A.D.

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Faith1960 said:
Shouldn’t they have been standing guard? I know this is a movie, but assuming guards reclined, how do we know they didn’t fall asleep and the body wasn’t stolen?
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If they fell asleep on Guard, in a Province that was notoriously unstable/volatile, particularly while the people were stirred up after the Crucifixion and the events leading up to it, they’d have been dead and they knew it. These were Roman Legionaries at the height of Rome’s power–arguably the most efficient and disciplined army that ever existed. Even today, if a soldier falls asleep on Guard in the most peaceful neighborhood in the United States they’d be court martialed.

I doubt those Roman Legionaries were lying around casually. They were on Guard. . That’s why the story being spread around by the Pharisees never flew (along with His appearances and the miraculous events described in Acts). Of the Jews who converted to Christianity at that time (a significant number), the largest numbers were among those closest to the actual events in Judea who had access to the most reliable information.
 
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Faith1960 said:
Shouldn’t they have been standing guard? I know this is a movie, but assuming guards reclined, how do we know they didn’t fall asleep and the body wasn’t stolen?
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I read that it was typical for guards to be STANDING while the others rested. We’re there guards standing in the movie? If so, I missed it.
 
Faith1960 said:
Shouldn’t they have been standing guard? I know this is a movie, but assuming guards reclined, how do we know they didn’t fall asleep and the body wasn’t stolen?
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They weren’t required to stand at attention outside the tomb throughout the night if that’s what you mean.

I was in the Marines and had week-end guard duty at the armory on several occasions. There were two of us on duty throughout the weekend. One would sleep while the other would keep watch, but this meant we sat in a chair with a desk and were allowed to write, write letters and read.

It is probable that the Roman soldiers at the tomb were able to sit, and recline and perhaps even sleep while one or two stayed awake in rotation with the other guards.

Jim
 
JimR-OCDS said:
They weren’t required to stand at attention outside the tomb throughout the night if that’s what you mean.

I was in the Marines and had week-end guard duty at the armory on several occasions. There were two of us on duty throughout the weekend. One would sleep while the other would keep watch, but this meant we sat in a chair with a desk and were allowed to write, write letters and read.

It is probable that the Roman soldiers at the tomb were able to sit, and recline and perhaps even sleep while one or two stayed awake in rotation with the other guards.

Jim
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Of course, but Guard was Guard. They had their own protocol such as some sleeping while others kept watch in rotation, but they weren’t like–“Hey guys! We drew guard duty! Let’s party and then catch a few Zs”, especially since the population was restive after events and the order came from the governor himself. I doubt these legionaries were too comfortable about things in general.

Just like the U.S. Marines, Roman legionaries knew how to stand guard, and this was in sporadically hostile territory after a major event. That’s why a special guard was called for in the 1st place.
 
JimR-OCDS said:
They weren’t required to stand at attention outside the tomb throughout the night if that’s what you mean.

I was in the Marines and had week-end guard duty at the armory on several occasions. There were two of us on duty throughout the weekend. One would sleep while the other would keep watch, but this meant we sat in a chair with a desk and were allowed to write, write letters and read.

It is probable that the Roman soldiers at the tomb were able to sit, and recline and perhaps even sleep while one or two stayed awake in rotation with the other guards.

Jim
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We’re they awake during the movie? It looked to me like they were asleep or mighty relaxed, but I wasn’t paying a lot of attention during the beginning of that scene…
 
One thing I read called the guards kustodians, and said that “four stood battle ready while the remaining twelve formed a semi circle perimeter in front of the tomb, relaxed but wary. If anyone approached the tomb, the kustodian immediately fell into formation.”

That’s different from some other accounts I’ve read as well as the movie.

Some accounts say they were Roman soldiers, others say something else.
 
MarkR said:
Of course, but Guard was Guard. They had their own protocol such as some sleeping while others kept watch in rotation, but they weren’t like–“Hey guys! We drew guard duty! Let’s party and then catch a few Zs”, especially since the population was restive after events and the order came from the governor himself. I doubt these legionaries were too comfortable about things in general.

Just like the U.S. Marines, Roman legionaries knew how to stand guard, and this was in sporadically hostile territory after a major event. That’s why a special guard was called for in the 1st place.
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I agree, but I don’t see a problem in the way the movie portrayed it.

Also, it wasn’t that the guards in fact fell asleep, but they were falsely accused of falling asleep and beaten. It was Pilates way of trying to put down the talks about Jesus rising from the dead.

Jim
 
JimR-OCDS said:
I agree, but I don’t see a problem in the way the movie portrayed it.

Also, it wasn’t that the guards in fact fell asleep, but they were falsely accused of falling asleep and beaten. It was Pilates way of trying to put down the talks about Jesus rising from the dead.

Jim
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Are you sure they were falsely accused of falling asleep? Between Scripture and the movie, I’m questioning it.

News adhere to the falling asleep explanation.
 
Faith1960 said:
Are you sure they were falsely accused of falling asleep? Between Scripture and the movie, I’m questioning it.

News adhere to the falling asleep explanation.
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Yeah, Pilate was trying to show the Caiaphas how he was able to put down stories about Christ resurrection.

If I recall correctly, Caiaphas paid a guard to go out and begin the story that the guards had fallen asleep.

Jim
 
MarkR said:
If they fell asleep on Guard, in a Province that was notoriously unstable/volatile, particularly while the people were stirred up after the Crucifixion and the events leading up to it, they’d have been dead and they knew it. These were Roman Legionaries at the height of Rome’s power–arguably the most efficient and disciplined army that ever existed. Even today, if a soldier falls asleep on Guard in the most peaceful neighborhood in the United States they’d be court martialed.

I doubt those Roman Legionaries were lying around casually. They were on Guard. . That’s why the story being spread around by the Pharisees never flew (along with His appearances and the miraculous events described in Acts). Of the Jews who converted to Christianity at that time (a significant number), the largest numbers were among those closest to the actual events in Judea who had access to the most reliable information.
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How do you know for sure they were Roman Legionaries?is it in Scripture? I ask because various websites ive read say they were Roman and others say Jewish.
 
Faith1960 said:
Anyone else know for sure?
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Caiaphus (“the chief priests”) paid the guards to say that they fell asleep and that he’d cover for them with Pilate. See Matthew 28–11/15. Kind of an act of desperation. Pilate obviously had a vested interest in going along with it.
 
MarkR said:
Caiaphus (“the chief priests”) paid the guards to say that they fell asleep and that he’d cover for them with Pilate. See Matthew 28–11/15. Kind of an act of desperation. Pilate obviously had a vested interest in going along with it.
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How do we know they were asleep was a lie? Jews believe it to be truth.
 
Faith1960 said:
How do we know they were asleep was a lie? Jews believe it to be truth.
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Not all Jews believed it to be the truth. The Apostles were Jewish and they didn’t believe it.

After all, they were being accused of removing Jesus body from the tomb.

Jim
 
JimR-OCDS said:
Not all Jews believed it to be the truth. The Apostles were Jewish and they didn’t believe it.

After all, they were being accused of removing Jesus body from the tomb.

Jim
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Many Jews that arent Christian believe the guards were sleeping and Jesus was stolen.
 
Faith1960 said:
How do we know they were asleep was a lie? Jews believe it to be truth.
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Well, outside of common sense, “the Bible tells us so” Faith. That’s our Faith…

Jews don’t believe that Christ was the Messiah, we do. That’s kind of been the story from the beginning. Many Jews at the time did believe He was, most of them from closest to where the events took place in Judea. That’s why Paul was sent to wipe them out. The story obviously didn’t fly with them.

They and others who don’t believe also have to explain why a group of apostles and disciples went almost frantically to the ends of the earth and to their deaths trying to spread the word. They were changed men forever and took on an empire. Why?
 
Is it suggested anywhere in Scripture that Jesus appeared to others besides the Apostles, the Marys and the 500?
 
Faith1960 said:
Many Jews that arent Christian believe the guards were sleeping and Jesus was stolen.
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Yeah so what ?

The first Christians were Jewish.

Those Jews who believe the guards were sleeping and it’s how disciples of Jesus managed to roll the heavy stone away and removed the body of Jesus, used it their excuse not to believe Jesus is the Christ.

Christians Jews knew Jesus rose for he appeared to many of them.

Jim
 
Faith1960 said:
Is it suggested anywhere in Scripture that Jesus appeared to others besides the Apostles, the Marys and the 500?
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Well, he appeared to St Paul.

Then of course over the centuries, He’s appeared to various saints, St Faustina being one in modern times.

Of course, those of us who have faith, do so from His revelation of Himself to us.

Jim
 
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