A muslim example of an ideal mother

[Future_Prodigy]

i am from canada so your point falls on deaf ears! sorry!

 

[BH_Manners]

You people are such hippocrites… BH stupid messagig them… your only giving into their american propaganda fed ignorance!

These people mean well. They are NOT my enemies.

 

[Future_Prodigy]

Yeah, they mean well sure but these sort of attitudes and beleifs have caused diasters in the past!!!

 

[Eden]

I do not see the problem with the corelatrion at all! You are assuming these radicals are representative of a whole… so, so am i! You ignored my other part.

You can be from Canada and understand that the KKK is a club, not a religion. For this reason, comparing the KKK to the mother who became a martyr for Islam is not a legitimate comparison.

 

[Future_Prodigy]

You are refering to the inital post i am refering to the posts there after and the association fo these sorts of fanactics with the whole of Islam, implyin it is a religion of hate and violence… and that rationale is exactly what i am doing

 

[Eden]

Yeah, they mean well sure but these sort of attitudes and beleifs have caused diasters in the past!!!

Which attitudes are you referring to? The attitude that blowing yourself up and attempting to take as many people with you in the name of God is evil? And the attitude that writing songs for children’s television shows that refer to the blood of martyrs as having a “sweet fragrance” is disturbing?

 

[Eden]

You are refering to the inital post i am refering to the posts there after and the association fo these sorts of fanactics with the whole of Islam, implyin it is a religion of hate and violence… and that rationale is exactly what i am doing

Could you please use the quote function to avoid confusion?

 

[Future_Prodigy]

Eden do you really want me to pull out of the book of all the RCs past SINS of hatred, genoicde and oppression? I would take those generalizations as being offensive and i assume so would you.

 

[Future_Prodigy]

lol sorry :S i often forget about the quote function

 

[BH_Manners]

This would be a reference to* takkiya*.
Provisions for lying in Islam

Most Muslims are familiar with the principles of Islam that will justify lying in situations where they sense the need to do so. Among these are:

• War is deception.
• The necessities justify the forbidden.
• If faced by two evils, choose the lesser of the two.
  These principles are derived from passages found in the Quran and the Hadith.

This article “Lying in Islam” addresses the issue more thoroughly:

islamreview.com/articles/lying.shtml

First off, the part of the qoute from the hadith saying that the Prophet said lying was okay was put in (…) so I wonder if this was a translator adding to it or not.

Second, not all Muslims accept the hadith as binding religiously speaking.

Three, none of the qoutes from the Holy Quran of God says it is okay to lie. All it is saying is that God will forgive rash oaths and if, under fear of persecution, a person apostasizes that person can be forgiven. It isn’t actually saying to lie.

 

[Eden]

Eden do you really want me to pull out of the book of all the RCs past SINS of hatred, genoicde and oppression? I would take those generalizations as being offensive and i assume so would you.

If you’d like to, please start a new thread. The topic here is not the Catholic Church.

 

[Eden]

First off, the part of the qoute from the hadith saying that the Prophet said lying was okay was put in (…) so I wonder if this was a translator adding to it or not.

Second, not all Muslims accept the hadith as binding religiously speaking.

Three, none of the qoutes from the Holy Quran of God says it is okay to lie. All it is saying is that God will forgive rash oaths and if, under fear of persecution, a person apostasizes that person can be forgiven. It isn’t actually saying to lie.

Another Muslim on this forum, from Egypt, told us that only one sect uses the term takkiya, but he acknowleged that it’s a real teaching of Islam.

 

[Montalban]

First off, the part of the qoute from the hadith saying that the Prophet said lying was okay was put in (…) so I wonder if this was a translator adding to it or not.

He allowed someone to lie, in order to murder another…

Volume 5, Book 59, Number 369:

Narrated Jabir bin 'Abdullah:

Allah’s Apostle said, “Who is willing to kill Ka’b bin Al-Ashraf who has hurt Allah and His Apostle?” Thereupon Muhammad bin Maslama got up saying, “O Allah’s Apostle! Would you like that I kill him?” The Prophet said, “Yes,” Muhammad bin Maslama said, "Then allow me to say a (false) thing (i.e. to deceive Kab). "The Prophet said, “You may say it.” Then Muhammad bin Maslama went to Kab and said, “That man (i.e. Muhammad demands Sadaqa (i.e. Zakat) from us, and he has troubled us, and I have come to borrow something from you.” On that, Kab said, “By Allah, you will get tired of him!” Muhammad bin Maslama said, “Now as we have followed him, we do not want to leave him unless and until we see how his end is going to be. Now we want you to lend us a camel load or two of food.” (Some difference between narrators about a camel load or two.) Kab said, “Yes, (I will lend you), but you should mortgage something to me.” Muhammad bin Mas-lama and his companion said, “What do you want?” Ka’b replied, “Mortgage your women to me.” They said, “How can we mortgage our women to you and you are the most handsome of the 'Arabs?” Ka’b said, “Then mortgage your sons to me.” They said, “How can we mortgage our sons to you? Later they would be abused by the people’s saying that so-and-so has been mortgaged for a camel load of food. That would cause us great disgrace, but we will mortgage our arms to you.” Muhammad bin Maslama and his companion promised Kab that Muhammad would return to him. He came to Kab at night along with Kab’s foster brother, Abu Na’ila. Kab invited them to come into his fort, and then he went down to them. His wife asked him, “Where are you going at this time?” Kab replied, “None but Muhammad bin Maslama and my (foster) brother Abu Na’ila have come.” His wife said, “I hear a voice as if dropping blood is from him, Ka’b said. “They are none but my brother Muhammad bin Maslama and my foster brother Abu Naila. A generous man should respond to a call at night even if invited to be killed.” Muhammad bin Maslama went with two men. (Some narrators mention the men as 'Abu bin Jabr. Al Harith bin Aus and Abbad bin Bishr). So Muhammad bin Maslama went in together with two men, and sail to them, “When Ka’b comes, I will touch his hair and smell it, and when you see that I have got hold of his head, strip him. I will let you smell his head.” Kab bin Al-Ashraf came down to them wrapped in his clothes, and diffusing perfume. Muhammad bin Maslama said. " have never smelt a better scent than this. Ka’b replied. “I have got the best 'Arab women who know how to use the high class of perfume.” Muhammad bin Maslama requested Ka’b “Will you allow me to smell your head?” Ka’b said, “Yes.” Muhammad smelt it and made his companions smell it as well. Then he requested Ka’b again, “Will you let me (smell your head)?” Ka’b said, “Yes.” When Muhammad got a strong hold of him, he said (to his companions), “Get at him!” So they killed him and went to the Prophet and informed him. (Abu Rafi) was killed after Ka’b bin Al-Ashraf.”
usc.edu/dept/MSA/fundamentals/hadithsunnah/bukhari/059.sbt.html#005.059.369

 

[Montalban]

You have not offended me at all and will not do so as long as while disagreeing with my religion you are personally respectful of me.

Because you do not believe my religion, I can understand that you will not respect it like I do.

The same goes for Catholicism. I have no respect for Catholicism as a religion because I believe it to be wrong, but I do have great respect for the people who believe in Catholicism. In addition I believe that lack of respect does not always entail disrespect.

Then you are the exception to the rule.

 

[godsent]

I think things are starting to get out of control,forward the clokc 5 years,where will we be in iraq,how many more killings will there be from suicide bombers,etc etc…

Im getting more and more concerned.

 

[Future_Prodigy]

it doesnt matter if its about the catholic church or not it is the same reasoning you are using so i am using it against you. Aww nvm, i give up… give into the typical american propaganda BS. I leave this thread to the masses

 

[Eden]

it doesnt matter if its about the catholic church or not it is the same reasoning you are using so i am using it against you. Aww nvm, i give up… give into the typical american propaganda BS. I leave this thread to the masses

What does the Catholic Church have to do with a suicide-bomber mother whose children were interviewed on Palestinian TV about how many Jews she killed and to recite violent poems about their mother being a “fire bomb”? I invite you, again, to start a thread about the Catholic Church and genocide. That is, of course, unless you are just using hollow accusations to sidetrack this thread.

 

[cestusdei]

I live in a small city of 30,000 people in Texas. If we ever get a mosque here you bet I will. If you like I’ll will be glad to invite the local Catholic priest over to witness it.

BH, one muslim did that in Oklahoma. They kicked him out and he received death threats. Do you condemn Hamas and Hezbullah?

 

[cestusdei]

Future P,
You seem to have bought into the terrorists propaganda. You hate us more then you do bin Laden. It’s been awhile since I have encountered a real blindly American hating ingrate Canadian. Thanks to your pc attitudes the terrorists are using your country as a base to come here and kill us. But consider this…nuclear fallout doesn’t respect borders. When they hit us again and if the wind blows north then you will suffer too.

Really it’s to bad. I had relatives who fought with the Canadians in WWII when we were on the same side against tyranny. Now Canada persecutes Christianity and tolerates islamic extremism. Ironic that you are actually helping the modern equivalent of fascists while calling us fascist for fighting them.

 

[Eden]

Future P,
You seem to have bought into the terrorists propaganda. You hate us more then you do bin Laden. It’s been awhile since I have encountered a real blindly American hating ingrate Canadian. Thanks to your pc attitudes the terrorists are using your country as a base to come here and kill us. But consider this…nuclear fallout doesn’t respect borders. When they hit us again and if the wind blows north then you will suffer too.

Really it’s to bad. I had relatives who fought with the Canadians in WWII when we were on the same side against tyranny. Now Canada persecutes Christianity and tolerates islamic extremism. Ironic that you are actually helping the modern equivalent of fascists while calling us fascist for fighting them.

Yes, but you are making the assumption that Future is not a Muslim. His style of dialogue, bringing in completely unrelated topics as a diversion from the original subject, is such a common tactic by other Muslim posters here. The lack of linear argument is also a hallmark of Muslim posts. So, it gives pause. Just thought I would bring up that possibility.