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pocohombre
Guest
And just where did the term "protestant " come from ?
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Darryl_B
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Present.
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Darryl_B
Guest
So if you were to come to my country could you attend a Lutheran church without conflict of conscience? Do the 5000 Lutherans in my country (who are generally not of German descent) have any affliliation to the Missouri Synod? ie would acceptance be reciprocated if at all?
When you say most Catholic, what percentage Catholic are you? 50% 80% 95%? I realize it is hard to quantify something comparative, but your general feeling will give me some means of understanding the perceived relative distance. I have never met a Lutheran so I don’t know much about them.
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MaryT777
Guest
LOL…great start…Hmmm…
Ben, Jon and Don walk into a bar…
Yes!
Instead of Happy Hour, they’d call it The Lutheran Hour.Hmmm…
Ben, Jon and Don walk into a bar…
Yes!
Wait! That name’s taken.
Jon
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steido01
Guest
Instead of Happy Hour, they’d call it The Lutheran Hour.
Wait! That name’s taken.
Jon
We could drink beer and talk about Issues, etc. 
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steido01
Guest
Absolutely. The Lutheran Church of New Zealand was also founded by Old Lutherans, if my history is correct (other than the US, Australia and NZ were popular destinations for us as we ran from the Unionized Reformed). The Church of New Zealand is part of the Lutheran Church of Australia. The LCA has a very close relationship with the LCMS and particularly the Lutheran Church-Canada (the now-autonomous branch of the LCMS in that country). Lutherans are still united; our churches take on different names in different countries more for tax reasons than anything (technically, the Roman Catholic Church is also, legally, many bodies). That foolish list that floats around CAF with “hundreds” of Lutheran bodies is sorely misleading.
As you say, this is difficult to quantify; I’m sure I’ll offend someone if I try. It may be best for you to decide yourself. Take a read of the Augsburg Confession and the Roman Catholic Confutation to the Augsburg Confession. Hope that helps!
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steve_b
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GKC
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Of course they do. Else these criteria would not have been set up. The criteria you listed (assuming that they are established in good faith, and I do) say nothing about wanting to, or planning to, or actually entering into the RCC. It sets out the criteria for those not in the the RCC to receive the sacrament.
The likelihood of any given supplicant being administered the sacrament would vary with the individual case, but if one of the criteria is that all supplicants must intend, or have been intending, to become RC, such a statement is lacking from what was stated.
GKC
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steve_b
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Eastern Catholic priests can marry. So the CC already has a long tradition & understanding of both a celebate priesthood and a married priesthood.
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steido01
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Every Sunday, I confess that I am part of the One, Holy, catholic and Apostolic Church. What’s screwy about that?A catholic protestant.Language is getting screwier and screwier as time goes on.
The word “catholic” does not belong solely to the church in Rome.
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EvangelCatholic
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Yes, language can be confusing. For example, all Lutherans call themselves ‘evangelical’ yet have very little in common with a group of Protestants who use that terminology as well. Lutherans are part of the Western Church that is centered in Rome; like Orthodox and Anglicans who do not accept papal infallibility, we nonetheless, consider ourselves ‘catholic.’
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GKC
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batman1973
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Same here. In fact, I have just committed the Apostle’s Creed to memory. I use the term “I believe in the Holy Spirit, the Holy cathlolic Church…” My pastor did not correct me on that.Every Sunday, I confess that I am part of the One, Holy, catholic and Apostolic Church. What’s screwy about that?
In fact, my understanding is that the Lutheran faith is the REFORMED Holy Catholic and Apostolic Church. So, yes. I’m Catholic, and proud (but not too proud
) of it.
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steve_b
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Not in so many words but we’re also talking about extraordinary circumstances. The 1st being proximity of death. Not much chance of a crash course in Catholicism there.
As an aside, That link can’t go against canon law.
The canons are specific (all emphasis mine)
Can. 844
§1. Catholic ministers administer the sacraments licitly to Catholic members of the Christian faithful alone, who likewise receive them licitly from Catholic ministers alone, without prejudice to the prescripts of §2, 3, and 4 of this canon
§2. Whenever necessity requires it or true spiritual advantage suggests it, and provided that danger of error or of indifferentism is avoided, the Christian faithful for whom it is physically or morally impossible to approach a Catholic minister are permitted to receive the sacraments of penance, Eucharist, and anointing of the sick from non-Catholic ministers in whose Churches these sacraments are valid. (Refers to E Orthodox. and eliminates all protestant groups from consideration regardless of stripe)
§3. Catholic ministers administer the sacraments of penance, Eucharist, and anointing of the sick licitly to members of Eastern Churches which do not have full communion with the Catholic Church if they seek such on their own accord and are properly disposed. This is also valid for members of other Churches which in the judgment of the Apostolic See are in the same condition in regard to the sacraments as these Eastern Churches. (i.e. valid sacraments. eliminates Protestant groups regardless of stripe)
§4. If the danger of death is present or if, in the judgment of the diocesan bishop or conference of bishops, some other grave necessity urges it, Catholic ministers administer these same sacraments licitly also to other Christians not having full communion with the Catholic Church, who cannot approach a minister of their own community and who seek such on their own accord, provided that they manifest Catholic faith in respect to these sacraments and are properly disposed.
Re: §4 talks about that extraordinary circumstance. Danger of death provided they manifest the Catholic faith with the sacraments and are properly disposed.
So what’s that mean? For me a Catholic what does Catholic faith and proper disposition require for me receiving the sacraments?
As a Catholic I must hold to the Catholic faith…all of it, or I’m not in union with the Church. That’s dangerous for me and my soul. And then I can’t be guilty of any mortal sin. Also hugely dangerous. If I’m guilty of any ot them I need to go to confession 1st, before receiving the Eucharist.
As the canons show even when we’re talking extraordinary circumstances, that’s meant for a Protestant appealing to the extraordinary circumstance. Things in conversation get rather screwie when for example, a Protestant who asks for the Eucharist when most or all don’t even believe in mortal sin, and are possibly up to their eyeballs in mortal sin.
Maybe this will help make my point clearer. Even If a baptised protestant is in RCIA, this indicates their belief and disposition is already to be Catholic, yet even with this belief and disposition, they are not invited **yet **to receive the Eucharist **until **they have been brought fully into the Church.
Now consider a protestant who has no intention of being Catholic. Should he be invited to receive the Eucharist in the CC? The answer is they aren’t.
Enter the extraordianry circumstance. Dieing or possibly in danger of death.
Can you and I point to examples of illicit behavior in this? Sure. But just being transparent, no one gets away with that illicit stuff anyway…right? We all have to be aware of eternal consequences to our souls for our belief and behavior.
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Randy_Carson
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Unfortunately, this was a mistake on the part of the priest or usher who gave you bad advice.
Lutherans are NOT permitted to receive the Eucharist consecrated by a Catholic priest except under extraordinary circumstances (think near death here).
I suspect that none of the occasions you describe were extraordinary.
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