A Contradiction?

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JReducation said:
The bold is mine

You lost me. How is this uncharitable? This is what St. Francis of Assisi preached and this is the rule that he wrote for his friars, to embrace Christ crucified and to preach the Gospel.

This is what Mother Teresa taught her sisters, to embrace Christ crucified and to quench his thirst, regardless of whether the person was Muslim, Hindu, Christian or Communist. These were her own words.

Do you mean to tell me that you disagree with this?

You really lost me on this one.

JR 🙂
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To feed the flesh without feeding the soul is an error. The flesh dies – the soul continues to live. We cannot feed the flesh and leave the soul in starvation of Christ. It is not about only embracing our Lord for our own — but it teaching to others the true light and freedom they gain by embracing Christ.
 
Pope Pius XI:
…nevertheless how does it happen that this charity tends to injure faith? Everyone knows that John himself, the Apostle of love, who seems to reveal in his Gospel the secrets of the Sacred Heart of Jesus, and who never ceased to impress on the memories of his followers the new commandment “Love one another,” altogether forbade any intercourse with those who professed a mutilated and corrupt version of Christ’s teaching: "If any man come to you and bring not this doctrine, receive him not into the house nor say to him: God speed you."
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JReducation,

Do you disagree with Pope Pius XI here…or St. John?

SFD
 
Walking_Home said:
To feed the flesh without feeding the soul is an error. The flesh dies – the soul continues to live. We cannot feed the flesh and leave the soul in starvation of Christ. It is not about only embracing our Lord for our own — but it teaching to others the true light and freedom they gain by embracing Christ.
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Why are we going to canonize Mother Teresa?

JR 🙂
 
Walking_Home said:
Yes – love and mercy—that is why She teaches Christ Crucified–and Her mission is to preach the gospel to ALL nations–Baptizing in the Name of the Father, the Son and of the Holy Spirit. The most uncharitable thing any Catholic can do – is not teach the Faith-- and lead those on the outside to believe Christ and His Church are not necessary.
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So far today, you claim that the Church is Truth, yet we know that Jesus is the Truth.

Now, in the same breath, you claim the Church (SHE) teaches Christ crucified. So you see them as one: Jesus/Church and as different: Jesus/She. You are very confused.

If you do not understand that Salvation History begins and comes to fruition with the promises made to the Jewish people, you need to go waaaaay back and start your studies all over again. Christ is the Head of the Church. People make up the Body of Christ, the Church. People who would judge others will be judged.

“Enter His gates with thanksgiving, His courts with praise.”

If you imagine God to be so small, so limited, that He is unable to find a means of Baptism for those who were historically the “people of God,” then I certainly can’t lead you to it - but it IS Church Teaching whether you like it or not. Grace is all around us.

Salvation comes from the Jews, from the promises made to the Jews. We are added in - how much more easily will they be able to recieve their portion, within the Church, through the mysterious grace of God. For any to deny that Baptism can take place in a number of ways is error.

"Responsorial Psalm
100:1-2, 3, 4, 5

R. Let all the earth cry out to God with joy.

Sing joyfully to the LORD, all you lands;
serve the LORD with gladness;
come before him with joyful song.

R. Let all the earth cry out to God with joy.

Know that the LORD is God;
he made us, his we are;
his people, the flock he tends.

R. Let all the earth cry out to God with joy.

Enter his gates with thanksgiving,
his courts with praise;
Give thanks to him; bless his name.

R. Let all the earth cry out to God with joy.

The LORD is good: the LORD, whose kindness endures forever,
and his faithfulness, to all generations.

R. Let all the earth cry out to God with joy."
 
Walking_Home said:
To feed the flesh without feeding the soul is an error. The flesh dies – the soul continues to live. We cannot feed the flesh and leave the soul in starvation of Christ. It is not about only embracing our Lord for our own — but it teaching to others the true light and freedom they gain by embracing Christ.
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Are you familiar with the message of Divine Mercy, which was given to St. Faustina and is a reiteration of the message of Christ’s Mercy and Salvation?

In this message, Christ said that he calls out to each soul that leaves this earth, and it is never too late for a soul to respond to his call. It is such a profound message, such an overwhelming expression of God’s love and mercy, it can barely be comprehended by our finite minds.

When Mother Teresa ministered to the flesh, to the dying, no matter their station or religion, she was showing them the face of Christ. In showing them who Christ is, even without preaching, they would be able to recognize Him when he called out to them.

We underestimate what Christ has accomplished on the Cross, and we underestimate his overwhelming Mercy and his desire that none should be lost.

We underestimate how horrible it will be to stand before Him and know that we have not done all we could to show this Mercy to the world around us, even when we didn’t have to preach Christ but show Him through our words, actions and spirit, just as the witness of Mother Teresa has shown us how to do this.

The error is in underestimating what God has done and what he asks of each of us. Preach the Gospel always and when necessary, use words.
 
SFD said:
I’m merely following Pope Pius XI…do you think he deserves your admonition too?

SFD
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In a Church where Pope Benedict XVI is now the Pope, you might want to learn to follow him and you’ll learn that he negates the teachings of no previous Pope.
 
catharina said:
So far today, you claim that the Church is Truth, yet we know that Jesus is the Truth.

Now, in the same breath, you claim the Church (SHE) teaches Christ crucified. So you see them as one: Jesus/Church and as different: Jesus/She. You are very confused.

If you do not understand that Salvation History begins and comes to fruition with the promises made to the Jewish people, you need to go waaaaay back and start your studies all over again. Christ is the Head of the Church. People make up the Body of Christ, the Church. People who would judge others will be judged.

“Enter His gates with thanksgiving, His courts with praise.”

If you imagine God to be so small, so limited, that He is unable to find a means of Baptism for those who were historically the “people of God,” then I certainly can’t lead you to it - but it IS Church Teaching whether you like it or not. Grace is all around us.

Salvation comes from the Jews, from the promises made to the Jews. We are added in - how much more easily will they be able to recieve their portion, within the Church, through the mysterious grace of God. For any to deny that Baptism can take place in a number of ways is error.

"Responsorial Psalm
100:1-2, 3, 4, 5

R. Let all the earth cry out to God with joy.

Sing joyfully to the LORD, all you lands;
serve the LORD with gladness;
come before him with joyful song.

R. Let all the earth cry out to God with joy.

Know that the LORD is God;
he made us, his we are;
his people, the flock he tends.

R. Let all the earth cry out to God with joy.

Enter his gates with thanksgiving,
his courts with praise;
Give thanks to him; bless his name.

R. Let all the earth cry out to God with joy.

The LORD is good: the LORD, whose kindness endures forever,
and his faithfulness, to all generations.

R. Let all the earth cry out to God with joy."
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The one that is confused is you. You are divorcing the Bridegroom (Christ) from His Bride (the Church). Only protestants divorce Christ from His Church.
 
Jeanette_L said:
Are you familiar with the message of Divine Mercy, which was given to St. Faustina and is a reiteration of the message of Christ’s Mercy and Salvation?

In this message, Christ said that he calls out to each soul that leaves this earth, and it is never too late for a soul to respond to his call. It is such a profound message, such an overwhelming expression of God’s love and mercy, it can barely be comprehended by our finite minds.

When Mother Teresa ministered to the flesh, to the dying, no matter their station or religion, she was showing them the face of Christ. In showing them who Christ is, even without preaching, they would be able to recognize Him when he called out to them.

We underestimate what Christ has accomplished on the Cross, and we underestimate his overwhelming Mercy and his desire that none should be lost.

We underestimate how horrible it will be to stand before Him and know that we have not done all we could to show this Mercy to the world around us, even when we didn’t have to preach Christ but show Him through our words, actions and spirit, just as the witness of Mother Teresa has shown us how to do this.

The error is in underestimating what God has done and what he asks of each of us. Preach the Gospel always and when necessary, use words.
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Mercy and Truth go hand in hand.
 
Walking_Home said:
Did Mother Teresa not teach the Faith.
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She taught the Faith through her actions. And she never belittled or condemned any soul, ever. She saw Christ in every face, in every situation. She showed everyone the face of Christ in return.

This is why she will be canonized.
 
DustinsDad said:
If they are damned, they are damned because of not availing themselves to the only remedy for Hell…Our Lord Jesus Christ.

If they are saved, they were saved by Jesus Christ, which for adults means they had to have been invincibly and inculpably ignorant of Christ and HIs teachings and His Church and be free from all mortal sins committed through perfect contrition and be forgiven Original Sin through the gift of Baptism of Desire. Pray now that God gave them a special grace at the moment of their death - God’s outside of time and can do this sort of thing if He so chooses and if they accept the grace.
…
Christ again, being the only remedy for Hell.

DustinsDad
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Dustin, you speak a lot of truth here. But this is Divine Mercy Sunday and God’s Mercy is for ALL of humanity. We Catholics can invoke this Grace for the entire planet. And just as you say, God in his infinite and timeless omnipotence can see our prayers today as if spoken just at the moment prior to death in a long past event iust as if we stood right at that person’s bedside then and prayed for their mercy. I think it would be a good Catholic gesture for you to offer JR’s family the benefit of your spiritual piety and grace to pray on their behalf.

All of us have regrets that we did not have more influence or said more prayers for a departed loved one. It is AGONIZING to think of a loved one who may have been denied Heaven and cast away for eternity becuase they did not have an exterior indications of accepting Jesus. But ONLY God knows the heart as I am sure you are aware. And ONLY God can project His saving grace to help such people. Let’s TRUST in God to “do the right thing”. Let’s do what Sister Faustina told us we must do today - Let’s invoke Jesus’ Infinite Divine Mercy and TRUST in Him.

Please today join your prays to mine for JR’s family that God saw into the future at the time of their deaths to see our prayers for Divine Mercy today. Let us bring God’s Mercy to others. JR is committed 100% to God and Jesus and is vibrant part of Christ’ Church. He is a brother. Let us pray for Him and His beloved family.

Peace,
James
 
Walking_Home said:
Did Mother Teresa not teach the Faith.
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Mother Teresa publically said and wrote, as well as included it in the rule for the Sisters:

“It doesn’t make a difference if one is Mulsim, Hindu, Christian or Communist. We are all brothers and sisters. We are called to see Jesus in everyone. Jesus says ‘I thirst’ for food, shelter, love, dignity and God’s love. The Missionaries of Charity are to bring Christ’s love to anyone who is among the poorest of the poor, no matter who they are or what they believe. We leave those things up to God.”
 
catharina said:
In a Church where Pope Benedict XVI is now the Pope, you might want to learn to follow him and you’ll learn that he negates the teachings of no previous Pope.
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Well, then…I guess I’m okay following Pope Pius XI then. 🙂

SFD
 
DustinsDad said:
Pray now that God gave them a special grace at the moment of their death - God’s outside of time and can do this sort of thing if He so chooses and if they accept the grace.

DustinsDad
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You are right to say that the Church teaches us that we have hope in our loved ones receiving the grace of mercy and salvation at their moment of death. This is something we can all rejoice in, the hope that we all share.

This hope is what the message of Divine Mercy is all about, that Christ in his love and infinite mercy, calls out to each soul upon their death, there is always that final opportunity to receive his grace and forgiveness. We are bound by the Sacraments he has given his Church to dispense to the world, God is not so bound.

And you are right, none of us deserve heaven, not you because you believe, not the next person because they don’t understand or believe. But God has found a way for us to partake in this joy, and it is not limited by our imperfect knowledge and/or abilities to understand such graces with our finite minds, thank God for that.

We should all be humble in the face of such gifts bestowed upon us and should never cease in praying for those we love, who remain with us and who have gone on before us. Love covers a multitude of sins. 🙂
 
Walking_Home said:
The one that is confused is you. You are divorcing the Bridegroom (Christ) from His Bride (the Church). Only protestants divorce Christ from His Church.
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Revelation
Chapter 19

6 Then I heard something like the sound of a great multitude or the sound of rushing water or mighty peals of thunder, as they said: “Alleluia! The Lord has established his reign, (our) God, the almighty.
7 Let us rejoice and be glad and give him glory. For the wedding day of the Lamb has come, his bride has made herself ready.
8 She was allowed to wear a bright, clean linen garment.” (The linen represents the righteous deeds of the holy ones.)
9 Then the angel said to me, “Write this: Blessed are those who have been called to the wedding feast of the Lamb.” And he said to me, “These words are true; they come from God.”

Revelation
Chapter 21
1 Then I saw a new heaven and a new earth. The former heaven and the former earth had passed away, and the sea was no more.
2 I also saw the holy city, a new Jerusalem, 3 coming down out of heaven from God, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.
3 I heard a loud voice from the throne saying, “Behold, God’s dwelling is with the human race. He will dwell with them and they will be his people and God himself will always be with them (as their God).
4 He will wipe every tear from their eyes, and there shall be no more death or mourning, wailing or pain, (for) the old order has passed away.”
5 The one who sat on the throne 5 said, “Behold, I make all things new.” Then he said, “Write these words down, for they are trustworthy and true.”

2 Corinthians
Chapter 11

3 For I am jealous of you with the jealousy of God, since I betrothed you to one husband to present you as a chaste virgin to Christ. But I am afraid that, as the serpent deceived Eve by his cunning, your thoughts may be corrupted from a sincere (and pure) commitment to Christ.
4 For if someone comes and preaches another Jesus than the one we preached, or if you receive a different spirit from the one you received or a different gospel from the one you accepted, you put up with it well enough.

Jesus is the Truth.
The Church, His church, forever will prevail against the gates of hell.

People can argue Revelations nearly forever. I believe that we are called to the wedding feast of the Lamb and His bride, the Church. You imagine that the marriage has been consummated and the feast is over. I am allowed to believe that Christ and the Bride are both in union and separate - else how explain the sinners within the Church? Keep calling others protestant if you must. That won’t make you correct - or holy.
 
SFD said:
Well, then…I guess I’m okay following Pope Pius XI then. 🙂

SFD
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Dreadfully odd, tragic even, that you would smile over that. As if ALL has been explained, all has been defined by the late 1930s. Really? Where’d ya’ read that?
 
Walking_Home said:
To many are falling into presumption of His mercy—without the need for conversion.
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If Christ has chosen to save a soul at the moment of death without our being able to perceive a conversion prior to, is it not presumptuous of us to say this cannot be?

You are so far from understanding the Mercy of God through the Cross of Christ, I pity you. There is not a soul here in this discussion who does not understand the price that was paid for the salvation of the Church and the world.

We are called to pray for the world’s salvation, and not presume to know everything about how God will choose to dispense his grace to those who have died seemingly outside of his temporal Church.

Presumption seems to be going around today in the most unexpected places. :rolleyes:
 
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