3 things why you could never be Catholic again

  • Thread starter Thread starter ronnok20
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
ronnok20 said:
I am interested in why former Catholics would never return back to the Catholic church. Here are three things that will keep me from returning:
  1. The manditory belief in the infallibility of the magisterium.
  2. The belief that Mary is a co-redemptrix with Christ.
  3. The unwillingness of the RC to acknowledge that God is wholly in other churches besides the RC.
Click to expand...
Ronnok20, you were never a Catholic, so stop posing as one. Your posts reveal you to be completely ignorant of Catholic beliefs. If you’d ever truly been a Catholic, you would never post such questions as these. You’re easy to figure out, fundamentalist friend.
 
Hellisreal said:
Why need to argue at all? If someone has their reasons, why not simply let them have them?
These reasons are his/her reasons and they dont have to agree with the CC on them.
We dont have to argue with people who dont like what the CC teaches.
Or make them feel unwelcome to tell us why they are not coming back.
It does not matter how many times the topic has come up here. To this OP its his first time. He is a unique person with his own thoughts so no other thread would be exactly the same as his.
To write him off by saying this has been done before is insulting to the OP because his list is different than someone elses list.
Why make him feel like he cant voice his mind?:confused:
Click to expand...
Exactly

[SIGN]WELL SAID![/SIGN]
 
Having a charitable discussion which is full of information and Christian love is one thing that I support fully.

But I agree- some of the responses here have been very uncharitable in tone and content.

I want to remind every Catholic here, that discussions like these may cause you to react defensively to protect the Church. Feel free to dispute assertions with one or two sentences- but beyond that, link to a new thread. I am not asking anyone to remain silent in threads like this, but I would ask that if you want to go into great detail in explaining your point of view- do it in another thread.

I also appreciate that many non-Catholics come here just to 'stir the pot so to speak, but the “nose in the air” attitude displayed by some is not a valid retaliation to those posts. Better to ignore and not respond if you cannot respond charitably.

Please continue the discussion- and God bless.

Rachel
 
Rachel_Malloy said:
Exactly

[SIGN]WELL SAID![/SIGN]
Click to expand...
The OP should check in here first

Have questions about the Catholic Church?
The CHNetwork is operated by many staff members who are themselves converts, and would be happy to discuss any theological questions you might have. We want to help you learn more about the Catholic Church, and help you discover the wonderful treasures that it contains.

Are you on the Journey? Are you a convert who remembers what it was like? Are you a cradle Catholic?
If you fit into any of these categories or if you would just like to be part of this truly awesome group, you can Join the Coming Home Network by e-mailing us or contacting us by mail or phone at the address listed at the bottom of the page.
Would you like to assist others on the journey home?
Your help is needed especially if you have faced the same journey. There are others from your previous denomination who could use an encouraging word or someone to discuss specific issues with by email, phone, mail or even in person.

chnetwork.org/
 
ronnok20 said:
I am interested in why former Catholics would never return back to the Catholic church. Here are three things that will keep me from returning:
  1. The manditory belief in the infallibility of the magisterium.
  2. The belief that Mary is a co-redemptrix with Christ.
  3. The unwillingness of the RC to acknowledge that God is wholly in other churches besides the RC.
Click to expand...
well, i left the church 25 years ago and that wasn’t what a reason why i left. i came back and am happier than ever.
 
Rachel, looking over my post I realize I for one am guilty. My phrase, “Bible geekery”, is definitely uncharitable. Protestant love for the Bible is commendable and Catholics would do well to imitate them. I apologize to all.
 
ronnok20 said:
I am interested in why former Catholics would never return back to the Catholic church. Here are three things that will keep me from returning:
Click to expand...
Hello R!

Blessings to you and your family!
ronnok20 said:
  1. The manditory belief in the infallibility of the magisterium.
Click to expand...
Code: 
Is it just the Catholic Magisterium or do you have a problem with the protestant magisterium and tradition, as it is explained in  your average protestant declaration... lets say something like the Westminster Declaration of faith? If it is just because is Catholic, you might want to pick any average history book and see that the Catholic magisterium comes from  apostolic times and not just since the year 1500.
ronnok20 said:
  1. The belief that Mary is a co-redemptrix with Christ.
Click to expand...
Code: 
Perhaps you do not know this but... a quick look at the  Catechism of the Catholic Church will show you that this is NOT a catholic dogma, so no problem there.
ronnok20 said:
  1. The unwillingness of the RC to acknowledge that God is wholly in other churches besides the RC.
Click to expand...
Again a quick look ate the Catechism, Paragraph 838:

“The Church knows that she is joined in many ways to the baptized who are honored by the name of Christian, but do not profess the Catholic faith in its entirety or have not preserved unity or communion under the successor of Peter.” Those “who believe in Christ and have been properly baptized are put in a certain, although imperfect, communion with the Catholic Church.” With the Orthodox Churches, this communion is so profound “that it lacks little to attain the fullness that would permit a common celebration of the Lord’s Eucharist.”

Notice that it talks about the Communion with the Catholic Church not the presence of God in these Churches.

So I guess you are ready for RCIA 👍

Your parish or mine? 😃

In His love

A Catholic Deacon
 
lak611 said:
Ok. I was not sure if he was agnostic or atheist, but I knew he was not polytheist.
Click to expand...
Yep. I’m a strong agnostic specifically – I believe humans cannot know whether or not there is such a thing as a deity (barring personal revelation, but that doesn’t do the rest of us any good).

There isn’t much of a difference between strong agnosticism and so-called ‘weak’ atheism.
 
Mannyfit75 said:
There is only One God. The Catholic Church cannot change that due to fact that there are no other gods.

The CC affirms that God is Trinity, Three Persons but One God. All other false gods are just demons the servant of the devil.
Click to expand...
I don’t believe it is wise to dismiss all non-Christian religions as demon-inspired. I’ve studied the world’s religions and to me there is absolutely no evidence any have a ‘satanic’ origin, though I don’t believe any are as beautiful as Christianity is in their conceptions of God/the Absolute. We need a better intellectual response in a global world than wholesale dismissal of non-Christian philosophies and religions (this is something which has caused me the most problems in my faith, when Christians/Catholics arrogantly pronounce only they have access to God and no-one else does).
 
Greg27 said:
I don’t believe it is wise to dismiss all non-Christian religions as demon-inspired. I’ve studied the world’s religions and to me there is absolutely no evidence any have a ‘satanic’ origin, though I don’t believe any are as beautiful as Christianity is in their conceptions of God/the Absolute. We need a better intellectual response in a global world than wholesale dismissal of non-Christian philosophies and religions (this is something which has caused me the most problems in my faith, when Christians/Catholics arrogantly pronounce only they have access to God and no-one else does).
Click to expand...
Well said, Greg… I agree…

This reminds me of St. Paul’s visit to Athens. He
planned to speak at the open air venue where the
philosphers of Greece discussed things philospophical… kind of like our present day
radio talk shows…!

In preparation for his address Paul familiarized
himself with the town, the people and their beliefs.

When he finally did speak he addressed the people
with a respectful deference and noted their
religious inclinations… He said something like
this… “I see that you are a religious people with
altars to your many gods. I see that you also have
an altar to the unknown God. I have come to
introduce you to Him today.”

Several prominent Greeks became believers that
day…

Paul had become quite the fisherman… the
apostle to the Gentiles!

bro jack 👍
 
Hey, I have three real good reasons why I wouldn’t go back to the Catholic Church. Here they are:
  1. Catholics don’t believe in the Book of Mormon.
  2. I don’t believe in the Apostolic Succession. The Apostles were slain just like all the prophets before them and when the local bishops took over, there was no carrying on of their priestly authority.
  3. If the Catholic church believes in the gifts of the spirit, they’ve done everything they possibly can to not show it. Catholic prayers are more like chants, there’s no attempt to communicate with God and no expectation of getting an answer.
 
rmcmullan said:
Hey, I have three real good reasons why I wouldn’t go back to the Catholic Church. Here they are:
  1. Catholics don’t believe in the Book of Mormon.
  2. I don’t believe in the Apostolic Succession. The Apostles were slain just like all the prophets before them and when the local bishops took over, there was no carrying on of their priestly authority.
  3. If the Catholic church believes in the gifts of the spirit, they’ve done everything they possibly can to not show it. Catholic prayers are more like chants, there’s no attempt to communicate with God and no expectation of getting an answer.
Click to expand...
1.Anachronistic Concepts

On a number of occasions, the Book of Mormon introduces concepts that are historically out of time. These concepts were either introduced in the New Testament, or after the Jews were deported to Babylon, and thus after the Lehites left Jerusalem. This is significant because it supports the theory that the Book of Mormon originated in the nineteenth century. Obviously, these concepts were unknown to the early Jews, but they would have been familiar to Joseph Smith.
The Messiah
Universal Depravity
Baptism
The Gospel
The Virgin Birth
Demons and Possession
Crucifixion
Satan
The Church
Hell
The Bible

KJV Translation Errors
The Book of Mormon contains a large amount of material quoted from the Bible. This material is invariably quoted from the King James Version. Whenever the KJV contains a translation error, it also appears in the Book of Mormon, proving that the KJV was the source of these quotes, and not some ancient plates.

New Testament Paraphrases
The New Testament contains a large number of quotes from the Old Testament. These quotes sometime differ from the source material, either becuase the New Testament author paraphrased the section to make a point, or because the quote came from the Septuagint, or one of the other ancient versions. On occasion, the Book of Mormon quotes and Old Testament passage using a New Testament paraphrase. This is significant, because it indicates that the author of the Book of Mormon had access to the New Testament.
John 12:40
Matthew 3:3
Acts 2:19
Acts 3:22,23
Isaiah 65:2
Romans 14:11
II Corinthians 6:17
Hebrews 7:1-3
Romans 12:19

Anachronisic Quotes
The Book of Mormon quotes a fairly large amount of material from the King James Version. In very many cases, these quotes appear long before the Bible passage itself was actually written. The obvious answer to this problem is that the Book of Mormon was written after the passage that it quotes.

Included in this topic should be New Testament quotes. Unfortunately, there are far too many to list here. The New Testament quotes are categorised, cross-referenced and listed here.

Occasionally, the Book of Mormon even quotes sections of the Bible that are now known to be forgeries - later interpolations into the biblical text. Thus, not only does the Book of Mormon quote Biblical passages before they were written - it also sometimes manages to quote passages that were never a part of the original manuscripts, but were added to the text at a later date.
Isaiah 40-66
Malachi
Mark 16:9-20
I John 5:7
2think.org/hundredsheep/annotated/topics.shtml

2.The Wesleys Wesley’s thought was based on an Arminian interpretation of the Thirty-nine Articles of the Church of England but emphasized personal experience of conversion, assurance, and sanctification.
Wesley discarded many tenets of the Church of England, including the doctrine of the apostolic succession (the maintenance of an unbroken line of succession of bishops of the Christian church beginning with St. Peter),
island-of-freedom.com/WESLEY.HTM
  1. If the Catholic church believes in the gifts of the spirit
    Circle of Prayer - Famous Catholic Mystics
    circleofprayer.com/mystics.html -
 
Mannyfit75 said:
He is ignorant. He made an outrages claim that the Catholic Church “unwillingness of the RC to acknowledge that God is wholly in other churches besides the RC”

Don’t tell me if his information is accurate. The Catholic Church recognizes the sacraments of the E.Orthodox Churches, and recognizes the baptism of the Protestant Churches and consider them as separated brothers and sisters in Church.

His idea is that the CC doesn’t… He doesn’t know any better so he is ignorant. Ignorant means lacking in knowledge or training; unlearned.

He is unlearned and therefore ignorant.
Click to expand...
This kind of thing is despicable, plain and simple. I simply asked a question of the non-Catholics in this forum and all I see is this kind of rhetoric. This confirms my point with many Catholics that it is only their opinion that counts and nobody elses. Mr. Manny, maybe you will find that it is your sacrements that are invalid and those of the Reformation that have been restored to sanctity.
 
ronnok20 said:
This kind of thing is despicable, plain and simple. I simply asked a question of the non-Catholics in this forum and all I see is this kind of rhetoric. This confirms my point with many Catholics that it is only their opinion that counts and nobody elses. Mr. Manny, maybe you will find that it is your sacrements that are invalid and those of the Reformation that have been restored to sanctity.
Click to expand...
Dont let The reformers hear you say that

Theodore of Beza wrote: “What crime can be greater or more heinous than heresy, which sets at nought the word of God and all ecclesiastic discipline? Christian magistrates, do your duty to God [speaking in Calvin’s Geneva of 1554], who has put the sword into your hands for the honor of His majesty; strike valiantly these monsters in the guise of men.” He went on to characterize those who demanded freedom of conscience “worse than the tyranny of the pope. It is better to have a tyrant, no matter how cruel he may be, than to let everyone do as he pleases.”

Calvin sought to persecute heretics (particularly Roman Catholics) so as to keep Protestant believers in the lands divided by the Reformation faithful to his new teachings. He viciously persecuted the Spaniard, Michael Servetus, having him burnt alive on October 27, 1553. As early as 1545, Calvin had written, “If he [Servetus] comes to Geneva, I will never allow him to depart alive.” He kept his promise.
Martin Luther also fanned the flames of intolerance, “Whoever teaches otherwise than I teach, condemns God, and must remain a child of hell.”
biblia.com/christianity/inquisition.htm

The Lutherans proclaimed in full synod:
“The Zwinglians . . . we do not even grant to them a place in the church, far from recognizing as brethren, a set of people, whom we see agitated by the spirit of lying, and uttering blasphemies against the Son of Man.” (113;v.1:466)
The Zwinglians believed that the Eucharist was wholly symbolic (probably the majority position of Protestants today). Hence, whoever believes the same would have had the foregoing said about them by Dr. Luther, who firmly held to Consubstantiation, i.e., the actual Body and Blood of Christ is present in the communion along with the bread and wine.
  1. Luther on Protestant “Heretics”
    “Heresiarchs . . . remain obdurate in their own conceit. They allow none to find fault with them and brook no opposition. This is the sin against the Holy Ghost for which there is no forgiveness.” (51;v.6:282/24) “Those are heretics and apostates who follow their own ideas rather than the common tradition of Christendom, who . . . out of pure wantonness, invent new ways and methods.” (51;v.6:282-3/25)
    Grisar adds:
    “In his frame of mind it became at last an impossibility for him to realise that his hostility and intolerance towards `heretics’ within his fold could redound on himself.” (51;v.6:283) “We must needs decry the fanatics as damned . . . They actually dare to pick holes in our doctrine; ah, the scoundrelly rabble do a great injury to our Evangel.” (51; v.6:289/26) “I am on the heels of the Sacramentaries (27) and the Anabaptists; . . . I shall challenge them to fight; and I shall trample them all underfoot.” (46:86)
    catholicapologetics.info/apologetics/protestantism/protin.htm
 
Allweather said:
Ronnok20, you were never a Catholic, so stop posing as one. Your posts reveal you to be completely ignorant of Catholic beliefs. If you’d ever truly been a Catholic, you would never post such questions as these. You’re easy to figure out, fundamentalist friend.
Click to expand...
If you would ever stop your arrogant process of so called faith, you would realize that there are more opinions of what the truth is and what is believed and what is not to be believed among the mere folks sitting in the pew next to you versus the Protestants that you accuse of differing on everything amongst themselves. I am not going to get into a war of wits with you over knowledge of the Catholic faith. Let’s just suffice it to say that I know far more about it than you are giving me credit for (that is not such a bad thing either).
 
ronnok20 said:
If you would ever stop your arrogant process of so called faith, you would realize that there are more opinions of what the truth is and what is believed and what is not to be believed among the mere folks sitting in the pew next to you versus the Protestants that you accuse of differing on everything amongst themselves. I am not going to get into a war of wits with you over knowledge of the Catholic faith. Let’s just suffice it to say that I know far more about it than you are giving me credit for (that is not such a bad thing either).
Click to expand...
So you are just hear to tell us what? - You think you may know something?
 
dosdog said:
So you are just hear to tell us what? - You think you may know something?
Click to expand...
I find your disposition to be not only annoying but also very unchristianlike. I don’t appreciate it an ounce.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top