A first Confession

[Black_Dog]

After Mass tonight, the Faith Enquirers group met (RCIA). I’ve been attending this for over a year and am on the home stretch. It was a bit of a shock to be told that a first Confession wasnt necessary and that instead all of my sins would be forgiven by taking part in a sort of general reconciliation service which was to be tacked on to the Sunday Mass.

I’m afraid I dug my heels in and with the support of my sponsor insisted that I be allowed to make a full confession. The priest reluctantly agreed…and it was reluctantly. I came away feeling confused.

 

[Jenny_Z]

Reconciliation services should include an opportunity to confess face-to-face with a priest, but unfortunately, some parishes don’t do it quite right.

You’re right in wanting a good, full Confession. I’m glad you stuck to your guns Don’t worry about it (and I would personally suggest only going to the “Reconciliation Service” only if it’s absolutely necessary).

 

[john_ennis]

Reconciliation services do NOT take the place of confession. They do not satisfy the requirement to go to confession. This point has been clarified repeatedly by every apologist I’ve ever heard. I’m sure people here can direct you to authoritative evidence, and the Catholic Answers apologists can also verify.

It’s hard to believe that lay RCIA folks, not to mention priests, are still saying what you were told.

Peace.
John

 

[LilyM]

Perhaps the priest’s reluctance indicates that he was indeed planning to allow ample opportunity for one-on-one confession as part of this service.

But then again, in terms of first confessions, some people do have many more years’ worth of past sins to bring into the mix than your average practicing Catholic, so I’d agree with you a general service might not be the best option.

If you feel your confession is going to be a long one then I’d make a specific appointment with the priest.

 

[Black_Dog]

The priest’s stance was that until I am accepted into the Church I’m not eligible to receive any of the Sacraments including the Rite of Reconciliation but I’m sure I’ve read somewhere, probably on here, that Catuchmens and candidates can do just that.

And yes, at 55 I’ve a few things to discuss

 

[LilyM]

Reconciliation services do NOT take the place of confession. They do not satisfy the requirement to go to confession. This point has been clarified repeatedly by every apologist I’ve ever heard. I’m sure people here can direct you to authoritative evidence, and the Catholic Answers apologists can also verify.

It’s hard to believe that lay RCIA folks, not to mention priests, are still saying what you were told.

Peace.
John

John, let’s be clear that there are numerous different TYPES of Reconciliation Service. (You may hear them called 2nd Rite or 3rd Rite).

Many of these services will in fact be 2nd Rite, which consists of a period of group prayer, scripture readings etc followed by one-on-one confession.

In other words after the group prayers the priest or priests will either go into the confessional(s) or place themselves in corners of the Church, people will line up and individually confess their sins to the priest, receive penance and individual absolution exactly as ordinarily happens in regular confession. Such services are a perfectly legitimate way of fulfilling your obligation.

The only thing that would be illegitimate would be if individual confession of sins were not permitted, or if a group absolution (only permissible in emergency situations) were performed instead of individual absolution.

 

[baltobetsy]

Black Dog, have you been baptized? If not, and you will be baptized at the Easter Vigil, they were correct in telling you that you do not need to confess beforehand. It is baptism that makes you eligible to receive all the other sacraments. Baptism also takes away all your sins, original and personal. What a great deal that is!

On the other hand, if you are already baptized, and the reconciliation service is not to include individual confessions, I share the sadness at the misinformation that has been given to you and pray that your RCIA team and priest don’t do any more lasting harm to anyone.

Betsy

 

[LilyM]

The priest’s stance was that until I am accepted into the Church I’m not eligible to receive any of the Sacraments including the Rite of Reconciliation but I’m sure I’ve read somewhere, probably on here, that Catuchmens and candidates can do just that.

And yes, at 55 I’ve a few things to discuss

Depends on things like whether or not you’ve already been baptised, whether you’ve been catechised on the Sacrament of Reconciliation and so on.

 

[john_ennis]

John, let’s be clear that there are numerous different TYPES of Reconciliation Service. (You may hear them called 2nd Rite or 3rd Rite).

Many of these services will in fact be 2nd Rite, which consists of a period of group prayer, scripture readings etc followed by one-on-one confession.

In other words after the group prayers the priest or priests will either go into the confessional(s) or place themselves in corners of the Church, people will line up and individually confess their sins to the priest, receive penance and individual absolution exactly as ordinarily happens in regular confession. Such services are a perfectly legitimate way of fulfilling your obligation.

The only thing that would be illegitimate would be if individual confession of sins were not permitted, or if a group absolution (only permissible in emergency situations) were performed instead of individual absolution.

Yes, thanks. I didn’t understand that it was more than a service.
John

 

[Black_Dog]

Depends on things like whether or not you’ve already been baptised, whether you’ve been catechised on the Sacrament of Reconciliation and so on.

I have been baptised and although tonight was the first time we discussed the Sacrament of Reconciliation, I have made it my business to find out as much as I can about the teachings of the Church. The priest is well aware of this as we’ve often had “interesting” discussions on just about everything. I have huge respect for the man and I know that at times he must think “oh no…not him again”.

 

[Black_Dog]

John, let’s be clear that there are numerous different TYPES of Reconciliation Service. (You may hear them called 2nd Rite or 3rd Rite).

Many of these services will in fact be 2nd Rite, which consists of a period of group prayer, scripture readings etc followed by one-on-one confession.

In other words after the group prayers the priest or priests will either go into the confessional(s) or place themselves in corners of the Church, people will line up and individually confess their sins to the priest, receive penance and individual absolution exactly as ordinarily happens in regular confession. Such services are a perfectly legitimate way of fulfilling your obligation.

The only thing that would be illegitimate would be if individual confession of sins were not permitted, or if a group absolution (only permissible in emergency situations) were performed instead of individual absolution.

I’ve already attended one of these services. There were three priests in attendance but when it was my turn I was refused and given a blessing instead which was a bit of an anti climax. The service my priest was discussing was not this one. Is it because I’m in England and things are different here than in the States??

 

[LilyM]

Yes, thanks. I didn’t understand that it was more than a service.
John

It’s not ‘more than’ a service, the 2nd Rite is an integrated whole, combining public prayer and other things with the one-on-one confession. It’s a Rite of Reconciliation like all the others (1st Rite being the entirely individual and private one that most of us are used to).

Just like you can have two forms of baptism -

a) the emergency kind, not done in Church, no Baptismal Promises or other lengthy prayers, no anointing with oil, no presentation with a candle etc,

b) the one done in church which contains all the above.

The second option isn’t ‘more than’ a baptism, it’s just a different way of doing it.

 

[LilyM]

I’ve already attended one of these services. There were three priests in attendance but when it was my turn I was refused and given a blessing instead which was a bit of an anti climax. The service my priest was discussing was not this one. Is it because I’m in England and things are different here than in the States??

No, there are three formalised Rites of confession, it should adhere to one of the three, doesn’t matter which country.

What exactly IS going to happen at the service, then?

 

[Black_Dog]

No, there are three formalised Rites of confession, it should adhere to one of the three, doesn’t matter which country.

What exactly IS going to happen at the service, then?

We go up to the altar with our sponsors who place their right hand on our shoulder, the priest recites a prayer we make an affirmation and then we go back to our pews

 

[LilyM]

We go up to the altar with our sponsors who place their right hand on our shoulder, the priest recites a prayer we make an affirmation and then we go back to our pews

Sounds like it could describe any one of several rites that RCIA candidates go through.

Can you give the gist of the prayer that the priest says and the gist of this ‘affirmation’?

 

[Jenny_Z]

Are you sure what you’re describing are the Scrutinies? If so, that is completely different from the Sacrament of Confession.

Candidates and Catechumins go through Scrutinies during Lent, where they go in front of the community and admit to the priest something that they struggle with (that’s how we did it, anyway). The priest says a prayer, the congregation prays, then the rest of mass goes on.

 

[Black_Dog]

Are you sure what you’re describing are the Scrutinies? If so, that is completely different from the Sacrament of Confession.

Candidates and Catechumins go through Scrutinies during Lent, where they go in front of the community and admit to the priest something that they struggle with (that’s how we did it, anyway). The priest says a prayer, the congregation prays, then the rest of mass goes on.

It is you’re right…the Scrutinies…I remember now

 

[LilyM]

It is you’re right…the Scrutinies…I remember now

The scrutinies are unrelated to the sacrament of Confession, and I don’t know why your priest would say your sins are forgiven at the scrutinies - unless he’d forgotten that you weren’t going to proceed on to the sacrament of baptism (which indeed DOES procure absolution of mortal sins in the same manner as confession).

 

[Joannm]

Are you sure what you’re describing are the Scrutinies? If so, that is completely different from the Sacrament of Confession.

Candidates and Catechumins go through Scrutinies during Lent, where they go in front of the community and admit to the priest something that they struggle with (that’s how we did it, anyway). The priest says a prayer, the congregation prays, then the rest of mass goes on.

Admiting something you struggle with to the priest, or admitting anything, or even saying anything, is not part of the scrutinies. It sounds like something your priest made up.

 

[Black_Dog]

The scrutinies are unrelated to the sacrament of Confession, and I don’t know why your priest would say your sins are forgiven at the scrutinies - unless he’d forgotten that you weren’t going to proceed on to the sacrament of baptism (which indeed DOES procure absolution of mortal sins in the same manner as confession).

Thank you so much for taking the time to clarify all of this. I’ve asked the same question in the Ask an Aplogist forum, not because I doubt the advice given on here but that I need to go back to the priest and tactfully explain that he’s wrong and I need to be absolutely sure. There’s not only me involved in the RCIA programme but others too but they were all willing to accept what the priest told them on face value.

Two weeks ago he told us all that Confirmation absolved one of all mortal sins and I knew that was wrong from all I’ve read. I’m very concerned not to come across as a barrack room lawyer and for the priest to feel that I’m always questioning him and attempting to undermine him. It’s just that this is a HUGELY important point in my life and I so need to feel that everything has been done in accordance with the teachings of the Church