30 Seconds - "Call no man father..."

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If you’re on an elevator with a protestant who cites this bible quotation, how do you refute him/her by the time you get to the lobby floor?

Your response - including specific biblical citations, if necessary, must be readable within 30 seconds.

HW
 
Philemon 10: “whos father I became in my imprisonment.”

Acts 7:2, Stephen calls the Jewish leaders “fathers.”

Romans 4:16-17, Abraham called “father of us all.”

1 Corinthians 4:14-15 " I became your father in Christ through the Gosel."

By the way the same verse that says call no man father also says call no man teacher. Why don’t our friends ever harp on that part of the verse? Things that make you go hmmmmm?.
 
Since the apostles called themselves and other men ‘father’ in Acts 7:2, Acts 22:1; 1 Corinthians 4:15, Philemon 1:10, and 2 Peter 3:4, Jesus’ prohibition against calling men ‘father’ in Matthew 23:9 must have been an exaggeration and not meant to be taken literally, like when Jesus said in Luke 14:26, “If any one comes to me and does not hate his own father and mother and wife and children and brothers and sisters, yes, and even his own life, he cannot be my disciple.”
 
its not going to help merely pointing out the seemingly contradictory bible verses in this field, you have to provide brief explanation as well. in the original language the word for father used in the case of “call no man Father” is actually the word ABBA. this word means more than father in the sense that we know it today, it more accurately translates to something like “Divine Father.”

The problem is, where in the original language there are multiple words for father, in english there is only one word for it… this verse is victim to a biblical translational difficulty, where one language is not up to par with personal exegisis of certain scriptures, which is why we must defer to the church.
 
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hwinston:
If you’re on an elevator with a protestant who cites this bible quotation, how do you refute him/her by the time you get to the lobby floor?

Your response - including specific biblical citations, if necessary, must be readable within 30 seconds.

HW
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Callno one techer, do not call dad father, since it does say no one there can be no exceptions.
 
First of all ask the Protestant what he/she calls the man that married his/her mother.

Philem 10
1 Jn. 2:13-14
1 Thess 2:1 l
Lk 14:26
Heb 12:7-9
Tit 1:4
1 Tim 1:2
 
There is another explanation for Matt. 23:9 that was presented by Fr. Mitch Pacwa. He pointed out that there were many Jewish sects during the time of Jesus such as the Pharisees, Saducees, Essenes, etc. Apparently, there was some connection with the establishment of these sects and the term “father” that had some significance that Jesus wished to root out. It is for this reason that the other scriptural uses as quoted in previous posts are in no way contradictory to Matt. 23:9. I wish I could recall everything that Fr. Pacwa said on this point, but sadly my memory is not serving me well on this one. It may be worth researching this in order to get a better understanding of the intent of Matt. 23:9.

Perhaps someone else on the boards will give a fuller explanation on this point.
 
What is the title of your male parent?

I wish i could remember, actually. i picked up this tid bit of information from when i was a child forced to go with my mom to a protestant fundy church… the only useful thing i learned there, really.

i only remember that abba, the term used in that particular verse, has quite a different meaning from the simple word “father” that we use today. you’ll have to look up the translation on your own for that one. sorry.
 
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Trad_Catholic:
What is the title of your male parent?
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Say this and ask him/her if their male parent falls under the category “no man on earth.” Tell them Jesus sometimes spoke in exxagerations and he/she should read the story in context.
 
I once asked an aquaintence whose male parent was sick, “How’s your father?” The response was “He’s not my father, he’s my daddy.” I thought it was a very strange thing to say, didn’t understand why she would say that, and never brought it up to her. It was 20 years later when I realized what her statement meant.
 
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promethius:
its not going to help merely pointing out the seemingly contradictory bible verses in this field, you have to provide brief explanation as well. in the original language the word for father used in the case of “call no man Father” is actually the word ABBA. this word means more than father in the sense that we know it today, it more accurately translates to something like “Divine Father.”
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I thought ABBA was actually father in the very, very personal sense of being a “daddy” … never heard that it was more directly translatable as our divine father. Christ was saying that God was indeed his Father and our Father in a very personal way. And further I thought papa and pope are very equivilent in nature to abba.

Just I think this is wrong - Abba doesn’t mean divine father but actually means daddy, and if that apologetic was used on a person knowing it is wrong - or easily can ask a protestant pastor or friend- that it would hurt more than help.
 
– Transliterated, Unaccented
Matthew 23:9 Kai Patera me kalesete humonepi tes ges, heis gar estin humon ho Pater hoouranios.

P.S. on above conversation on Abba as divine father or not. The verse in question uses Pater (Father) anyhow. Abba, isn’t used in the case of “call no man father”
 
The protestant argument has evolved:

Recognizing that there are passages in Scripture where various people are called “father”, the interpretation of that passage is instead:

Call no man father. . . that is, do not address anyone as “father”: “Oh, Father, I wanted to tell you. . .” This verse is prohibiting the use of the word “father” as a name or form of address rather than a way of describing a particular relationship.

That is the way that some protestants will present the argument in order to deal with the citation of verses from other passages in the NT.
 
Call no man “father,” including your dad. In a few centuries the word will only be used when referring to God–but nobody will know what it means because the analogy will have been lost.
 
Paul W:
Call no man “father,” including your dad. In a few centuries the word will only be used when referring to God–but nobody will know what it means because the analogy will have been lost.
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Many protestants who use this argument do not object to the use of “father” when describing your male parent’s relationship to you. They object to the second person address using “father”.
 
30 seconds? I’d say, “Our Lord also said to call no man ‘teacher’***. Yet you have no problems addressing college faculty as ‘doctor’ or ‘professor’, both of which literally mean teacher. Well, however you already justify that to yourself, just apply the same reasoning to Catholic priests.”

*** Some translations have “master” instead of teacher but that’s only because hundreds of years master in English meant teacher, e.g., a Master degree. The original is literally “teacher.”
 
In 30 seconds I’d remind them that the Scripture was referring to “the” Father, God, not a man, we aren’t to refer to any man as God. We also shouldn’t call anyone “good” or “teacher”. He wasn’t giving us a grammar lesson. Then, I’d ask them to please stop taking Scripture out of context. Twisting Scripture for your own purposes is a sin. The rest of the 30 seconds, enjoy the elevator music.
 
Jesus’ words to call no man your father echoes the words of John the Baptizer in Mt 3:9 when John says to the Pharisees and the Sadducees “…bear fruit that befits repentance, and do not presume to say ‘we have Abraham as our father’; for I tell you God is able from these stones to raise up children to Abraham.” Jesus and John are reprimanding the Pharisees (and the scribes and Sadducees) for believing they possess a special or exalted position based on their “inheritance” or lineage from Abraham and Moses.

Jesus is telling them their status or inheritance comes from God the Father, not from an earthly father such as Abraham or Moses.

Jesus hammers home this point over and over from Matthew 21:28 through the end of Matthew 23 with his parables and his admonitions of the scribes and Pharisees.
 
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