401k and a Vocation?

[Epistemes]

My mom (who is not Catholic) is pressuring me to start a 401k because “only you can help yourself these days.”

I told my family this past May that I hope to pursue a religious vocation (most likely to religious life) within a couple of years. It has be a couple of years because I have personal debt which I’m trying to reduce. I’ve been talking to the Carmelites plus the Conventual and Capuchin Franciscans.

My mom doesn’t understand a lot about it and seemingly refuses to understand what this life entails (because she can’t imagine a community that’s faithful enough to care for its members entirely).

Should I start a 401k just to give her some peace of mind? Should I do it just in case things fall through for my own sake? Or, given that my heart is pretty set on becoming a religious one day in the future, should I not set one up and simply trust in God??

 

[Catholictrain]

I strongly recommend that you start a 401K or a Roth IRA annuity. If you are a member of the Knights of Columbus (great organization) they have annuities that are offering over 3% interest right now. I think you might do well with a Roth IRA set up as an annuity in your situation, although you have to remember that the money you put in is still taxed as part of your income. With a 401K the money is taken out pre-tax, that is not counted as income until you retire and take it out. Either way, it is a prudent thing to do, even if you do join an order. I am sure if you can’t use the money later on, the order certainly could. Also, there is a misconception about religious being “taken care of”… for secular priests, a retirement fund is absolutely necessary.

 

[Friar_David_O.Carm]

I strongly recommend that you start a 401K or a Roth IRA annuity. If you are a member of the Knights of Columbus (great organization) they have annuities that are offering over 3% interest right now. I think you might do well with a Roth IRA set up as an annuity in your situation, although you have to remember that the money you put in is still taxed as part of your income. With a 401K the money is taken out pre-tax, that is not counted as income until you retire and take it out. Either way, it is a prudent thing to do, even if you do join an order. I am sure if you can’t use the money later on, the order certainly could. Also, there is a misconception about religious being “taken care of”… for secular priests, a retirement fund is absolutely necessary.

While a secular priest (that is a diocesen priest) does have to consider his retirement a religious priest, a member of a religious order, does not as we take the vow of poverty and our retirement is taken care of by our order. We can not have a 401K as we can not have personal property in that way.

If you do join an order you will be required to get rid of all personal property when you make your final vows. It does not have to be turned over to the order in most cases.

 

[Catholictrain]

While a secular priest (that is a diocesen priest) does have to consider his retirement a religious priest, a member of a religious order, does not as we take the vow of poverty and our retirement is taken care of by our order. We can not have a 401K as we can not have personal property in that way.

If you do join an order you will be required to get rid of all personal property when you make your final vows. It does not have to be turned over to the order in most cases.

Thank you for clarifying this about religious orders. I guess I should have figured that one out on my own. Yet if this person still has a few years before they join the order, if wouldn’t hurt to contribute to a 401K or IRA. Even though it does not have to be turned over to the order… I imagine they wouldn’t refuse it (except maybe the Franciscans of the Primitive Order FPOs).

 

[skallal]

You may want to check out these two organizations to help with your debts:

Laboure Society, LaboureFoundation.org;

Mater Ecclesiae Fund for Vocations,FundforVocations.org.

 

[JReducation]

If you become a Franciscan, any kind of Franciscan, you may not have any kiind of financial security, except what the community can provide.

However, you must remember, that because you have plans to become a religious, does not mean that God has the same plan. The proof of a vocation to the religious life is when the religious superior says that you have his permission to make final vows. Until then, you have a desire to respond to what you believe is a call from God. That’s a good thing. But it is up to the religious community where you have a call to live their life.

I would advise you to start your retirement plan. If you become a Conventual or a Capuchin, you will be asked to withdraw the money and give it to someone outside the community. Franciscans are not allowed to take any money from those entering the order. It is part of the “Privilege of Poverty”, a decree that was made by Pope Alexander IV to the Franciscans.

But do go ahead and start your fund. You will not know what Christ wants until the religious community tells you.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF

 

[Chant]

Hi Epistemes,

I think you’ve received some good thoughts for consideration already. I’ll provide a couple more:

1. From a financial perspective, depending on how much your personal debt is, it would be prudent to focus on getting that debt paid down. This, in my opinion, would be wise for your own financial well-being (regardless of what the future holds). Also, most religious orders will not consider you if you have outstanding financial obligations.
2. Once your debt is settled, you might consider the welfare any family members or the order to which you aspire. In these cases, it might be worthwhile to begin a retirement plan (410K, IRA) which would continue to be in place should your discernment lead you to another vocation.

Most of all, God Bless you as you discern. Handle your finances to the best of your ability. Listen with your heart, and know that many of ‘unseen folks’ on this message board will be praying for you.

 

[Frank_GF]

Dear friend:
When

 

[wanabsaint]

If you believe that you have a vocation to a community order (and it sounds as thought you may) I would consider only obeying the 4th commandment. Honor your mother in some way and she will understand, perhaps not today but someday. I say this because I am a mother and I understand a lot more now than I did when my sons were younger.
Money is not important in this life or Christ would not have sent his disciples out without any. God bless you on your journey.

 

[DebChris]

As already mentioned, your financial priority is eliminating personal debt.
At the same time, start a 401K at the level that your employer will match. You can name your mother as beneficiary. This would come under prudent financial advice to pay yourself first (after the tithe, of course).
Although there will be an interest penalty, you can also cash it out once your employment ends.
Check with your HR person or another financial adviser to learn if there are other options, such as transferring the value of your 401K to care for your mother when you “retire” from the world.

 

[Frank_GF]

Dear friend:
Your mother, as a good mother wants the best for you, thats the reason of her preocupation. The vocation a you know is a call from God, and the ones that are called to follow him, should trust in him totally. God will take care of any that He calls. See the life of John Paul II for exemple. When your mother will see you as faithful religious, and a happy religious, she will be happy also even if you mother is not a catholic.
So trust in God and work hard in order to pay your debt, and if you think that your mother will be more in pace if you have the 401k plan go ahed, but remember that as soon as you strat to follow Christ steeps, you need to see him and follow.
I will pray for you and you mother.
Good Bleess you Frank FG
(I apologize if my english is not very correct but I am not native english speaking)

 

[Dale_M]

You may want to check out these two organizations to help with your debts:

Laboure Society, LaboureFoundation.org;

Mater Ecclesiae Fund for Vocations,FundforVocations.org.

These are valuable resources, and your mention of them is helpful. But they are limited in what they do - in one case due to lack of funds, and in the other case by not providing funds directly but acting as a clearinghouse for funds raised by the individual who is pursuing a vocation.
Mater Ecclesiae Fund:

We have had to turn away 31 young people who wanted to offer their lives to Christ, but could not because of their student debt. Will the Church lose these vocations?

We are helping 46 men and women follow their vocations, and each year we must raise the money necessary to make their student loan payments. These men and women are learning to become preists, monks and brothers, and nuns and sisters and pray each day for you, for the Church and for the world.

Please help us help them by making a tax-deductible contribution.

fundforvocations.org./
Laboure Society:

Individuals who contact the Society for assistance receive both affirmation and encouragement; then, each is ‘qualified’ through an intake process that requires ‘corroboration’ from a vocation or spiritual director and asked to write a ‘vocation story’ narrative describing his or her vocation journey. Laurent then teaches each a favorite daily prayer: “Lord, I must do what I can; that, plus what you will do, is enough.” He instructs them on how to distribute the ‘vocation story’ to family, friends, friendly groups and organizations soliciting prayer and financial support. Laurent explains: “there are a number of individuals out there too numerous to count, that are ready, willing and able to assist, but they just don’t know about you yet.” The Society acknowledges funds received for the benefactor’s tax file and administers the funds; when accumulated funds are sufficient, the Society pays off the debt directly on behalf of the aspirant.

labourefoundation.org/contact.html