1. Maccabees 1:14-15 Question

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14: So they built a gymnasium in Jerusalem, according to Gentile custom,
15: and removed the marks of circumcision, and abandoned the holy covenant. They joined with the Gentiles and sold themselves to do evil.

How exactly would one remove a circumcision? Through a skin graph to replace the foreskin?
 
The St. Jerome Biblical Commentary states:

Inasmuch as the mark of circumcision - the sign of the covenant with Yahweh - was all too evident in the nudity of the gymnasium, Hellenizing Jews attempted to disguise it by an operation.
 
Yeah, we just talked about this in a Scripture study course and apparently they could “add” something to cover the appearance.

Great stories in Maccabees. The mother and son martyrs are an amazing story of standing by their faith to the death…
 
During this time, if Jewish mothers were found circumcising their infants, they would hang the baby around the mothers neck and make her walk around Jerusalem like that for days.

It wasn’t a high point in Greek - Jewish relations.
 
Chris_LaRock said:
14: So they built a gymnasium in Jerusalem, according to Gentile custom,
15: and removed the marks of circumcision, and abandoned the holy covenant. They joined with the Gentiles and sold themselves to do evil.

How exactly would one remove a circumcision? Through a skin graph to replace the foreskin?
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The Douay-Rheims is a little more explicit, saying:
“And they made themselves prepuces…”

So, it appears that they wore fake foreskins. I would imagine they were fashioned from animal skins or something similar.
 
Todd_Easton said:
The Douay-Rheims is a little more explicit, saying:
“And they made themselves prepuces…”

So, it appears that they wore fake foreskins. I would imagine they were fashioned from animal skins or something similar.
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I notice in several painting the Jews at this time were seen wearing earmuffs.

You don’t think… naw!!! 🙂
 
Chris_LaRock said:
How exactly would one remove a circumcision? Through a skin graft?
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NO! It was non-surgical. A cone-shaped piece of clay was fashioned. It was placed against the male organ. The remaining skin was rolled forward onto the cone and pulled past the end. A loop of twine held the skin in place. In time, the skin grew longer from the constant gentle (gentile?) tension.

The same techniques are used today, along with strikingly more modern ones.

cirp.org/library/history/hodges2/

-Ron
 
and here we have it folks, early origins of cosmetic surgery, so if you teen gets a body piercing in an unappetizing place, cut him some slack (ooooh, bad figure of speech).
 
I guess that answers my question, but it still seems a bit extreme.
 
Chris_LaRock said:
I guess that answers my question, but it still seems a bit extreme.
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Yes, but these were extreme times. I’ll post this again:
During this time, if Jewish mothers were found circumcising their infants, the Greeks would hang the baby around the mothers neck and make her walk around Jerusalem like that for days.
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The more I picture this image, the more it turns my stomach.
 
NotWorthy said:
Yes, but these were extreme times. I’ll post this again:
The more I picture this image, the more it turns my stomach.
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And the Maccabees stayed firm in their Jewish faith fighting to the end.

Did you read what they did to the Maccabbean martyrs (2 Mac 7)? Burned them, boiled them, tore off their skin, etc. I wept as I read the faith of the Mother who talked her sons through this, one at a time, to the youngest. “Filled with a nobel spirit, she fired her woman’s reasoning with a man’s courage, and said to them, ‘I do not know how you came into being in my womb. It was not I who gave you life and breath…The Creator of the world… will in his mercy give life and breath back to you again, since you now forget yourself for the sake of his laws’” and “Accept death, so that in God’s mercy I may get you back again with your brothers”

Could any of us hold up watching the torture of our own children. I shudder…
 
ave_mom said:
And the Maccabees stayed firm in their Jewish faith fighting to the end.

Did you read what they did to the Maccabbean martyrs (2 Mac 7)? Burned them, boiled them, tore off their skin, etc. I wept as I read the faith of the Mother who talked her sons through this, one at a time, to the youngest. “Filled with a nobel spirit, she fired her woman’s reasoning with a man’s courage, and said to them, ‘I do not know how you came into being in my womb. It was not I who gave you life and breath…The Creator of the world… will in his mercy give life and breath back to you again, since you now forget yourself for the sake of his laws’” and “Accept death, so that in God’s mercy I may get you back again with your brothers”

Could any of us hold up watching the torture of our own children. I shudder…
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I was touched by Eleazar in the chapter prior to this one, as well! Those are beautiful stories of courage and FAITH!

Incidentally, isn’t there a story similar to this regarding the death of Polycarp in France? I seem to remember in “The Four Witnesses” a story strikinly similar to the woman whose 7 kids were tortured.
 
Actually, in most circumcised males, there is little difference in outward appearance between them and non-circumcised males, unless the penis is erect. And if the Hellenized Jews in Maccabees were running around with erect equipment, I suspect they had worse problems than we think…
 
Wolseley said:
Actually, in most circumcised males, there is little difference in outward appearance between them and non-circumcised males, unless the penis is erect. And if the Hellenized Jews in Maccabees were running around with erect equipment, I suspect they had worse problems than we think…
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Well, they were adopting the unclean habits of the gentiles. I suppose thier sexual perversions would have been one of those habits.
 
Wolseley said:
Actually, in most circumcised males, there is little difference in outward appearance between them and non-circumcised males, unless the penis is erect. And if the Hellenized Jews in Maccabees were running around with erect equipment, I suspect they had worse problems than we think…
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Without getting too graphic, where did you get this from? I mean, I grew up playing sports, and I know there is a noticeable difference.
 
I agree with NotWorthy…there is a notable difference in appearance between circumcised and uncircumcised males - regardless of whether or not they are sexually aroused.
 
CSJ said:
I agree with NotWorthy…there is a notable difference in appearance between circumcised and uncircumcised males - regardless of whether or not they are sexually aroused.
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In those times men were circumcised differently. Just the very tip was cut off. For the most part there was still glans coverage, as it’s meant to be covered.

It wasn’t completely removed as it is nowadays…
 
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