1 Timothy 2:12 - What does it mean in context?

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Hi
Thanks for replying to my post. I do understand where you are coming from but did you read the excerpt I put in my post about what Pope Pious XII had to say about how the bible should be read?

Our present pope had this to say -

While Catholics believe the Bible is inspired by the Holy Spirit and that it is true, one cannot take individual biblical quotes or passages and say each one is literally true, Pope Benedict XVI said.

“It is possible to perceive the Sacred Scriptures as the word of God” only by looking at the Bible as a whole, “a totality in which the individual elements enlighten each other and open the way to understanding,” the Pope wrote in a message to the Pontifical Biblical Commission.

Also given the Churche’s stance on evolution how on earth can we accept the story of Genesis literally?
 
I have just joined this forum
Welcome Candy! Since you are new, you probably don’t realize that you have resurrected an old thread. In this case, it worked out because you drew some responses to your question, but many times everyone who was participating is already moved on so it may be better to start a new thread. You can tell the age of the thread by looking at the date on the OP (original post).
and I have been trying to make sense of why women can not be ordained as priests.
One answer I found on Catholic Answers is that - A women cannot teach or have authority over a man.
This is part of the divine deposit of faith, but there are other factors that are more important. The priesthood is not a “right”, but a privilege to which no human being is entitled, man or woman.
As a catholic, brought up in Ireland, I was led to believe that God made us in his own image and likeness. This is the reason for my confusion - If man and woman were made in his own image and likeness there is no difference between man and woman. So I cannot understand why women cannot become priests
The fact that men and women are equal in dignity does not mean “there is no difference”. One of the reasons that only men are ordained is that they stand in the person of Christ as grooms to the bride (the Church). They espouse the Church and promise to love and serve her as the Bride of Christ.

Eph 5:25-33

25 Husbands, love your wives, just as Christ loved the church and gave himself up for her, 26 in order to make her holy by cleansing her with the washing of water by the word, 27 so as to present the church to himself in splendor, without a spot or wrinkle or anything of the kind — yes, so that she may be holy and without blemish. 28 In the same way, husbands should love their wives as they do their own bodies. He who loves his wife loves himself. 29 For no one ever hates his own body, but he nourishes and tenderly cares for it, just as Christ does for the church, 30 because we are members of his body. 31 “For this reason a man will leave his father and mother and be joined to his wife, and the two will become one flesh.” 32 This is a great mystery, and I am applying it to Christ and the church. 33 Each of you, however, should love his wife as himself, and a wife should respect her husband.

Human persons as husband and wife reflect the great mystery of Christ and His relationship with HIs Bride, the Church.
I would like to know based on what evidence or belief was this assumption arrived at?
This is not an “assumption” but something we received from the Apostles. The Church believes that she does not have the authority from Christ to ordain women. If Jesus wanted to ordain women, He would have done so, or instructed His Apostles to do so. He most certainly would have started with His Blessed Mother, who is Queen!
Code:
  On anything I have read about what the church fathers had to say on the status and role of women in society in general and in the church in particular, I cannot help thinking  that their views were formed coloured by the attitudes (both social and political) of the society in which they lived.
No doubt many disciplines and practices of the Church have been influenced by culture. For example, Jesus came as a man. If He had come as a woman to the Jews, no one would have listened to HIm, because women cannot become Rabbis.
I know my argument sounds simplistic, but sometimes when you overcomplicate an issue you cannot see the real truth
If you read the second and third chapters of Revelation, you will see a very powerful, very attentive Jesus talking to His Church. His power and authority have not waned since those letters were written. There is no doubt that, if He wants to correct His Church, He is able to do so. Since the ordination of only men has been an unbroken line of Tradition since the time of Moses, it does not appear that He wishes to do so.
 
The people who wrote the bible were influenced by attitudes both social and political of their times - hence the attitudes towards women. The way of thinking and expressing concepts and ideas and the way in which language was used was different to present day
Yes, they were, but that does not mean that certain practices of the Church are culturally based instead of doctrinally based.

The passage referenced:

1 Tim 2:8-15

8 I desire, then, that in every place the men should pray, lifting up holy hands without anger or argument; 9 also that the women should dress themselves modestly and decently in suitable clothing, not with their hair braided, or with gold, pearls, or expensive clothes, 10 but with good works, as is proper for women who profess reverence for God. 11 Let a woman learn in silence with full submission. 12 I permit no woman to teach or to have authority over a man; she is to keep silent. 13 For Adam was formed first, then Eve; 14 and Adam was not deceived, but the woman was deceived and became a transgressor. 15 Yet she will be saved through childbearing, provided they continue in faith and love and holiness, with modesty.

Was written to Timothy, ,a young Bishop that St. Paul ordained and placed over Ephesus. In that part of the country, there was a very powerful worship of female deities, specifically Artemis. You can read how rabid the Ephesians were about their goddess worship in Acts. 19. It was essential for men to take authority and exercise discipline in this chaotic environment. Today it is hard for us to understand how a culture of people would have trouble accepting a male God, after having spent centuries worshipping female goddesses.
 
Ask your friend if he likes porn. If he does then ask him which is more degrading to women, pornography or I Tim. 2:12?
 
Any attitude that reduces status or objectifies women or diminishes the capabilities and the role women can play in society or the church is degrading.
 
=Candy6;10030210]Hi
Thanks for replying to my post. I do understand where you are coming from but did you read the excerpt I put in my post about what Pope Pious XII had to say about how the bible should be read?
Our present pope had this to say -
While Catholics believe the Bible is inspired by the Holy Spirit and that it is true, one cannot take individual biblical quotes or passages and say each one is literally true, Pope Benedict XVI said.
“It is possible to perceive the Sacred Scriptures as the word of God” only by looking at the Bible as a whole, “a totality in which the individual elements enlighten each other and open the way to understanding,” the Pope wrote in a message to the Pontifical Biblical Commission.
Also given the Churche’s stance on evolution how on earth can we accept the story of Genesis literally?
OK and:)

A verse ought to be reinserted into the chapter, the chapter into the book, the book into that Autors total Authorship, and that into the entire bible.👍

That dear friend is the Popes message, He is NOT saying it’s “literal”; NO, he only saying it’s “true.”

I share with those in my class that the “Bible is TRU, BUT not necessarly factual.”

In a previous post to this thread I shared the various forms of written communication one can find in the bible. You may wish to go back and look at that web site.👍

God Bless,
pat/PJM

God bless,
pat/PJM
 
Here is something I found that may be of interest on the priesthood.

forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=146486

I declare that the Church has no authority whatsoever to confer priestly ordination on women and that this judgment is to be definitively held by all the Church’s faithful" (Ordinatio Sacerdotalis 4). Pope John Paul II.

Before the pope came out with this, I thought that it might be possible. But I don’t now.

Just a thought.
 
Any attitude that reduces status or objectifies women or diminishes the capabilities and the role women can play in society or the church is degrading.
The point I was making is that the world will take verses like this and say Christianity disrespects women, but at the same time says pornography is good; therefor being hypocritical.
 
Hi
Also given the Churche’s stance on evolution how on earth can we accept the story of Genesis literally?
Off the subject of the post, but, Jesus took Genesis to be literal (Mark 10:6 and Mathew 19:4).
 
IMHO this passage is simply a reflection of the misogyny that has plagued humankind for centuries. Even the Ten Commandments place women in the same category as livestock and slaves. In the Bible belt today, we have newly enacted laws discriminating against women - requiring that photo IDs show the exact name as registered to vote, when it is mostly women who change their names when married and divorced. It is time to quit explaining away such chauvinism with workarounds, and face the facts. Ladies, it’s there to keep you subservient.
 
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