A Jewish Rabbi on the Paganization of the West and its DeChristianization

[bosnian_muslim]

Well, to some extent I agree with you. When one thinks of the murderous nature of European history, especially but not only in the last century, there wasn’t a way forward that dragged all the tradition of the dead generations along with it.

On the other hand, one’s own life seen as being the celebrity in one’s own ‘private reality TV show’ does seem a rather tawdry future.

well well,there are both positive and negative things

 

[KyivAndrew]

The Rabbi seems to be quite happy about all the problems that Christianity faces. He may not know the New Testament so we need to inform him that the Catholic Church will always exist, until the end of the world. So please, don’t bury us yet Mr Rabbi. We have the Holy Spirit - the giver of life, you don’t.
What about the God of Rabbinic Judaism (a religion younger that Christianity!)? Theoretically it’s the God of Abraham, Jacob, Joseph, etc. In fact - it’s money and power - those criticised so much by the Rabbi (money makes the world go round, if I were a rich man - these are Jewish songs - it’s not a coincidence. Since the WWII it’s also the cult of holocaust (with Yad Vashem as a new Temple) that supports the struggle to get more money, power and respect, to discourage anybody who’d like to criticise Jews in any way.
He’s glad about Rabbinic Judaism. As the Talmud teaches: goys are animals and Jews should harm them. Is that what the God of Abraham wants? Does he want such hatred and contempt? No, he wants love (including the love of enemy!) and in Judaism there are just dead, pointless gestures (and love of other Jews only).
We have the promise of victory and eternal life given to us by Jesus, while Rabbinic Judaism…
If Christianity faces serious problems now, it’s partly because of Jews. They have supported freemasonery, abortion, communism, gay movement, anti-Catholic wars and revolutions, spreading pornography. Congratulations… But God hasn’t finished his battle yet.

What the heck is this? I posted an article where a Rabbi points out legitimate concerns about Western culture and now I return to the thread after work and Judaism is being spuriously attacked! That wasn’t what my OP was about and you leopolis have fundamentally misunderstood what the Rabbi was stating and put all us Catholics up to ridicule if you preach this stuff. (On Freemasonry for goodness’ sakes we have Catholic posters here on CAF who are Masons and defend it to the hilt, Catholics not Jews). Let’s get away from insane stereotypes. The Jews get blamed for Communism and Capitalism (how is that for logic?). Where did Pope John Paul II, a Pole of course, ever speak that way about Judaism or Jews? He did call them “elder brothers”, did he not?

Heck I feel I have had to digress here and don’t like it. Repeat: this thread is not about Jewish responsibility, for what? On societies troubles’ I think the West’s Christians (and nominal ones) should look at themselves; there is plenty to look at.

Sorry about this to anyone reading.

 

[KyivAndrew]

I’d suggest that it’s something else - it’s indifference to belief altogether, on a kind of ‘none of that stuff works, let’s not bother’ basis.

I kind of agree with Kaninchen on this particular point. It isn’t necessarily nihilism among some but an attitude that Christians in North America might be surprised to find in “nominal” Christians in Europe: i.e. “who knows, who cares”. We can argue how much the past century’s wars in Europe contributed to this and also how much blame should go to what the Rabbi calls the current “paganization”, but I must state among friends I’ve made from Western Europe, I know this attitude (and we do have it in North America too).

Eastern Europe is another story to a certain extent because of the Communist past.

I do however see here and in Europe what the Rabbi decries. It certainly is on target and a proper diagnosis of societal ills I would argue.

 

[KyivAndrew]

On the craving for fame the rabbi mentions and its addictive properties, need we look further than to the recent 24/7 television coverage of the balloon boy and his family in the USA? What great parenting: using you own children to pull a hoax on the whole world. Turns out the child “Falcon” was hiding in the attic all the time as the police searched along with air patrol for the whereabouts of the missing child.

I couldn’t understand Wolf Blitzer throwing all the other stories of the day out the window on CNN (i.e. Hillary in Russia, Afghanistan) and covering this non-stop. I believe the BBC led off the world report with the story as well. Apparently the family was involved in some reality T.V. show called Wife Swap before. I do not watch these “reality” shows because that “reality” is surreal. With every year these shows seem to push the envelope further and further. Is there anyone out there who is addicted to these types of shows and finds the whole business mad entertainment? I know my cousin does, so my family is not immune and I confess to watching Dancing with the Stars just to see sports celebs try their hand at waltzing but I believe this particular show to be slightly different than the MTV type reality t.v. the youth and many watch. At least your parents and grandparents won’t cringe at Dancing with the Stars. And never mind youth. It seems there are plenty of adults stuck in perpetual adolescence, as in Falcon’s dad. The routine is so scripted now: 15 minutes of fame, the obligatory hour on Larry King and then out with the rubbish.

For example, last Sunday on 60 minutes the leader of the 2nd largest Ponzi scheme in U.S. history agrees to be profiled on the show even though he is under arrest and what he says could be used against him. He states he hoped he would become famous doing good works but since that did not pan out, he has no problem becoming infamous for allegedly defrauding thousands of families. No moral shame, just happy to have the cameras rolling on his face. Is this not a societal sickness or do we have no right to call behaviour “sick” anymore?

Once on a local year-in-review show in my locale, a perspicacious wag commented that collecting sports cards in modern times had replaced collecting possessions of Saints as Hollywood and sports stars are the Modern World’s new saints. Seems to ring a bell. Where are the role models in today’s societies or should we even bother looking for them?

There is a new Pagan god of Fame. Part of this insane craving for fame I believe (in my Christian perspective) comes from believing this world and life is all we have and, ergo, one should seek to immortalize oneself through fame OR infamy. No difference now between the two.

 

[dzheremi]

I find all this speculation on religion in Europe by Americans to be fascinating. I wonder if it is something like how convert Muslims are often more “radical” in their Islamic viewpoints than many born Muslims. Why does Europe’s religious consciousness or lack thereof come up so often on this board? I’m an American; I just don’t get it.

Then again, maybe it is some faux-pastoral mutation of “fourth generation Boston Irish syndrome”…another preoccupation of a certain segment of the U.S. population that I’ll never understand.

 

[josie_L]

On the craving for fame the rabbi mentions and its addictive properties, need we look further than to the recent 24/7 television coverage of the balloon boy and his family in the USA? What great parenting: using you own children to pull a hoax on the whole world. Turns out the child “Falcon” was hiding in the attic all the time as the police searched along with air patrol for the whereabouts of the missing child.

I couldn’t understand Wolf Blitzer throwing all the other stories of the day out the window on CNN (i.e. Hillary in Russia, Afghanistan) and covering this non-stop. I believe the BBC led off the world report with the story as well. Apparently the family was involved in some reality T.V. show called Wife Swap before. I do not watch these “reality” shows because that “reality” is surreal. With every year these shows seem to push the envelope further and further.

There’s some good that came out of Balloon Boy in that we see the ridiculous nature of the media being displayed (I can’t believe these people are supposed to be smart).

p.s. I totally agree with you about the fame, in fact, You Tube/Internet has made it all the more easier to gain notoriety and/or admiration for those who seek it.

 

[KyivAndrew]

I find all this speculation on religion in Europe by Americans to be fascinating. I wonder if it is something like how convert Muslims are often more “radical” in their Islamic viewpoints than many born Muslims. Why does Europe’s religious consciousness or lack thereof come up so often on this board? I’m an American; I just don’t get it.

Then again, maybe it is some faux-pastoral mutation of “fourth generation Boston Irish syndrome”…another preoccupation of a certain segment of the U.S. population that I’ll never understand.

I’m the OP and I’m not American. I’m Canadian. When my dad immigrated here from Europe to Canada he always reminded me he had to pledge allegiance to the Queen of England as a Commonwealth Citizen. My parents are from Ukraine (father born in part under Poland, mother in part under Romania at the time), DP camps in Germany, mom years in Leeds, England (she always said Manchester had more sun than other parts of England - I don’t know if this is true). So I’m posting as someone who is one generation away from Europe and is not an American. So I guess I am not suffering from fourth generation Boston Irish syndrome. + European history is Western history which I thoroughly am fascinated by.

 

[KyivAndrew]

There’s some good that came out of Balloon Boy in that we see the ridiculous nature of the media being displayed (I can’t believe these people are supposed to be smart).

p.s. I totally agree with you about the fame, in fact, You Tube/Internet has made it all the more easier to gain notoriety and/or admiration for those who seek it.

Yeah I agree josie.

 

[dzheremi]

I’m the OP and I’m not American. I’m Canadian. When my dad immigrated here from Europe to Canada he always reminded me he had to pledge allegiance to the Queen of England as a Commonwealth Citizen. My parents are from Ukraine (father born in part under Poland, mother in part under Romania at the time), DP camps in Germany, mom years in Leeds, England (she always said Manchester had more sun than other parts of England - I don’t know if this is true). So I’m posting as someone who is one generation away from Europe and is not an American. So I guess I am not suffering from fourth generation Boston Irish syndrome. + European history is Western history which I thoroughly am fascinated by.

I didn’t figure with a name like “KyivAndrew” that you were American. I meant this as a general comment, not really even particular to this thread (though I did think of it because of Jharek’s line “you almost have to live in a European country to understand” so I posted it here, admittedly without much thought). Apologies if I’ve offended you.

 

[KyivAndrew]

I didn’t figure with a name like “KyivAndrew” that you were American. I meant this as a general comment, not really even particular to this thread (though I did think of it because of Jharek’s line “you almost have to live in a European country to understand” so I posted it here, admittedly without much thought). Apologies if I’ve offended you.

Nothing to apologize for. Sorry if I came across too blunt. I didn’t think I did. But on the keyboard I guess you have to be careful.

I note at the bottom of your signature you have either in Church Slavonic or Russian? : “In the beginning was the Word…” Nice.

As for Europe I guess it comes across also from my student days when the Soviet Union was still kicking and me trying to get Ukraine and its Churches free and being involved quite a bit in student activism in that regard. So I guess I kind of grew up with Europe’s “liberation”, political and religious, so to speak as a large goal in my life.

By the way, it cuts both ways. I notice on the politics subforum at times how unique the American perspective is as opposed to even the Canadian in regards to where communism begins and such stuff.

I guess in certain regards Canada kind of is a mid-Atlantic country, what with England and France providing the Founding Nations tradition (on top of the Native population of course) here in the Great White North.

Regards, Andrew

 

[josie_L]

Yeah I agree josie.

You agree that I agree with you.

 

[KyivAndrew]

Forgive me if I am derailing from the original topic but I wanted to know what Nihilism implied; I didn’t know that it actually is a philosophy.

The objective of nihilism manifests itself in several perspectives:
Epistemological nihilism denies the possibility of knowledge and truth, and is linked to extreme skepticism.
Political nihilism advocates the prior destruction of all existing political, social, and religious orders as a prerequisite for any future improvement.
Ethical nihilism (moral nihilism) rejects the possibility of absolute moral or ethical values. Good and evil are vague, and related values are simply the result of social and emotional pressures.
Existential nihilism, the most well-known view, affirms that life has no intrinsic meaning or value.

Nihilism – A Meaningless World
Shakespeare’s Macbeth eloquently summarizes existential nihilism’s perspective, distaining life:

Out, out, brief candle! Life’s but a walking shadow, a poor player That struts and frets his hour upon the stage And then is heard no more; it is a tale Told by an idiot, full of sound and fury, Signifying nothing.

Philosophers’ predictions of nihilism’s impact

source:allaboutphilosophy.org/nihilism.htm

Thanks for the link Humble Maid. There is a particular spiritual vacuum I believe in the West (in both North America and in Europe, I would just like to emphasize). Moral apathy may be more descriptive but in the end one might end up with the same result as moral nihilism. I guess the distinction is similar to that between Amorality and Immorality. They mean different things but in the end…

The English writer Paul Johnson once wrote a book called Intellectuals in which he lay bare the presumptions and pretensions of such 20th Century luminaries as Jean-Paul Sartre (existentialism). Johnson’s last chapter is entitled The Flight of Reason, in which he writes:
At the end of the Second World War, there was a significant change in the predominant aim of secular intellectuals, a shift of emphasis from utopianism to hedonism.

I believe this rings true. The English journalist and convert to Catholicism Malcolm Muggeridge was quite amused at the Americans’ Declaration that God endowed mankind with inalienable rights to “life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness”. The last “right” he pointed out was artificial and resulted ultimately in unhappiness as men and women pursued endlessly personal happiness at all costs on earth as if it was their birthright and unhappiness unconstitutional. In this particular pursuit, Muggeridge bemoaned the American experiment for what he perceived to be its materialism, though of course he had much to commend of America. In any event I have always considered America during the Cold War as a beacon of freedom that kept Europe afloat and always considered anti-Americanism repulsive, though I see Muggs’ point on that one particular point. How easy is it to change the pursuit of happiness into an inalienable right to hedonism.

Muggeridge, perhaps after witnessing much human suffering as a journalist, always insisted that at the heart of modern Western Civilization was a Death Wish. James Burnham believed this too. I never really saw it that bad (the glass was still half-full) but Muggeridge was quite the apologist for Jesus Christ and His meaning in life. Just see here.socrates58.blogspot.com/2006/04/malcolm-muggeridge-iconoclast-links.html

I quoted the article in my OP because I believed the Rabbi was onto something in linking the decline of Christianity in the Western World with the Rise of a new, virtual Paganism. I believe Catholics can agree with this. I believe Europe as well as North America is unsure of its roots at times. I’ll give an example from my own country - Canada.

When a national tragedy occurred not too long ago, the bureaucrats insisted that at the Memorial Service the name “Jesus Christ” was under no circumstances to be mentioned in any prayer or speech despite the public present. Yet, Canadians’ taxpayers’ money goes to fund our own Public Broadcaster, the CBC, for Canadian entertainment. One of the shows gulping up funds is called “Little Mosque on the Prarie”. It is your standard tale of an intelligent traditional Muslim family out on the Western farmlands who have to deal with all sorts of Christian and WASP rubes like the ridiculous local Christian priest who is always up to no good.

Now, I don’t believe one can discriminate at all on the basis of religion in the modern West. However, it is another thing entirely to have a state’s citizens pay money to support a show in which a Christian priest is the butt of jokes while the protagonists are the lovable fictional Muslim family - given the rest of the CBC’s actions. I in principle have no problem with the show necessarily but considering it is a state broadcaster which, to top it off, refuses to have national Catholic commentators like Michael Coren ever appear on the channel, shows to some extent what certain elites consider of Catholicism or Christianity. Michael Coren in Canada has stated as much. He draws large TV audiences for his show and yet can’t even get one invite on any CBC newspanel. Catholicism is the biggest denomination in Canada and yet all our taxpayers’ money can’t even go to having one half-decent representation or voice for Catholicism. Go figure.

Now, just to end off, I am apologizing now if I have offended anyone because I note this thread for some reason appears unpredictable.

I am strictly defending the place of Christianity in the West (so it doesn’t recede further) and bemoaning what I see as the paganization of culture. If I am wrong in some point, I will cede the point. God Bless.

 

[Anna_Scott]

For the same reason 2 black guys can call each other “******” and for the same reasons Germans can make jokes about Germans and blondes can tell blonde jokes…
She is Jewish and she may do so…

Edit: Wow there actually is some restriction on what one can write… But you know what I mean… a term they can call each other which is offensive if used by a white guy.

Some things are offensive no matter who writes them.

Anna

 

[PA650]

I find all this speculation on religion in Europe by Americans to be fascinating. I wonder if it is something like how convert Muslims are often more “radical” in their Islamic viewpoints than many born Muslims. Why does Europe’s religious consciousness or lack thereof come up so often on this board? I’m an American; I just don’t get it.

Then again, maybe it is some faux-pastoral mutation of “fourth generation Boston Irish syndrome”…another preoccupation of a certain segment of the U.S. population that I’ll never understand.

Our current world is becoming increasingly interconnected and the current culture of Europe can be and is being transported to the U.S. For example, one can notice the hedonistic behavior of young adults in Dun Laogharie, IR being replicated by young adults in Eugene, OR. Among other things, personally, I find such articles found in KyivAndrew’s original post to be highly insightful and informative. Nevertheless, not every European country suffers from religious apathy albeit that could change in the coming years. Regarding Irish-Americans, many held the idea that they were exiled by Great Britain and never truly chose to immigrate, e.g. the Great Famine of Ireland.

 

[dzheremi]

Hmmm. Up until about 4 months ago I was still living in Eugene. I didn’t notice any Irish-inspired hedonism, but then I mostly kept to myself and my work. As to your other content, point taken.

 

[PA650]

Hmmm. Up until about 4 months ago I was still living in Eugene. I didn’t notice any Irish-inspired hedonism, but then I mostly kept to myself and my work. As to your other content, point taken.

Frankly, I was highlighting the similarity between Western European culture and the culture found in the United States. Yes, the article is European-centric, but the statements it contains can be easily translated to our Western culture in general. Regarding Eugene, I’m finishing up my education at the University of Oregon and every weekend the residential neighborhoods west of the campus and other sections of the city contain a multitude of students not exactly adhering to Christian morality. I hope you enjoyed living in Eugene–it’s an interesting place to say the least. Have a good night.

 

[humble_maid]

Thanks for the link Humble Maid. There is a particular spiritual vacuum I believe in the West (in both North America and in Europe, I would just like to emphasize). Moral apathy may be more descriptive but in the end one might end up with the same result as moral nihilism. I guess the distinction is similar to that between Amorality and Immorality. They mean different things but in the end…

The English writer Paul Johnson once wrote a book called Intellectuals in which he lay bare the presumptions and pretensions of such 20th Century luminaries as Jean-Paul Sartre (existentialism). Johnson’s last chapter is entitled The Flight of Reason, in which he writes:
At the end of the Second World War, there was a significant change in the predominant aim of secular intellectuals, a shift of emphasis from utopianism to hedonism.

I believe this rings true. The English journalist and convert to Catholicism Malcolm Muggeridge was quite amused at the Americans’ Declaration that God endowed mankind with inalienable rights to “life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness”. The last “right” he pointed out was artificial and resulted ultimately in unhappiness as men and women pursued endlessly personal happiness at all costs on earth as if it was their birthright and unhappiness unconstitutional. In this particular pursuit, Muggeridge bemoaned the American experiment for what he perceived to be its materialism, though of course he had much to commend of America. In any event I have always considered America during the Cold War as a beacon of freedom that kept Europe afloat and always considered anti-Americanism repulsive, though I see Muggs’ point on that one particular point. How easy is it to change the pursuit of happiness into an inalienable right to hedonism.

Muggeridge, perhaps after witnessing much human suffering as a journalist, always insisted that at the heart of modern Western Civilization was a Death Wish. James Burnham believed this too. I never really saw it that bad (the glass was still half-full) but Muggeridge was quite the apologist for Jesus Christ and His meaning in life. Just see here.socrates58.blogspot.com/2006/04/malcolm-muggeridge-iconoclast-links.html

I quoted the article in my OP because I believed the Rabbi was onto something in linking the decline of Christianity in the Western World with the Rise of a new, virtual Paganism. I believe Catholics can agree with this. I believe Europe as well as North America is unsure of its roots at times. I’ll give an example from my own country - Canada.

When a national tragedy occurred not too long ago, the bureaucrats insisted that at the Memorial Service the name “Jesus Christ” was under no circumstances to be mentioned in any prayer or speech despite the public present. Yet, Canadians’ taxpayers’ money goes to fund our own Public Broadcaster, the CBC, for Canadian entertainment. One of the shows gulping up funds is called “Little Mosque on the Prarie”. It is your standard tale of an intelligent traditional Muslim family out on the Western farmlands who have to deal with all sorts of Christian and WASP rubes like the ridiculous local Christian priest who is always up to no good.

Humble maid:
I saw at most two episodes and not in its entirety…it comes off as innocent remarks but the underlying meaning is there. It seems that the anti-catholic/christian sentiment is felt everywhere however it may be disguised. Here in our province secularism is taking charge. This is my observance so it may or may not reflect the opinions of the majority

Now, I don’t believe one can discriminate at all on the basis of religion in the modern West. However, it is another thing entirely to have a state’s citizens pay money to support a show in which a Christian priest is the butt of jokes while the protagonists are the lovable fictional Muslim family - given the rest of the CBC’s actions. I in principle have no problem with the show necessarily but considering it is a state broadcaster which, to top it off, refuses to have national Catholic commentators like Michael Coren ever appear on the channel, shows to some extent what certain elites consider of Catholicism or Christianity. Michael Coren in Canada has stated as much. He draws large TV audiences for his show and yet can’t even get one invite on any CBC newspanel. Catholicism is the biggest denomination in Canada and yet all our taxpayers’ money can’t even go to having one half-decent representation or voice for Catholicism. Go figure.

Now, just to end off, I am apologizing now if I have offended anyone because I note this thread for some reason appears unpredictable.

I am strictly defending the place of Christianity in the West (so it doesn’t recede further) and bemoaning what I see as the paganization of culture. If I am wrong in some point, I will cede the point. God Bless.

Your views are shared by many my friend. It is obvious that history tends to repeat itself. Maybe we are headed for a world full of hedonism. Though I am not the consumate pessimist, I do believe in God’s Mercy and that there are devout, noble human beings. I must confess and say that with my experience in teaching, I worry about the future of the children. God Bless.

 

[Gottle_of_Geer]

Could it be that the paganisation of the western culture is due to the fact that christians are so divided and have made a mockery of religion?

​

That perhaps atheism and human reason are creating the division even more so? The fact is do humans need the God of Judeo-Christian and of Islam? This is not my opinion. I definitely need God and my Lord.

Answer: no, they do not ! Good question though ​

It seems that Satan’s purpose from the beginning was to supplant God and when he couldn’t entirely make the human race succumb to him, he tries to obliterate the name of God completely. It is most unfortunate and distressing because people don’t know what awaits them that don’t believe. I could only hope and pray.

As for those who believe, whether they be jews, christians or moslems, we should not forget the name of God. Furthermore, to my brethen in Christ, I would hope that we work our way to reconciliation despite our differences.

God Bless

Reconciliation & Christians are like oil & water - they don’t mix.​

 

[KyivAndrew]

Thank you for your thoughts Humble Maid. On Little Mosque I am going also by commercials which always seem to showcase the bumbling priest though haven’t watched fully. I guess the point really is when was the last time our National Broadcaster ever put on a show, sitcom, doc.,etc. dealing with Catholicism in a positive light (they have portrayed any and all bad problems, no hesitations). Michael Enright, a CBC radio Broadcaster, gets to call the Catholic Church “the greatest criminal organization” and no repercussions. Had he spoken of another faith, the CBC would have long kicked him out. As Michael Coren pointed out in the halls of the CBC Christianity is shunned. Fine, but why use Christians’ taxpayers money?

As for the youth too, I think it must be acknowledged there has been a vulgarization of culture and, unless one is morally apathetic, this does not bode necessarily well for the future.

And apart from religious apathy, there certainly is also a condescension one encounters in talking of faith in the West. I remember one English journalist I think asking Tony Blair in all smug seriousness whether he ever prayed with George W. Bush. Now that type of snide question shows more of what the media culture thinks of Christianity (Blair is trying Catholicism) than it shows any sort of reasonableness. What would have happened if Tony Blair had taken Christ’s remark that one is not to be ashamed of Him and said: “No, I don’t pray with the Cowboy but my Christian faith is an important factor in my life.” What? Would all the wags have a go at him for this irrational archaic faith?

Surely it remains true that much of the West’s movers and shakers find the whole idea of religious seriousness in Christianity to be childish.

 

[survive]

Michael Enright, a CBC radio Broadcaster, gets to call the Catholic Church “the greatest criminal organization” and no repercussions. Had he spoken of another faith, the CBC would have long kicked him out. As Michael Coren pointed out in the halls of the CBC Christianity is shunned. Fine, but why use Christians’ taxpayers money?

That’s just how it is on so many cable channels based here in the USA, which is supposedly such a Christian country. And on the ground level, it is a Christian country. But everyone’s so shy to say anything in defense of our beliefs in public. And I think all too many Christians believe the anti-Christians when they tell us that we get attacked because we annoy them or make them feel hurt or nervous by being so loud. So Christians get even more shy and silent, and we get attacked more. I don’t buy it. If our outspokenness were the reason for the secular world’s hating us, it would correlate in time and it doesn’t. Getting more reticent is not correlated with being spoken to and about fairly, respectfully and honestly.

I remember one English journalist I think asking Tony Blair in all smug seriousness whether he ever prayed with George W. Bush. Now that type of snide question shows more of what the media culture thinks of Christianity (Blair is trying Catholicism) than it shows any sort of reasonableness. What would have happened if Tony Blair had taken Christ’s remark that one is not to be ashamed of Him and said: “No, I don’t pray with the Cowboy but my Christian faith is an important factor in my life.” What? Would all the wags have a go at him for this irrational archaic faith?

It would have been a beautiful clip if Blair had said that. And the reaction would have come all right. Of course it would. But the widespread gratitude and respect would too. Just not mostly from media people.
I’ve nearly given up mainstream media, and I know lots of other people who feel the same way, because of the anti-Christian bias.