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dab1714
Guest
My fiance and I would like to be married in the Catholic church but not be married legally. We both feel as though we only need God to recognize our marriage at this time. Does anyone know if this is possible?
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FuzzyBunny116
Guest
Contact a priest. They know the most about marriages.
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severinus
Guest
When we were married, the priest required our marriage license before the nuptial Mass. He then verified that the marriage took place and sent the form back to the county office.
I think that’s pretty much the same in the rest of the US; a priest requires that the parties to the marriage conform with state law. Any marriage thus performed is legally binding.
There are provisions (Canons 1130 ff.) for ‘secret marriage,’ but there must be grave reasons for such a thing.
Talk to your priest about it.
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Deacon_Ed
Guest
There is a technical possiblity called a “secret marriage” (Canon 1130) – but the probability of this happening is slim and none in most of the civilized countries of the world.
Since marriage is, per se, a public event I can’t imagine why you would not want to be legally married.
Deacon Ed
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dab1714
Guest
Thank you so much. I will make an appointment with my Parish Priest to discuss.
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Br.Rich_SFO
Guest
In order for a Marriage to be valid in the Church it must also be legal according to the civil law. In order to be married in the Church you must produce a valid civil Marriage license. The “Secret Marriage” is from medieval times.
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cameron_lansing
Guest
Br. Rich SFO:
In this case we don’t know whether a) the couple cannot marry civilly, or b) the couple has a reason they do not wish to marry civilly. But dab1714 should not be discouraged from consulting the parish priest.
However bypassing the civil law is a most serious thing. The Church normally expects marriage to conform to just civil law for the protection of the parties and their children. Christians are to be good citizens, obedient to legitimate civil authority.
To the contrary, the code considers the possibility of a marriage that would be canonically valid yet which cannot be recognized or celebrated according to civil provisions. It would be unlawful for the assisting priest or deacon to witness such a marriage without permission, apart from a case of necessity, but permission can be given by the local ordinary.
Canon 1071: “§1. Except in a case of necessity, a person is not to assist without the permission of the local ordinary at: . . . 2º a marriage which cannot be recognized or celebrated according to the norm of civil law . . .” This is for lawfulness and not validity. (Canon 1071 cannot be considered an invaliding law according to canon 10.)
But that pertains to the local ordinary whom the priest must consult. Since legal ramifications could fall on the diocese for such an action, that ordinary should be the diocesan bishop.
I’m sorry, but I cannot see a legal citation or a basis for the assertion in this circumstance that “In order for a Marriage to be valid in the Church it must also be legal according to the civil law.”
In this case we don’t know whether a) the couple cannot marry civilly, or b) the couple has a reason they do not wish to marry civilly. But dab1714 should not be discouraged from consulting the parish priest.
However bypassing the civil law is a most serious thing. The Church normally expects marriage to conform to just civil law for the protection of the parties and their children. Christians are to be good citizens, obedient to legitimate civil authority.
- Regarding a marriage contrary to civil law
To the contrary, the code considers the possibility of a marriage that would be canonically valid yet which cannot be recognized or celebrated according to civil provisions. It would be unlawful for the assisting priest or deacon to witness such a marriage without permission, apart from a case of necessity, but permission can be given by the local ordinary.
Canon 1071: “§1. Except in a case of necessity, a person is not to assist without the permission of the local ordinary at: . . . 2º a marriage which cannot be recognized or celebrated according to the norm of civil law . . .” This is for lawfulness and not validity. (Canon 1071 cannot be considered an invaliding law according to canon 10.)
- Regarding a “marriage celebrated secretly”
- Who makes these decisions?
But that pertains to the local ordinary whom the priest must consult. Since legal ramifications could fall on the diocese for such an action, that ordinary should be the diocesan bishop.
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dab1714
Guest
Thank you so much for your most thoughtful response. I have definitely been educated. I will make an appointment with the Msgr. in my Parish and will let you know the outcome.
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plato3
Guest
It’s refreshing to hear about someone actually wanting to be married in the Church. So many couples today ignore the comittment of the marriage covenant.
plato3
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Br.Rich_SFO
Guest
I stand corrected.
Can. 1071~1 Except in a case of necessity, no one is to assist without the permission of the local Ordinary at:
2° a marriage which cannot be recognised by the civil law or celebrated in accordance with it;
All priests that I have known have always said that they cannot “perform a Marriage” unless the couple produces a valid Marriage license. I guess that all were wrong to assert this.
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Deacon_Ed
Guest
Br. Rich SFO:
The priests are simply stating what is correct 99.994% of the time.
Deacon Ed
Not really. They are following the direction of their bishop. I will tell someone who comes to me and asks to be married but doesn’t have a marriage license to go get one. The problem is this: even though we are clergy we also act as agents of the state in matters of marriage. If I perform a marriage without a license I can lose my authority from the state to do marriages! While this is not likely to happen from a secret marriage, I cannot, of my own accord, perform a secret marriage. That must come from the bishop.
The priests are simply stating what is correct 99.994% of the time.
Deacon Ed
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cameron_lansing
Guest
Br. Rich SFO:
I do imagine most dioceses would require a priest or deacon to have a valid marriage license from the state in hand before proceeding. It would be a rare case when a priest or deacon would stop and reflect about the vagueries of the law. Hence, it would be easy to form such an opinion.
For the casual reader, I should state that Brother Rich is virtually always correct and certainly insightful. Only a very rare exception is presented here in which he had reasonably relied on experience from others who were wrong. In this case, all of us can learn from his willingess to reconsider a point.
I do imagine most dioceses would require a priest or deacon to have a valid marriage license from the state in hand before proceeding. It would be a rare case when a priest or deacon would stop and reflect about the vagueries of the law. Hence, it would be easy to form such an opinion.
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cameron_lansing
Guest
I hasten to add, wrong in terms of the technical point raised. They were not wrong to ask for the license by any means, and would have been remiss not to…
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