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Isaiah45_9
Guest
You mean Spirit?
Doesn’t the mind reside in the brain? After all, is not our mind affected with certain physical injuries?
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Doesn’t the mind reside in the brain? After all, is not our mind affected with certain physical injuries?
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Bruincello
Guest
What about John Edward the psychic, he can do it. . .
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GEddie
Guest
Our mind uses the brain for functioning, but it is not part of the brain.
The mind consists of thoughts, memories, etc; the brain, of cells, blood vessels, etc. one is not found in the other.
Just as we need our eyes for seeing, but it is the mind that sees.
ICXC NIKA
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Dorothy
Guest
It’s possible he has a familiar spirit, (evil) or is a total phony who knows how to work a crowd. A few years ago I caught a few minutes of what he was doing with an audience on the sci fi channel, and it had nothing to do with authentic Christian doctrine.
Many years ago someone by the name of Jean Dixon considered herself a devout Catholic and psychic. The things she said to people were about sad circumstances that could happen to them,(plane crashes, car accidents) if they would find their perfect partner to marry, etc. Not too long after that she was doing automatic writing.
When will we listen? The bible tells us not to seek fortune tellers, etc.
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Isaiah45_9
Guest
Be kind to explain the difference, please. This is a subject of great interest to me (Mind and Spirit) and I am still a novice.
I understand the essential separation between mind and body - it is the mind who uses the body. Mind being the principal and the body the instrument. However, certain injuries in certain quadrants of the brain will affect how the mind is able to use the body. This break in communication should present a link, a physical one nonetheless, that can interrupt the mind’s dominance over the body - or the body’s ability to hinder mind’s instructions.
How are spirit and mind related to each other? I understand that mind is an aspect of spirit?
Thanks,
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GEddie
Guest
As I understand it, yes. The mind is not the human spirit or soul, but a dimension thereof.
Hebrew recognizes three levels of the human soul, the highest of which (Neshamah) is roughly synonymous with the “mind” as we understand it.
In French, which until recent times had no word for mind, the word “esprit” (spirit) or “ame” (soul) was used to translate mind. They are inseparable.
We have similar usage even in English, which is why we say psychology (study of the soul) rather than the literal noology (study of the mind).
But to have bodily experiences and memories requires the brain, both to move body, and to register body’s perceptions. Head injuries and brain diseases can and will disturb these functions. But the mind remains, even if fully in abeyance, because the dimensions of the mind are not physical.
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Xuan
Guest
Hi Jaberwocky,
The title of the thread is contrary to Church teaching. The following are dogmas of the Church:
God, our Creator and Lord, can be known with certainty, by the natural light of reason from created things. (De fide.)
The existence of God can be proved by means of causality. (Sent. fidei proxima.)
What can be more Transcendent than God?
Xuan
The title of the thread is contrary to Church teaching. The following are dogmas of the Church:
God, our Creator and Lord, can be known with certainty, by the natural light of reason from created things. (De fide.)
The existence of God can be proved by means of causality. (Sent. fidei proxima.)
What can be more Transcendent than God?
Xuan
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Bruincello
Guest
Some people think that the mind is the brain or some other part or function of the body, but this is incorrect. The brain is a physical object that can be seen with the eyes and that can be photographed or operated on in surgery.
The mind, on the other hand, is not a physical object. It cannot be seen with the eyes, nor can it be photographed or repaired by surgery. The brain, therefore, is not the mind but simply part of the body.
*mind is the set of cognitivefaculties that enables consciousness, perception, thinking, judgement, and memory¡ªa characteristic of humans, but which also may apply to other life forms.
*Whatever its relation to the physical body it is generally agreed that mind is that which enables a being to have subjective awareness and intentionality towards their environment, to perceiveand respond to stimuli with some kind of agency, and to have consciousness, including thinking and feeling.
**The Spirit on the other hand is The driving Force that powers up human beings, it is complete and independent of the brain and personal mind set it is purely the essence of God in humans it is so polite man tend to ignor when it speaks through conscience. . And it is situated in the soul, in the heart, IT IS THAT ELECTRIC FORCE THAT POWERS MAN’S HEART to the rest of the body. .
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jadamo
Guest
Bhahahahaha! Thanks, SO true!!! We can do nothing GOOD apart from GodFixed
I am fairly certain that I am able and capable to sin all by myself
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Isaiah45_9
Guest
I’m confused here. It would add a 3rd aspect to Flesh and Spirit then, wouldn’t it?
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Isaiah45_9
Guest
Bhahahahaha! Thanks, SO true!!! We can do nothing GOOD apart from God
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GEddie
Guest
Not really. Flesh and Spirit are distinct, but each requires the other, and each has its own dimensions.
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Jaberwocky
Guest
This is a misunderstanding. One cannot “prove” in the sense of “know” God through these proofs. For that you need Divine Revelation.
What is contrary to Catholic doctrine is Fideism i.e. that it is reasonable to accept something as Divine Revelation purely out of faith when there is no actual reason. In other words, to assent to something as being from God without making sure through reason that it is indeed reasonable to think it is from God is contrary to Catholic teaching.
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Servant19
Guest
GEddie, you are music to my ears
(very astute reflections for all to ponder on, thankyou!)
If I may quote Abdu’l-Baha in regards to the relationship between mind, body and spirit:
*"It has been before explained that spirit is universally divided into five categories: the vegetable spirit, the animal spirit, the human spirit, the spirit of faith, and the Holy Spirit.
The vegetable spirit is the power of growth which is brought about in the seed through the influence of other existences.
The animal spirit is the power of all the senses, which is realized from the composition and mingling of elements; when this composition decomposes, the power also perishes and becomes annihilated. It may be likened to this lamp: when the oil, wick and fire are combined, it is lighted; and when this combination is dissolved—that is to say, when the combined parts are separated from one another—the lamp also is extinguished.
The human spirit which distinguishes man from the animal is the rational soul, and these two names—the human spirit and the rational soul—designate one thing. This spirit, which in the terminology of the philosophers is the rational soul, embraces all beings, and as far as human ability permits discovers the realities of things and becomes cognizant of their peculiarities and effects, and of the qualities and properties of beings. But the human spirit, unless assisted by the spirit of faith, does not become acquainted with the divine secrets and the heavenly realities. It is like a mirror which, although clear, polished and brilliant, is still in need of light. Until a ray of the sun reflects upon it, it cannot discover the heavenly secrets.
But the mind is the power of the human spirit. Spirit is the lamp; mind is the light which shines from the lamp. Spirit is the tree, and the mind is the fruit. Mind is the perfection of the spirit and is its essential quality, as the sun’s rays are the essential necessity of the sun. "*
- Some Answered Questions no.55
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Servant19
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Jaberwocky
Guest
Well, lets not say anything yet than the following.Absolutely
So, how would you know?
(please don’t say miracles)
(a) Miracles that have a historical reliability that it did take place do prove that a person is indeed credible source of the beyond
Can we agree on that as well?
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Servant19
Guest
Nope. Two reasons.
- Any Tom, Dick or Harry can carry out a miracle. Ask Appolonius of Tiana or Honi the circle worker. Are they a credible source of the beyond too?
- What’s a miracle today, is tomorrow’s established science. The very definition of the word “supernatural” is “something that has not yet been explained by science yet occurs in the natural world”…if it occurs in the natural world, then the exploratory resource for all things natural, which is science, will eventually provide explanation for it
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Contarini
Guest
Your “Transcendent” doesn’t seem genuinely transcendent to me. It just seems like an alien world we happen not to have access to.
If the Transcendent is truly transcendent, then there is no possibility of a being simply transitioning from one to the other and giving us information about the Transcendent. In a genuinely “Transcendent world,” what it means to be a being at all might well be radically different, and certainly the reality of the Transcendent would not be translatable into our language. That, to my mind, is what "transcendent means. Otherwise your premises fail in the first place.
Hence, I think your entire argument is incoherent. Your model of the Incarnation is closer to pagan models of incarnate deities, who simply descend from a higher realm to a lower one, or to the Mormon understanding of God as a being we can’t understand now but will when we have grown up and become His equals.
Please forgive my strong language. I’m putting it strongly because I know you care deeply about being an orthodox Christian and providing a rational account for the Christian faith, and I’m trying to “shock” you into looking at the possibility that your rationalistic approach undercuts the very orthodoxy you wish to defend.
Edwin
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Jaberwocky
Guest
I think you misunderstand. The issue is not whether they claim they did miracles but given that they ACTUALLY DID MIRACLES.
The two individuals you listed have no credible historical sources to think the events ever happened.
So is God a scientific entity then? Is it true to say that in your thinking, one day we will find God through Science? It just hasn’t gotten there yet?
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Jaberwocky
Guest
No worries at all Edwin.
The Transcendent is indeed an alien world. We do not know what exists in there or the nature of beings that reside in that world.
All that my argument is claiming is that for one to even consider a person as being able to know the Transcendent therefore requires them to be from the Transcendent. For us to then be convinced that they are indeed from the Transcendent, they must produce us with some form of act that shows they capability over this world (or that they are not bound by this world).
Now is it possible that there are Transcendent beings that cannot bend the rules of this world? Yes, but if these are the only being that existed, we cannot ever know the Transcendent and frankly it is not worth our time i.e. A being that cannot have any power over this world wouldn’t be that important for our consideration anyway. We might as well spend the time to achieve immortality on earth.
As for whether what I said violates Christianity, it does not in the sense that everything said is reasonable for anyone who starts without Christianity. We cannot speak of an incarnation because that is a fact of FAITH. It is not an apriori discovered fact before assent but a fact that is accepted after assent.
So nothing here violates the Christian sentiments. In fact, everything I said will lie outside the boundaries of Christian doctrine since it deals with coming to know whether Christianity or any other religion is true/worthy of assent.
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