A Lutheran who likes the Theology of the Body

[Psalm89]

You don’t need my approval to know it’s good, but I am impressed. Protestants do a good job of saying “no” to their members about sexual sin, but don’t give many good alternatives or why some things are sinful in the first place.

In fact, the Catholic Church’s teaching on marriage, birth control, sexuality etc. is the only complete and internally consistent system of Christian theology I have read on the subjects.

Recently a Baptist friend and I had a conversation about divorce. We both agreed that it was wrong to divorce except in the case of infidelity, but what happens to people who remarry when it isn’t the case? Aren’t they committing adultery from that moment on? The Catholic Church says yes, and has the means to deal with the problem. The Protestant, from what I have seen doesn’t. My father is a retired Lutheran minister and this issue came up at times. He would comment on the dilemma of marrying people for the 2nd or 3rd time when he knew for a fact that the previous divorces had nothing to do with infidelity. The solution typically is to accept that the person getting married for a second time is truly repentant about their first marriage failing. While I agree that their sins are forgiven, I have to think that the second marriage is committing adultery. So why not push the issue? The pews would empty. Find me a Protestant church who refuses to accept 2nd marriages are legit and denies people communion and you will find a little bitty church if it exists at all. The Protestant will simply go elsewhere until they find a Church that lets them “get away with it.”

Now before those bad ol’ Protestants are lined up on a wall and shot for doing this—I bet some Catholic parishes let a lot of this stuff slide as well. That being said, from what I have read a better solution is found on paper within the Catholic Church.

 

[mercygate]

Psalm89:

I bet some Catholic parishes let a lot of this stuff slide as well. That being said, from what I have read a better solution is found on paper within the Catholic Church.

You’re right, and the Pope has asked Bishops to tighten up on the annulment business. But your comment about “solutions on paper” is why I’m Catholic. The Catholic Church **has **its positions on the record. No matter how horrible the Church can be, how scandalous, how desperate, nobody up top is saying: “it’s OK.”

The denomination I was in for 40 years was creating an entire universe of “theologies” based on anything but Scripture, Tradition, and reason. “Experience” had become the deciding force. I ask you.

 

[jimmy]

Psalm89:

You don’t need my approval to know it’s good, but I am impressed. Protestants do a good job of saying “no” to their members about sexual sin, but don’t give many good alternatives or why some things are sinful in the first place.

In fact, the Catholic Church’s teaching on marriage, birth control, sexuality etc. is the only complete and internally consistent system of Christian theology I have read on the subjects.

Recently a Baptist friend and I had a conversation about divorce. We both agreed that it was wrong to divorce except in the case of infidelity, but what happens to people who remarry when it isn’t the case? Aren’t they committing adultery from that moment on? The Catholic Church says yes, and has the means to deal with the problem. The Protestant, from what I have seen doesn’t. My father is a retired Lutheran minister and this issue came up at times. He would comment on the dilemma of marrying people for the 2nd or 3rd time when he knew for a fact that the previous divorces had nothing to do with infidelity. The solution typically is to accept that the person getting married for a second time is truly repentant about their first marriage failing. While I agree that their sins are forgiven, I have to think that the second marriage is committing adultery. So why not push the issue? The pews would empty. Find me a Protestant church who refuses to accept 2nd marriages are legit and denies people communion and you will find a little bitty church if it exists at all. The Protestant will simply go elsewhere until they find a Church that lets them “get away with it.”

Now before those bad ol’ Protestants are lined up on a wall and shot for doing this—I bet some Catholic parishes let a lot of this stuff slide as well. That being said, from what I have read a better solution is found on paper within the Catholic Church.

There are some bishops that have been very lax when deciding to allow an anulment. That does not reflect the teaching of the Church though. Like you said the teachings are written down on paper so that everyone can see them. When a bishop goes against the teachings, that does not mean the teachings have been changed.

You have to declare that divorce is bad and that remarriage is adultery. When someone divorces and remarries it is not like they are commiting a sin that is in an instant. It is a sin that is a lifestyle. They are living there lives in sin. People must be aware of what they are doing.

 

[gardenswithkids]

Thank you for taking time to study the Theology of the Body and for sharing your thoughts with us.

My husband was Lutheran, (Let me clarify–he’s still my husband, but now he’s Catholic.) A Lutheran pastor once told me Catholics make the best Lutherans. And the way I see it, former Lutherans make some of the best Catholics! I don’t mean to push, but please keep studying the Catholic Church teachings.

 

[Jay74]

I agree, it is facinating and a marital blessing. I went to a Baptist High School, have always considerd myself a non-denomintional christian, and I’m married to a Catholic. Fact of the matter is, people who are considered outside of one group often have good ideas and make good points. That’s why i read karl’s e-letter and participate in this site. It’s also why i’m still dear friends with the evangelicals who initially told me who Jesus was.

I agree with you, this is something the Catholic Church had right. With all the hypersensitivity in many other churches about sexual issues, many people fail to see what a true gift our sexuality is within the covenent of marriage.

 

[Maccabees]

Luther himself was against birth control and abortion how some Lutheran Denoms look away at such things would horrify Luther.

 

[puzzleannie]

Maccabees:

Luther himself was against birth control and abortion how some Lutheran Denoms look away at such things would horrify Luther.

for the record, according to the Priests for Life site with the agenda of activities this weekend for the March for Life in Washington, the Lutherans have a service and gathering scheduled at a Lutheran church by Lutherans for Life.

 

[Maccabees]

puzzleannie:

for the record, according to the Priests for Life site with the agenda of activities this weekend for the March for Life in Washington, the Lutherans have a service and gathering scheduled at a Lutheran church by Lutherans for Life.

Good for them. Probably the LMCS synod as the largest Lutrheran Branch ECLA had become indifferent to life issues in recent years.
(I am sure there are exceptions but as a general rule this is true)

 

[matthew1624]

Psalm89:

You don’t need my approval to know it’s good, but I am impressed. Protestants do a good job of saying “no” to their members about sexual sin, but don’t give many good alternatives or why some things are sinful in the first place.

I just picked the book up from the local library. I’ve heard many great things about it.

Recently a Baptist friend and I had a conversation about divorce. We both agreed that it was wrong to divorce except in the case of infidelity, but what happens to people who remarry when it isn’t the case?

It’s interesting to note that when the Pharisees questioned Jesus about marriage and divorce (Matthew 19:1-9) that he doesn’t point to the Mosaic law which allowed divorce and remarriage - (Deutoronomy] but he goes way back to the beginning Gen 2:24 which was Gods plan for marriage. That the two are no longer two but one, therefore no man can tear apart. Another passage would be Malachi 2:16 which states that God hates divorce.

Find me a Protestant church who refuses to accept 2nd marriages are legit and denies people communion and you will find a little bitty church if it exists at all. The Protestant will simply go elsewhere until they find a Church that lets them “get away with it.”

I call that a faith of convenience and believe that moral reasons account for many leaving the church simply due to what you have just described. “Oh, the Catholic church says I can’t do that?”, “Well then, I’ll just find me a church that does!”

Thanks for your post…God Bless…

 

[caroljm36]

Yep, that’s what I like about the Church–lotta stuff! I mean we have Church fathers, encyclicals, catechisms, saints, pastors, bishops and popes to help us. And special prayers…Lotta “there” there! I just don’t understand, with 2000 years gone by now, why someone would want to limit everything strictly to Scripture, and basically write off the contributions of Augustine, Aquinas, JPII and the like. It’s a very well developed and an *intellectual *as well as a spiritual faith IMHO.

 

[Psalm89]

Last Sunday was Life Sunday

lutheransforlife.org/

The LCMS is staunchly pro-life/family

The ELCA is falling further and further from the truth, and LCMS churches have been picking up some of their members over the last few years.

Some ELCA churchers are very good still, but they are in short supply. On paper the LCMS and ELCA are very similar, but in practice they aren’t. (Ordination of women, gay clergy, other “progressive” ideas…)

 

[TheBigRusch]

I’m another Lutheran who likes this teaching quite a bit. I am actually a Youth Minister and taught it (albeit “Lutheranized”) to my teens because I was so sick of the total lack of depth that any other literature or curriculum has on the subject. The thing that is overall lacking in theology is a POSITIVE picture of sexuality in marriage. Thanks JPII for this contribution.