A major problem.

[Namesake]

One, if not the major problem I have as a Protestant is listening to Catholics claim that the RCC is the one true church founded by Jesus.

Now I understand that Catholics are taught this idea, but why can’t Catholics understand how abrasive that is?

Catholics are so exclusionary that some people get turned off by that attitude.

Can Catholics understand that Protestants really do not, and never would want to believe that the RCC is the one true church.

And Catholics often make comments about the errors that Protestants make, but I see very few times when Catholics make comments about errors that Catholics make.

It’s the issue of pride. For the vast majority of Protestants there is no issue at all about which church is true. The issue is all about Christianity for Protestants, for the most part.

As an example, I have never heard a Protestant say they are a devout Baptist. I hear from Catholics very often that they are devout Catholics. Protestants are much more likely to say they are devout Christians.

There is a lot of difference.

 

[jmcrae]

One, if not the major problem I have as a Protestant is listening to Catholics claim that the RCC is the one true church founded by Jesus.

This is a historical fact. If anything, it should call us to greater holiness, rather than pride.

Can Catholics understand that Protestants really do not, and never would want to believe that the RCC is the one true church.

Why should you want to deny reality? Shouldn’t our beliefs be based on what is actually true, rather than on what we would prefer?

 

[Namesake]

This is a historical fact. If anything, it should call us to greater holiness, rather than pride.

Why should you want to deny reality? Shouldn’t our beliefs be based on what is actually true, rather than on what we would prefer?

But people of good faith with quite rational minds and lots of information do disagree with what you claim is historical fact.

BTW, I defy you to show an historical document that proves your claim.

 

[Other_Eric]

It seems to me that Christ obviously came to found at least one Church. The Catholic’s position that it is their own church is reasonable, to say the least. One would not expect oneself to profess faith in a church other than the one founded by Christ, if one is to believe in Him at all.

As far as Catholics not taking other Catholics to task on errors they might make, I have to wonder how long it is that you have been here on the forums. There is no shortage of intra-Catholic admonition here.

 

[Namesake]

It seems to me that Christ obviously came to found at least one Church. The Catholic’s position that it is their own church is reasonable, to say the least. One would not expect oneself to profess faith in a church other than the one founded by Christ, if one is to believe in Him at all.

As far as Catholics not taking other Catholics to task on errors they might make, I have to wonder how long it is that you have been here on the forums. There is no shortage of intra-Catholic admonition here.

Let me try to be more clear. It seems to me that Catholics tend to get pretty nasty with Protestants compared to how Catholics rebuke Catholics. Maybe it’s just me.

 

[water]

Truth hurts.

 

[Namesake]

It seems to me that Christ obviously came to found at least one Church. The Catholic’s position that it is their own church is reasonable, to say the least. One would not expect oneself to profess faith in a church other than the one founded by Christ, if one is to believe in Him at all.

As a Protestant I am quite comfortable regarding different churches with great respect. While I might not agree with the way they teach, I would never be so disrespectful as to tell their members that they are in error, or worse.

Catholics believe they are the correct Christians and everyone else is wrong. Protestants aren’t nearly that self centered.

That is a major problem for me. Every time I hear a Catholic proclaim that they are right and Protestants are wrong it’s a huge turn off. I have been hearing that since I was a little kid and it was a turn off then. Such ridiculous arrogance.

 

[Other_Eric]

Let me try to be more clear. It seems to me that Catholics tend to get pretty nasty with Protestants compared to how Catholics rebuke Catholics. Maybe it’s just me.

I again direct your attention to some of the threads on this forum. While Protestants may at times have a few unpleasant spats with a Catholic or two, it is nothing compared to the sort of full-scale ranting that can go on between Catholics. Anyone familiar with the spirited arguments between St. Augustine and St. Jerome can attest to this.

 

[Namesake]

Truth hurts.

For the most part a person must be Catholic to believe that the RCC represents truth. I certainly do not believe that the RCC represents truth and it is an insult for Catholics to say that to Protestants.

 

[Namesake]

I again direct your attention to some of the threads on this forum. While Protestants may at times have a few unpleasant spats with a Catholic or two, it is nothing compared to the sort of full-scale ranting that can go on between Catholics. Anyone familiar with the spirited arguments between St. Augustine and St. Jerome can attest to this.

Do you mean to say that Catholics don’t agree on Catholicism? How could that be?

 

[water]

For the most part a person must be Catholic to believe that the RCC represents truth. I certainly do not believe that the RCC represents truth and it is an insult for Catholics to say that to Protestants.

I had actually logged off and about to leave my workplace but I thought it would be fair to you for me to write a bit more.

It would be prideful explaining the truth to others in a way that we don’t show respect to others. Love is the key.

However, it is also prideful for the listeners who have a chance to know the truth but show their ignorance on their parts.

Jesus came to earth telling the truth and many found this an insult.

It takes great humility in accepting the truth.

Time for me to go home now, nameshake.
God bless.

 

[Freshman88]

One, if not the major problem I have as a Protestant is listening to Catholics claim that the RCC is the one true church founded by Jesus.

Being outside the one true Church is never a good position to be in - of course I can see why it makes some people upset.

Now I understand that Catholics are taught this idea, but why can’t Catholics understand how abrasive that is?

Perhaps the truth is abrasive.

Catholics are so exclusionary that some people get turned off by that attitude.

None sense! The Catholic Church welcomes all sinners! We are completely inclusive.

Can Catholics understand that Protestants really do not, and never would want to believe that the RCC is the one true church.

Well, that’s why they are protestants. If they did believe that the RCC is the one true Church, I suspect that they wouldn’t be protestants.

And Catholics often make comments about the errors that Protestants make, but I see very few times when Catholics make comments about errors that Catholics make.

The Church is infallible - it’s teachings are without error. The Roman Catholic Church alone can claim this because she alone has the fullest expression of the Truth.

It’s the issue of pride. For the vast majority of Protestants there is no issue at all about which church is true. The issue is all about Christianity for Protestants, for the most part.

Just how exactly is it an issue of pride?

You make it sound like there is a distinction between Christianity and the Church. The Catholic Church is Christianity and Christianity in it’s most proper form.

As an example, I have never heard a Protestant say they are a devout Baptist. I hear from Catholics very often that they are devout Catholics. Protestants are much more likely to say they are devout Christians.

A Catholic is a Christian. Thus you can use the terms interchangeably depending on the context.

There is a lot of difference.

There is!

 

[Namesake]

Being outside the one true Church is never a good position to be in - of course I can see why it makes some people upset.

Perhaps the truth is abrasive.

None sense! The Catholic Church welcomes all sinners! We are completely inclusive.

Well, that’s why they are protestants. If they did believe that the RCC is the one true Church, I suspect that they wouldn’t be protestants.

The Church is infallible - it’s teachings are without error. The Roman Catholic Church alone can claim this because she alone has the fullest expression of the Truth.

Just how exactly is it an issue of pride?

You make it sound like there is a distinction between Christianity and the Church. The Catholic Church is Christianity and Christianity in it’s most proper form.

A Catholic is a Christian. Thus you can use the terms interchangeably depending on the context.

There is!

You answer in a way that is out of context, therefore your comments are in my opinion, invalid. Sorry.

 

[Freshman88]

Catholics believe they are the correct Christians and everyone else is wrong. Protestants aren’t nearly that self centered.

Self-centered?I should hope the Church is at the centre of attention!

That is a major problem for me. Every time I hear a Catholic proclaim that they are right and Protestants are wrong it’s a huge turn off. I have been hearing that since I was a little kid and it was a turn off then. Such ridiculous arrogance.

It isn’t ridiculous nor is it arrogant. Again, it is a matter of fact for us.

What would you prefer?
A) we don’t mention this belief for the sake of charity. Though it would be a weird kind of charity to keep Christ’s one true Church a secret.

B) We change our beliefs and cease to be Catholic.

 

[Other_Eric]

As a Protestant I am quite comfortable regarding different churches with great respect. While I might not agree with the way they teach, I would never be so disrespectful as to tell their members that they are in error, or worse.

Catholics believe they are the correct Christians and everyone else is wrong. Protestants aren’t nearly that self centered.

That is a major problem for me. Every time I hear a Catholic proclaim that they are right and Protestants are wrong it’s a huge turn off. I have been hearing that since I was a little kid and it was a turn off then. Such ridiculous arrogance.

If you do not agree with the way a particular church teaches, you might consider why that is. Obviously, it can only be because you believe them to be in error, at least to some degree. After all, if you thought that this other church had got it right, you would be a member, wouldn’t you?

Of course, you might reply that since you refrain from pointing out such error to the members of that church that you avoid that distasteful sort of arrogance that turns you off to Catholics so. Yet, here we are dealing with issues that involve the eternal fate of those souls you implicitly believe to be in error. Does it really constitute arrogance to point out to those people the error that could very well imperil them?

In the end, someone has to be right and the other must be wrong. This statement is axiomatic and does not turn on the feelings one might harbor towards it. The question then becomes deciding who it is that has it right and who has it wrong. Once the answer is found, it would be a deplorable lapse of Christian charity to keep this sort of salvific information to oneself.

 

[Namesake]

Self-centered?I should hope the Church is at the centre of attention!

For Protestants Christ is the center and the church does not equal Christ.

It isn’t ridiculous nor is it arrogant. Again, it is a matter of fact for us.

Now that is a little better. the “for us”. That softens it a bit, maybe just enough because it doesn’t sound so much like you absolutely know the truth regardless of what anyone else thinks.

What would you prefer?
A) we don’t mention this belief for the sake of charity. Though it would be a weird kind of charity to keep Christ’s one true Church a secret.

B) We change our beliefs and cease to be Catholic.

Not at all. I think you should believe as you wish, until you start believing that you are always right and Protestants are always wrong. That is a fundamental and for me a fatal flaw of the RCC. Catholics are very pushy people, some are.

 

[Other_Eric]

Do you mean to say that Catholics don’t agree on Catholicism? How could that be?

Since Christians cannot agree upon Christ, even for having the same Bible, why should it be that Catholics, who possess many volumes worth of Tradition, commentary by the Church Doctors, encyclicals and council promulgations should be any better at getting it right?

 

[Namesake]

I

In the end, someone has to be right and the other must be wrong. This statement is axiomatic and does not turn on the feelings one might harbor towards it. The question then becomes deciding who it is that has it right and who has it wrong. Once the answer is found, it would be a deplorable lapse of Christian charity to keep this sort of salvific information to oneself.

That is true in science, but not so much in religion. It is not axiomatic in religion that there is a right and wrong answer. You might believe it, but that doesn’t constitute proof of correctness. But it does constitute the reality of your belief, and I would never try to convince a person that what they believe is wrong. Science deals with that differently of course. Science isn’t about belief, it’s about truth.

Maybe that’s where I am having a problem with the RCC. The RCC claims to know the real truth. I don’t believe that any religion knows the real truth because the very definition of religion includes belief and not truth, in my understanding. BTW, I am a scientist so be careful of going there unless you have considerable credentials in science.

 

[Namesake]

Since Christians cannot agree upon Christ, even for having the same Bible, why should it be that Catholics, who possess many volumes worth of Tradition, commentary by the Church Doctors, encyclicals and council promulgations should be any better at getting it right?

I thought Catholics had a handle on the one true church? I thought they had the truth nailed down? No?

 

[rpp]

As an example, I have never heard a Protestant say they are a devout Baptist. I hear from Catholics very often that they are devout Catholics. Protestants are much more likely to say they are devout Christians.

Actually, I have seen many people describe themselves as “Devout (denomination)”.

Here is an example right here of non-Catholics using such description.

forums.catholic-questions.org/showpost.php?p=3203104&postcount=1

Remember, originally, there was only one Church. It was because of the actions of men at two different points in history, did the Church splinter.

God would not want chaos. God is not a God of confusion. Having only one Church makes sense. After all, there is only one Jewish religion.