A Catholic response to Catholic Answers

[thomfra]

An interesting Article. Especially a bit about Ratzinger and “proportionate reasons” for supporting candidates who happen to be pro-choice.

findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m1141/is_3_41/ai_n9522568/pg_1

 

[Newbie2]

Yes, interesting. I have to think about that a while to see whether I agree or disagree with his premise. (the author, not Benedict)

 

[MarcellusW]

I think this is another misinformed Catholic writing the OP article. It is not just Karl Keating talking about the non-negotiables, it is the U.S. Bishops. If he only turned on EWTN during their interviews he might know this.

Lest the op-ed forget, it was John Paul II who said that Abortion is the greatest evil of our time.

 

[Alethiaphile]

Lest the op-ed forget, it was John Paul II who said that Abortion is the greatest evil of our time.

Abortion is a symptom of societal evil. We could outlaw all abortions tomorrow, to little effect. We need to attack the cause, not the symptom.

 

[kage_ar]

Abortion is a symptom of societal evil. We could outlaw all abortions tomorrow, to little effect. We need to attack the cause, not the symptom.

The vast majority of people are law abiding. Look up the statistics how abortions rose in the US when it became legal.

Doctors, in general, want to keep a license and stay out of jail, when abortion is outlawed - only outlaws will preform abortions.

 

[blessedtoo]

There a dozens of threads discussing abortion. Let’s not derail this one too.

I think the author has a point - to a point. Contrary to what many folks here may believe, the actual living breathing Church, the Body of Christ, is not all that interested or impressed with Catholic Answers. A few years back, I won a “gift” from our local Catholic Radio Station. I could donate a fairly well known Catholic apologist to speak at the Parish of my choice at no charge. The Pastor I offered this gift to was not interested. He felt that Catholic Answers was not a good representation of the Church.

In my Parish filled with faithful and devoted Catholics, not one has even heard of Catholic Answers. When informed, they show little interest. Many folks are too busy to spend (or in some cases, waste) time bickering online with strangers. And there really is no doubt in my mind that sometimes they can give the impression of extremism.

From the article:

Those are “five ‘nonnegotiable’ issues that all Catholics need to understand and to vote against if we are to keep America from collapsing.”

If this is the way such appeals are being presented, then I am not surprised the author responded as he did. “The sky is falling” approach is rarely effective.

Having said that, I do think this organization provides a service to those who are seeking answers about the Church. It provides a sense of community for many who are struggling to find a place in an often unfriendly world. I would have hoped that the author would have spent some time on the forums before passing judgment as he did. There is quite a bit of diversity on these forums and I think many would be surprised by the lively, intelligent and spirited debate.

 

[thomfra]

There a dozens of threads discussing abortion. Let’s not derail this one too.

I think the author has a point - to a point. Contrary to what many folks here may believe, the actual living breathing Church, the Body of Christ, is not all that interested or impressed with Catholic Answers. A few years back, I won a “gift” from our local Catholic Radio Station. I could donate a fairly well known Catholic apologist to speak at the Parish of my choice at no charge. The Pastor I offered this gift to was not interested. He felt that Catholic Answers was not a good representation of the Church.

In my Parish filled with faithful and devoted Catholics, not one has even heard of Catholic Answers. When informed, they show little interest. Many folks are too busy to spend (or in some cases, waste) time bickering online with strangers. And there really is no doubt in my mind that sometimes they can give the impression of extremism.

From the article:
If this is the way such appeals are being presented, then I am not surprised the author responded as he did. “The sky is falling” approach is rarely effective.

Having said that, I do think this organization provides a service to those who are seeking answers about the Church. It provides a sense of community for many who are struggling to find a place in an often unfriendly world. I would have hoped that the author would have spent some time on the forums before passing judgment as he did. There is quite a bit of diversity on these forums and I think many would be surprised by the lively, intelligent and spirited debate.

I agree, lets keep abortion to the abortion threads!

One extremely important point the author made, which I fear many who post here haven’t quiet understood, is that Catholic Answers is not in any way “endorsed” by the RCC. it is an internet forum, nothing more.

To be honest I don’t really think the majority of posters on this forum represent the average Catholic at all. My impression, is that it represents the average American, conservative, republican voting catholic. There is nothing wrong with that per se, but I wish there was more (name removed by moderator)ut from European catholics (Ireland, Germany, Poland) etc to provide more balance.

One very postive aspect of CA is that it is open to everybody, and I have certainly learned more about the catholic faith from this forum.

But perhaps the focus of the threads is not quite right. There is a little too much emphasis on “is this a sin”, and “the world is doomed”.

 

[blessedtoo]

I agree, lets keep abortion to the abortion threads!

One extremely important point the author made, which I fear many who post here haven’t quiet understood, is that Catholic Answers is not in any way “endorsed” by the RCC. it is an internet forum, nothing more.

To be honest I don’t really think the majority of posters on this forum represent the average Catholic at all. My impression, is that it represents the average American, conservative, republican voting catholic. There is nothing wrong with that per se, but I wish there was more (name removed by moderator)ut from European catholics (Ireland, Germany, Poland) etc to provide more balance.

One very postive aspect of CA is that it is open to everybody, and I have certainly learned more about the catholic faith from this forum.

But perhaps the focus of the threads is not quite right. There is a little too much emphasis on “is this a sin”, and “the world is doomed”.

You know, I just agree with everything you’ve said here.

Although I would add that the “average Catholic” is pretty hard to define at this point. I think of my parents, who are now in their 80’s, who have attended Mass every Sunday of their lives and who have followed all the teachings of the Church without ever really understanding or questioning the “why” behind it all and to me, they are a closer representation of the “average Catholic” than the folks on CAF. While they have had their doubts at times, and perhaps have even felt abandoned by God periodically, they have stayed the course.

Or there is the dear friend of mine, who has been a Catholic School Principal for the last 30 years, who witnesses to his faith in his daily life without a lot of fanfare or bluster. His commitment to his faith is evidenced by the longevity of his devotion to God and not by the kind of overwrought zealousness we find here on the forums.

I was raised in a pre-Vat II Catholic school and home, and educated by very mean nuns. The entirety of my religious education was based in fear. For me and my two sisters, it had the effect of driving us away for decades. It was only through accepting the grace of God’s mercy and love that I was able to find my way back. Fear as a way of life is not sustainable.

 

[fix]

An interesting Article. Especially a bit about Ratzinger and “proportionate reasons” for supporting candidates who happen to be pro-choice.

findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m1141/is_3_41/ai_n9522568/pg_1

The piece was from the National Catholic Reporter? Right? I find it ironic. The author criticizes Keating for things that really seem off the mark. Why not ask do we really need more dissent like that found in NCR?

Now, the voting guide issue is fair game but no one really has shown what CA has published is wrong? In fact the non negotioables listed are the ones in play in this election.

Bringing up the war and capital punisment as morally equivalent really is disingenuous.

 

[thomfra]

Bringing up the war and capital punisment as morally equivalent really is disingenuous.

how so?

 

[fix]

how so?

First, because they are not intrinsically evil acts. Secondly, Catholic consciences are not bound by the Church to oppose this war or every single case of capital punishment. We are bound to vote against legalized abortion and other things.

 

[fix]

I agree, lets keep abortion to the abortion threads!

One extremely important point the author made, which I fear many who post here haven’t quiet understood, is that Catholic Answers is not in any way “endorsed” by the RCC. it is an internet forum, nothing more.

OK, but not being endorsed does not equal wrong.

To be honest I don’t really think the majority of posters on this forum represent the average Catholic at all.

That depends. Some are and some are not.

My impression, is that it represents the average American, conservative, republican voting catholic. There is nothing wrong with that per se, but I wish there was more (name removed by moderator)ut from European catholics (Ireland, Germany, Poland) etc to provide more balance.

I agree there is a political tilt here but politics do not mean they get the faith wrong.

But perhaps the focus of the threads is not quite right. There is a little too much emphasis on “is this a sin”, and “the world is doomed”.

IMO, that is because the culture is so far tilted the opposite way. For better, or worse, we see behavior begets behavior. When the folks here see so much in society that is relativistic, hedonistic, and perverse you are going to see a culling of like minded people getting together and “reacting” to all that nonsense.

 

[blessedtoo]

IMO, that is because the culture is so far tilted the opposite way. For better, or worse, we see behavior begets behavior. When the folks here see so much in society that is relativistic, hedonistic, and perverse you are going to see a culling of like minded people getting together and “reacting” to all that nonsense.

Fix, I don’t usually disagree with you but I have to here because I have noticed that this forum does tend to lean a bit toward neurosis. I would call it scrupulosity but I don’t have that right - a priest should make that call. When I see thread after thread asking whether this or that is a sin, I can’t help but feel that there are a lot of overwrought and frightened people out there who somehow believe there is a scary old man in the sky with a score card and tally sheets. This forum feeds that kind of worry. Just look at the way Keating’s appeal was phrased:

Those are “five ‘nonnegotiable’ issues that all Catholics need to understand and to vote against if we are to keep America from collapsing.”

This tactic may appeal to those who thrive on worry, anxiety and fear but that is not the way to nourish and strengthen the faith of people who are in this for the long haul. We can easily see the effects of this approach by all the threads about despair, hopelessness and depression.

 

[fix]

Fix, I don’t usually disagree with you but I have to here because I have noticed that this forum does tend to lean a bit toward neurosis. I would call it scrupulosity but I don’t have that right - a priest should make that call. When I see thread after thread asking whether this or that is a sin, I can’t help but feel that there are a lot of overwrought and frightened people out there who somehow believe there is a scary old man in the sky with a score card and tally sheets. This forum feeds that kind of worry. Just look at the way Keating’s appeal was phrased:
This tactic may appeal to those who thrive on worry, anxiety and fear but that is not the way to nourish and strengthen the faith of people who are in this for the long haul. We can easily see the effects of this approach by all the threads about despair, hopelessness and depression.

But, of the threads you mention how many are really authentic and how many are posers looking to make Catholics look bad? I really do not know.

When I see someone asking a genuine question on moral theology I assume they are wanting to please God and not offend Him. A tender conscience seems rather rare today and I applaud it when I can.

 

[Howard_Roark]

Dog bites man. Nothing of interest. NCR columnist doesn’t like CA, is soft on abortion. None of this is the least bit surprising.

If, however, NCR came out in favor of orthodoxy in any form, now, that would be news. Wake me up if something interesting happens.

 

[Ruthie]

thomfra said,

Catholic Answers is not in any way “endorsed” by the RCC. it is an internet forum, nothing more.

Where did you get that idea? CA is much more than just these forums. Check out the top of the page.

And if you look in the Library, you will find many articles with the Nihil Obstat and the Imprimatur.

God bless us all,

Ruthie

 

[thomfra]

thomfra said,

Where did you get that idea? CA is much more than just these forums. Check out the top of the page.

And if you look in the Library, you will find many articles with the Nihil Obstat and the Imprimatur.

God bless us all,

Ruthie

OK, you can buy stuff, browse documents and go to seminars as well. Point is that people need to remember that CA is not RCC.

As for the little credit card box you see in the top right corner, and the daily letter which has started appearing in my mail box asking for money - well, lets just say that I prefer to give to catholic (and other christian) charities, or to a childrens hospital.

• This is not a dig at Catholic Answers, I think it’s a great resource, but I like to give my money (the little that I do give) to an established charity, that has a more tangeble goal than “changing the face of American politics”.

 

[Mirdath]

If this is the way such appeals are being presented, then I am not surprised the author responded as he did. “The sky is falling” approach is rarely effective.

This is basically the way every Catholic Answers mailing I have received has sounded. Doom, strife, terror – they just sell better, and while obviously an organization such as CA needs to sell it’s just as obvious that they’ve adopted an ‘ends justify the means’ approach to doing it.

Most Catholic Answers material I’ve seen that doesn’t deal with pure philosophy is transparently intended to unsettle and upset both Catholics and non-Catholics and set them at each others’ throats. Where no fear or enmity existed between parties to begin with, it tries to create it. It sets up and sets off the Catholic’s fear of the Other (the liberal, the non-theist, the feminist, the homosexual, the JW, the Mormon, the Muslim; occasionally it veers dangerously close to ‘brown people’ and ‘women’) and upsets that Other enough to give a good chance of starting a confrontation. This isn’t how the Socratic method is supposed to work. It’s not ‘insult the other guy until you start yelling at each other’.

Their mailers make the ‘emergency fundraiser gonna shut down the forum’ announcements look like a bunch of stoners sitting around saying ‘hey, dude… no biggie, not right now, but it’d be real cool if you could throw in with us on a dime in a bit’.

This mindset is not limited to Catholic Answers alone either, many of them have adopted a radically insular, confrontational, cultish, and effectively end-times millennialist+x way of thinking and ‘evangelizing’, if one can call it that – the reasonable, scholarly, educated approach that used to be the hallmark of monkish apologetics has been drowned out by wild-eyed laity with no more qualifications than what amounts to a crudely-painted ‘THE END IS NIGH’ signboard

Catholic Answers has the potential to do a great deal of good for the Church and for everybody in general. Right now, it’s squandering it on petty politicking, faith-baiting, and trying to cut the Church itself to fit Mr Keating’s ideals. It does not answer questions in favor of picking fights. I cannot honestly call it an apologetics organization at this point, and hope that it becomes what it says it’s been sooner rather than later.