what you’re told, even when it doesn’t make sense to you. If you goober things up, you repent and keep walking.

cool !!!

What now?

 

[ez3714]

cool !!!

What now?

lol. Well I suppose eventually we could get around to talking about some of the common ground that WoF and the Church have.

The two things that Father Larry mentioned in separate sermons that really shocked me - especially since I can’t get most other Protestants to “get” this - are 1) We can…and are expected to…lead victorious lives. Christ gave us the victory, and a victim mentality is really not appropriate for us.

I would add at this point that WoF seems to either downplay the need for or reject altogether the benefits of suffering. While their point has some merit, there is too much in favor of the Catholic argument on this issue…for me, anyway.

1. Righteousness. This could easily degenerate into a cousin of the Faith v Works argument. But I was shocked to hear Fr. Larry’s position that righteousness is something that is ours by virtue of our position in Christ.

That’s it for openers.

Oh! I gather that the position of the Church is that the Gifts of the Holy Spirit never really ceased. Good Heavens, I’m glad that’s one argument I’ll never have to have here.

 

[East_Anglican]

I may be one of the most unlikely of you. I am studying the Church and her teachings daily; praying the Rosary daily; and pretty much constantly during my workday offering up the Hail Mary, Our Father and prayers to two Saints who seem to have taken a particular interest in me. I also defend her vehemently to any Protestant who attacks her.

I also find great value in teachings which are hated by both the Protestant community, and I am learning, by the Catholic community. In short, I am finding that the Catholic Church is bringing fullness to my Word Of Faith beliefs.

What do you think: Is it possible we can be friends?

You are obviously on a journey right now. There is a good chance that there are both RC beliefs and WOF beliefs you have that I can’t stand but then there is an equally good chance that you have RC beliefs and WOF beliefs that I may be willing to die to defend.

I’ve been everywhere. It can be turbulant but God is with you so godspeed wherever he takes you.

 

[emarc]

lol. Well I suppose eventually we could get around to talking about some of the common ground that WoF and the Church have.

The two things that Father Larry mentioned in separate sermons that really shocked me - especially since I can’t get most other Protestants to “get” this - are 1) We can…and are expected to…lead victorious lives. Christ gave us the victory, and a victim mentality is really not appropriate for us.

I would add at this point that WoF seems to either downplay the need for or reject altogether the benefits of suffering. While their point has some merit, there is too much in favor of the Catholic argument on this issue…for me, anyway.

1. Righteousness. This could easily degenerate into a cousin of the Faith v Works argument. But I was shocked to hear Fr. Larry’s position that righteousness is something that is ours by virtue of our position in Christ.

That’s it for openers.

Oh! I gather that the position of the Church is that the Gifts of the Holy Spirit never really ceased. Good Heavens, I’m glad that’s one argument I’ll never have to have here.

may i ask how you interpret # 1? the statement is loaded w/c could either mean material victory or spiritual victory. many saints are now saints in heaven because of their sufferings in Christ; sufferings that have redemptive values w/c is the salvation of souls, not only their own but of many others. they died bringing many souls with them; the victory that refers to the ultimate - the Kingdom of God. watching many televangelists proclaim victory in Christ, leading their parishioners to mean prosperity while here on earth; the health and wealth type of preaching might be misleading their parishioners. Catholics tend to lean more on spiritual victory rather than material.
God bless.

 

[ez3714]

may i ask how you interpret # 1? the statement is loaded w/c could either mean material victory or spiritual victory. many saints are now saints in heaven because of their sufferings in Christ; sufferings that have redemptive values w/c is the salvation of souls, not only their own but of many others. they died bringing many souls with them; the victory that refers to the ultimate - the Kingdom of God. watching many televangelists proclaim victory in Christ, leading their parishioners to mean prosperity while here on earth; the health and wealth type of preaching might be misleading their parishioners. Catholics tend to lean more on spiritual victory rather than material.
God bless.

I would say that my answer to that is “yes.”

Let me set up a couple of scenarios: A child is walking home from school. A car pulls up, and a stranger offers the child a piece of candy. From that scenario (and I’m exaggerating to make a point), some would say that candy is evil and it is used by the hater of our souls to lead us to destruction. Yes.

Others would say that any parent loves seeing their child happy. When my youngest boy was 3, we had a real wrestling match when I tried to get him to sample chocolate pudding. He’d never had it before, and it didn’t look like something he’d want. I’ll never forget the look on his face when he finally tried a bit. I think God delights not only in our spiritual growth, but also in letting us occasionally have chocolate.

(I suppose I could also discuss the extreme dangers of adultery vs the positive side of “renewing the marital bonds” but I think the point is made).

Second: The Bible says that any parent who loves a child will discipline the young one. It goes so far as to say the undisciplined child is for all intents and purposes illegitimate. The discipline need not result from the disobedience of the child. And it’s entirely appropriate for the child (if he has the maturity to understand) to thank the parent for the discipline.

Contrast that with a schoolyard bully who steals the child’s chocolate candy and lunch money, and pushes him facedown in the dirt. Because candy is wrong; because poverty and discipline are good?

What I would hope to see is some of my WoF brethren examine more closely the benefits of Godly suffering. And I would like to see the Catholics that I have grown to love develope a more belligerent attitude along the lines of, “devil, if you ever again try laying a hand on me or my family, you’ll draw back a stump.”

 

[steve_b]

The two things that Father Larry mentioned in separate sermons that really shocked me - especially since I can’t get most other Protestants to “get” this - are 1) We can…and are expected to…lead victorious lives. Christ gave us the victory, and a victim mentality is really not appropriate for us.

I would add at this point that WoF seems to either downplay the need for or reject altogether the benefits of suffering. While their point has some merit, **there is too much in favor of the Catholic argument on this issue…**for me, anyway.

Re: the Catholic argument, As Paul writes to the Church of Rome

Now **if **we are children, then we are heirs—heirs of God and co-heirs with Christ, **if **indeed we share in his sufferings in order that we may also share in his glory. [Rm 8:17]

Those If’/then statements are conditions that get in the way of many people’s theology.

Not to mention how many times the "co-" in front of a word gets mistranslated into equal to instead of “with.”
ez:

1. Righteousness. This could easily degenerate into a cousin of the Faith v Works argument. But I was shocked to hear Fr. Larry’s position that righteousness is something that is ours by virtue of our position in Christ.

That’s it for openers.

those are Big openers!!!

As is One’s position in Christ :heaven: