1+1+1=1

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Anthony86 said:
This is actually different from how the Church understands the Trinity (insofar as this mystery can be understood). In your example, we’re talking about a single person, fulfilling several different roles and/or standing in diverse relations to others. In the case of the Trinity, we’re talking about three different Persons, who are somehow one being. An (apparently) different understanding of how They are One is part of what separates Roman Catholicism from Eastern Orthodoxy.
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My statement wasn’t supposed to be viewed as a summation of what the Church teaches. It’s a starting point into a more in-depth discussion which assumes a)the person has no knowledge of what the Church teaches and b)the person actually wants to understand what the Church teaches and isn’t just posting some snarky comment.

If I’m able to be several different individuals at once (one can argue that depending on external or internal viewpoints I can be such) or have aspects of several different individuals despite being flawed (not perfect) and not divine than it is only logical that God who is fully perfect and fully divine can be 3 different individuals and 1 individual at the same time.
 
aemcpa said:
That would imply that each Person is 1/3 of God, which would be an abominable act of blasphemy.
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Any analogy used in talking about the Trinity is going to fall short when pushed too far. That’s simply the nature of an infinite God. St. Patrick’s famous clover analogy would also imply that each Person is 1/3 of God if you took it too far.

Such is the nature of analogies. They help increase understanding by way of comparison. But they’re not intended to be taken as literally descriptive.
 
Joe_5859 said:
Any analogy used in talking about the Trinity is going to fall short when pushed too far. That’s simply the nature of an infinite God. St. Patrick’s famous clover analogy would also imply that each Person is 1/3 of God if you took it too far.

Such is the nature of analogies. They help increase understanding by way of comparison. But they’re not intended to be taken as literally descriptive.
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I would not attempt to put any math equations to it. I think it’s better to attempt to draw parallels from the very created Universe that reflects God’s nature than to reduce it to a math problem. Your first comment would make me think you agree.
 
oldcatholicguy said:
They’re using the wrong cross in their equation. They need to be using St. Andrew’s cross. 1x1x1=1.

Or, you could have them list out all the things they are at the same time (like being a father, brother, son, husband, male, Catholic, American citizen, veteran) and ask them how it’s possible for them to be 8 different people at the same time.
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Seriously. That is a killer answer.
 
oldcatholicguy said:
They’re using the wrong cross in their equation. They need to be using St. Andrew’s cross. 1x1x1=1.

Or, you could have them list out all the things they are at the same time (like being a father, brother, son, husband, male, Catholic, American citizen, veteran) and ask them how it’s possible for them to be 8 different people at the same time.
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What an amazing reply, simply brilliant:thumbsup:
 
The Trinity:One God with three Divine natures.God the Creator,Jesus Christ ,Saviour andRedeemer,HolySpirit,Light and Inspiration:thumbsup:
 
aemcpa said:
I would not attempt to put any math equations to it. I think it’s better to attempt to draw parallels from the very created Universe that reflects God’s nature than to reduce it to a math problem. Your first comment would make me think you agree.
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Yes, I agree. But since the poster was asking about how to respond to the math problem, I wanted to reference the math problem in my response.
 
I’m happy to see this level of involvement in this thread. I have been confronted by a fair number of non Catholics that all seem to want to say “Oh yeah? Well…” and this “equation” is one of the many tools they like to bust out to try and shoot down my faith (as if they had a chance). That is why I was looking for something on the logical and less in the faithful. But thanks to you all for your answers! I have read some amazing stuff on here!

-Brian
 
In the past certain theologians have attempted to explain (at least to some degree) the Holy Trinity in terms of love. God is love, and God is eternal. With this in mind…

True love, as opposed to self-love (i.e., narcissism) is found in a relationship. God eternally exists as a relationship of love between three divine persons. If God existed as one and only one person, then there would not be a relationship of love pre-existing creation (and therefore God’s love would not be eternal).

Whereas true love is found within a relationship, the goal of love is to unite those within that relationship. We see this in how the love between humans brings them closer together. But because humans are imperfect, the uniting power of human love can only go so far in this effort to unite. On the other hand, the love between the Father, Son and Holy Spirit is perfect, and therefore it perfectly achieves the goal of love. Although within a relationship between three distinct persons, divine love perfectly unites them as one God.

The Holy Trinity is a divine mystery, so only God can fully understand how there are three divine persons and still only one God. In light of this, I understand that the explanation I presented here is not perfect, but I think it is still helpful in trying to explain the mystery of the Holy Trinity in discussions like this. Even though the three divine persons are distinct from one another, they are not subject to the limitations of time and space. In light of this, there is not a logical contradiction between belief in the power of divine love to perfectly unite such limitless beings and our understanding of mathematical equations.
 
I think trying to explain God is like trying to explain how big infinity is. It’s kind of a waste of time, isn’t it? 🤷
 
pete_29 said:
I think trying to explain God is like trying to explain how big infinity is. It’s kind of a waste of time, isn’t it? 🤷
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God is infinite.

Infinity + Infinity + Infinity = Infinity. All the math books will support this.
 
I would tend to go with the “1x1x1=1”, and then ask why they assumed their equation accurately modelled the Trinity. Not every real thing is properly modelled with simple addition.

But then I tend to get sarcastic, which is bad, and ask if two spaceships approaching each other at 0.6 times the speed to light, relative to Earth, are travelling 1.2 times the speed of light relative to each other: after all, 0.6 + 0.6 = 1.2.
 
TypesAndShadows said:
I would tend to go with the “1x1x1=1”, and then ask why they assumed their equation accurately modelled the Trinity. Not every real thing is properly modelled with simple addition.

But then I tend to get sarcastic, which is bad, and ask if two spaceships approaching each other at 0.6 times the speed to light, relative to Earth, are travelling 1.2 times the speed of light relative to each other: after all, 0.6 + 0.6 = 1.2.
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Awesome.
 
Aeden said:
Why not? Infinity means something without limit. Adding three limitless things together still creates one, single, limitless thing.
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There are not three limitless things to add together.
 
  1. Is it safe to say that each one is at once itself and part of the whole?
  2. I had someone explain that it was God=father+son+HS, and this didn’t seem right to me.:confused:
 
aemcpa said:
No math book would support this, actually.
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Aleph-null (the smallest infinity) is the number of the integers. It is also the number of the positive even numbers. It is also the number of the positive odd numbers. It is also the number of the non-positive integers.

So: positive even = 2 4 6 …
positive odd = 1 3 5 7 …
non-positive integers = 0 -1 -2 …

And that’s all the integers so

Aleph-null + Aleph-null + Aleph-null = Aleph-null
or
infinity + infinity + infinity = infinity.

And if we assume the continuum hypothosis, the next highest infinity is Aleph-null squared = Aleph-one
 
Evan said:
Aleph-null (the smallest infinity) is the number of the integers. It is also the number of the positive even numbers. It is also the number of the positive odd numbers. It is also the number of the non-positive integers.

So: positive even = 2 4 6 …
positive odd = 1 3 5 7 …
non-positive integers = 0 -1 -2 …

And that’s all the integers so

Aleph-null + Aleph-null + Aleph-null = Aleph-null
or
infinity + infinity + infinity = infinity.

And if we assume the continuum hypothosis, the next highest infinity is Aleph-null squared = Aleph-one
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… Evan, I think you just talked me crosseyed. Lol, I don’t know much on math, never made it past pre-calc, but this is interesting!😃
 
BMorel said:
… Evan, I think you just talked me crosseyed. Lol, I don’t know much on math, never made it past pre-calc, but this is interesting!😃
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Calm… calm. Just repeat after me: Math is fun, Math is fun, mathisfun mathisfun.

So… with an infinite being, no finite thing can be added or removed which would change the grandure of such a being.

So, when the Son, whose infinity was dwindled to infancy (to quote Gerard Manley Hopkins) He became no less because he was still an infinity God. And having 3 persons in the Godhead does not make more Gods. There is one infinite God, 3 persons, but still one God.
 
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