Worried about Pope's recent comments about Communion after divorce. PLEASE HELP!

  • Thread starter Thread starter AlexanderC
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
A

AlexanderC

Guest
I hope this is the right section to post this in but anyway,

Stumbled across this earlier and I am absolutely dumbfounded and worried as what I should make of this. PLEASE HELP! For all I know it’s just bad reporting and I’m totally overreacting but I am still worried. If I should post this in another thread let me know. Sorry it’s just links, I feel a little rushed.

telegraph.co.uk/news/religion/the-pope/10782508/Pope-Francis-tells-sinner-she-should-be-allowed-Communion.html

wisn.com/Pope-stirs-Communion-debate-with-call-to-woman/25624306?absolute=true

God bless you all!
 
Divorce is not the same as Divorce and Remarriage, contrary to popular thought the former has never prevented communion, the latter does
 
The whole thing never would have happened if the couple had not posted a private conversation on Facebook. There is no sense of privacy anymore.

And as others have pointed out, it is not about divorce but about divorce and subsequent remarriage outside of the Church.

-Tim-
 
TimothyH said:
The whole thing never would have happened if the couple had not posted a private conversation on Facebook. There is no sense of privacy anymore.

And as others have pointed out, it is not about divorce but about divorce and subsequent remarriage outside of the Church.

-Tim-
Click to expand...
On Facebook!! I was wondering how it got out. Why would they do that? Now Fr Lombardi has been sideswiped by the media. As far as I’m concerned, it’s like a confession, I wouldn’t publicise my confession and the priests response to the world via Facebook.
 
SAVINGRACE said:
On Facebook!! I was wondering how it got out. Why would they do that? Now Fr Lombardi has been sideswiped by the media. As far as I’m concerned, it’s like a confession, I wouldn’t publicise my confession and the priests response to the world via Facebook.
Click to expand...
That brings up another issue…confession by phone?
 
AlexanderC said:
I hope this is the right section to post this in but anyway,

Stumbled across this earlier and I am absolutely dumbfounded and worried as what I should make of this. PLEASE HELP! For all I know it’s just bad reporting and I’m totally overreacting but I am still worried. If I should post this in another thread let me know. Sorry it’s just links, I feel a little rushed.

telegraph.co.uk/news/religion/the-pope/10782508/Pope-Francis-tells-sinner-she-should-be-allowed-Communion.html

wisn.com/Pope-stirs-Communion-debate-with-call-to-woman/25624306?absolute=true

God bless you all!
Click to expand...
Just as Jimmy Akin wrote on his column at NC Register, we do not know the facts of the case.

Regardless, though, we should be cautious of our indignation. We don’t want to be like the elder brother in the Parable of the Prodigal Son who was resentful of the father for showing mercy to his younger brother.

God bless you,

KfG
 
SAVINGRACE said:
On Facebook!! I was wondering how it got out. Why would they do that? Now Fr Lombardi has been sideswiped by the media. As far as I’m concerned, it’s like a confession, I wouldn’t publicise my confession and the priests response to the world via Facebook.
Click to expand...
The Pope supposedly called the woman and the woman’s husband put the whole thing on spacebook or myface or something. The couple’s pastor should have been the only person privy to the fact that the conversation even took place, let alone what was said.

And all of us should mind our own business. It has nothing to do with us. Personally, I have more important things to worry about than whether some lady on a different continent received a phone call from the Pope or whether she receives communion or not.

Dogma still stands. The Incarnation, resurrection and the Eucharist are still fact. Mary is still a virgin. Jesus is still God. And I still have to get up at 5:45 AM tomorrow to get two kids to school, work all day, and then spend my Friday evening trying to figure out why a 1998 Honda CR-V dies randomly as it is being driven down the road. 🤷

Nothing has changed.

-Tim-
 
Ah, the media. I simply rely on the fact that the gates of hell will NEVER prevail against the Church. Also, I have the utmost faith in our Holy Father.
 
The Pope is not God, the Church is not beholden to conform to his every whim and private act and personal opinions, etc. Even if we assume it is true that the Pope gave bad advice to some individual, etc. then that’s on him on him and that’s it.

Likewise, the Pope is not necessarily the most learned theologian, the most competent canonist, the best pastor, the most holy Catholic, etc., etc. We’ve been spoiled in recent times as we have had Popes who seem to be these things, but it will not necessarily always be so, as history shows. I think with increased 24-7 media scrutiny of every little act of Popes, seeing their mistakes–or hearing mistakes alleged-- will become more and more commonplace.

Because of this it will be more and more important to keep the proper perspective regarding the papacy. We seem more willing and able to do this with our own ordinary bishops and priests, but the Pope is sometimes treated as more than he is. He is the vicar of Christ, but not Christ. There’s no book I know of about the “Immitation of the Pope” like there is about Christ. But we do reverence the Pope as the vicar of Christ and obey the Pope as the vicar of Christ, and receive the teaching of the Pope as the vicar of Christ, according to his mind and will. The whole Church is only bound to his public acts which are directed authoritatively to the whole Church and the charisms of his office, including his exercise of the infallible teaching authority of the Church, only really exist for the good of the whole Church, in aedificationem, et non in destructionem (to use the traditional phrase describing the limits of the Pope’s authority, cf. 2 Cor. 10:8).

Likewise, if not addressing the whole Church, he exercises some act over a particular portion or individual of the Church which includes us (e.g if he made some decision for my diocese alone, etc.) then we are to obey it unless it commands sin, then we obey God rather than man.

He has no authority to change the truths of faith, or to command or encourage sin. It’s not in his job description. If he were to do so, then the guilt would be his own. And God forbid, should a Pope go so far as to defect from the faith, the whole Church will not follow him into his error–we have the promise of Christ to that effect–the flock recognizes the voice of its pastor and will not follow someone other than its head (although large portions may). It is also a doctrine of the faith (the opposite error was definitively condemned by Sixtus IV) that the particular Church of Rome will never fall into error–so even if the Pope individually did, the Roman Church would still remain as a fixed reference point.

I’m not saying Pope Francis has done any of these things or that it is even likely that he would, but since he is a fallen human being like all of us and every Pope before him and every Pope to come, it is conceivable that he could screw up, just like it is conceivable that any person could. But we can’t let the possibility that a fallen human being may fall short of the duties of his office shake our faith in the true head of the Church, Christ, or the Holy Spirit which animates the Church and guides her in all truth. They will never fail.
 
Here’s my take on this story:

First of all, it’s none of my business what the Pope said to that woman. It could only become my business if it had some impact on Church teaching, which it doesn’t.

That said, and all media misreporting aside, what are we to make of this now that we know about it?

I don’t think these people are liars. I have no reason to think that of them. Moreover, I don’t believe Pope Francis actually gave them this advice. So, what do I think is most likely? I believe it’s simply a matter of miscommunication.

I know in my own experience people don’t always hear what’s actually being said, but rather hear mainly what they want to hear.

If Church teaching is to be any guide, I believe Pope Francis’ actual advice would have been something like this:

The Church teachings on this are clear, your husband is still married to the other woman before God. You are not his wife, and the children you have had with him have been had out of wedlock. As a daughter of the Church, you must acknowledge and accept this. However, I can see that you have built a life with this man, and as such you have certain parental obligations, particularly providing a stable and loving environment for your children. Therefore, it may be considered unreasonable and even detrimental to break down this life you have built and cause further pain and suffering. Therefore, if you are repentant of your sins, and you confess your sins to a priest, and you make a firm commitment to live chastely with this man, as brother and sister, then it is possible for you to receive communion. However, should you have intercourse with this man in the future, you will have to confess your sin before receiving again. Moreover, given that there are those in your parish who know your situation, we do not want to cause scandal to them. This is your affair, but there is a public element to it, and if you do receive communion, they would still be under the impression that you are living with this man as husband and wife, and this may scandalize them into believing Church law has changed in this matter, when it has not. Therefore, in order to prevent scandal, it would be better for you to go to another parish wherein nobody knows your situation. Be of good heart, my daughter, the Lord is merciful. Be obedient to the Church, and He will give Himself to you.
 
Have faith in the Holy Spirit or have you forgotten that the Holy Spirit guides the Church.
You can always pray for the Pope if your worried,
 
Don’t rely on the non Catholic news media for your news. Pope Francis says he is a good son of the Church, so trust the Holy Spirit and pray for it to guide the Church and the Holy Father.
 
MrSnaith said:
Here’s my take on this story:

First of all, it’s none of my business what the Pope said to that woman. It could only become my business if it had some impact on Church teaching, which it doesn’t.

That said, and all media misreporting aside, what are we to make of this now that we know about it?

I don’t think these people are liars. I have no reason to think that of them. Moreover, I don’t believe Pope Francis actually gave them this advice. So, what do I think is most likely? I believe it’s simply a matter of miscommunication.

I know in my own experience people don’t always hear what’s actually being said, but rather hear mainly what they want to hear.

If Church teaching is to be any guide, I believe Pope Francis’ actual advice would have been something like this:

The Church teachings on this are clear, your husband is still married to the other woman before God. You are not his wife, and the children you have had with him have been had out of wedlock. As a daughter of the Church, you must acknowledge and accept this. However, I can see that you have built a life with this man, and as such you have certain parental obligations, particularly providing a stable and loving environment for your children. Therefore, it may be considered unreasonable and even detrimental to break down this life you have built and cause further pain and suffering. Therefore, if you are repentant of your sins, and you confess your sins to a priest, and you make a firm commitment to live chastely with this man, as brother and sister, then it is possible for you to receive communion. However, should you have intercourse with this man in the future, you will have to confess your sin before receiving again. Moreover, given that there are those in your parish who know your situation, we do not want to cause scandal to them. This is your affair, but there is a public element to it, and if you do receive communion, they would still be under the impression that you are living with this man as husband and wife, and this may scandalize them into believing Church law has changed in this matter, when it has not. Therefore, in order to prevent scandal, it would be better for you to go to another parish wherein nobody knows your situation. Be of good heart, my daughter, the Lord is merciful. Be obedient to the Church, and He will give Himself to you.
Click to expand...
After speaking to a priest at the school I work at who is also a Jesuit, he said the Pope could possibly have said what the couple said he told them, but there would have to be more information and circumstances than were not reported. It is a shame that these people did not have the common sense to keep this to themselves.

We cannot expect every situation to be handled exactly the same way. I trust that the Pope is capable enough to handle any situation that comes his way with help from the Holy Spirit. People really need to calm down and go about their Catholic lives as best they can. Nothing has changed in the Church.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top