A Muslim woman lashed in Sudan for wearing trousers.

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men0wjv said:
Despite the fact that tight fitting clothes are impermissible (for men and women) in public – interestingly, despite the responsibility a person carries in this matter the sin falls on the onlooker - there is no worldly punishment for a woman who just wears trousers, which is what the point being made is. So these Sudanese people mentioned do not practice Shari’ah (since there is no evidence to support such a claim) but something else and therefore Islam cannot be blamed.
My prayers are with the poor woman and her family.
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agree
Whilst we say the Salafis are still Muslim because they don’t deny something fundamental to the religion, they are at variance with the majority in serious matters and so are of the ‘fasiqin,’ you can learn this from Al Azhar (my teacher having been there) or Al Qarawiyyin (my other teacher having been there) or the ulema in Damascus (my other teacher being there) or the classical works on heresiology; the Salafis being likened to the Khawarij. Maybe my simile was a little out since JW’s don’t qualify as Christians in a traditional sense, perhaps some puritan type protestant group may have been a better.
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i think you confused salfis with another group

Some scholars, such as Ibn Taymiyyah, have noted: “There is no criticism for the one who proclaims the madh’hab of the Salaf, who attaches himself to it and refers to it. Rather, it is obligatory to accept that from him by unanimous agreement because the way of the Salaf is nothing but the truth.”

Salafism is not considered a sect foreign to orthodox Islam , i wanted just to correct this point for you .

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Salafi
 
Sister_Amy said:
Pants don’t necessarily mean that one is dressing like the other (in a lot of cultures, not even men would wear pants), and usually women’s clothes, even pants, are tailored differently.
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Yes they are tailored to show the form of a womans legs, as opposed to mens trousers.

Ok…so you tell us then according to you, when is the line crossed?

At what point is a woman deemed to be dressing like a man?
 
I once saw a sign on a Russian Orthodox church reading “No Dogs or Women in Pants”.

Another story - a (male) student I knew was prevented from visiting the Pskovo-Pechorsky Monastery for wearing short pants. He was a goof-ball, I might add, and should have known better.
 
algebra said:
Yes they are tailored to show the form of a womans legs, as opposed to mens trousers.

Ok…so you tell us then according to you, when is the line crossed?

At what point is a woman deemed to be dressing like a man?
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They’re not always tailored that way–it’s a fashion nowadays in the west–“skinny jeans.” Not all pants are like that.

A woman is dressing like a man when she is dressing like a man. What is unclear about that? When she puts on a man’s clothes (deliberately, trying to pass for a man, eg) then she’s dressing like a man.

Do you think Pakistani women are dressing like men? They wear pants.
Do you think that even girls wearing skinny jeans are dressing like men? I don’t think so.
 
What is the punishment for indecent exposure?

In islam it is corporal punishment.

And wearing trousers constitutes indecent exposure.
 
Sister_Amy said:
A woman is dressing like a man when she is dressing like a man. What is unclear about that? When she puts on a man’s clothes (deliberately, trying to pass for a man, eg) then she’s dressing like a man.
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OK.
Do you think Pakistani women are dressing like men? They wear pants.
Do you think that even girls wearing skinny jeans are dressing like men? I don’t think so.
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No, I happen to like pakistani female attire very much, its very visually stimulating with all the many colors.

Yes they wear pants, and I think I said that pants arent the problem, its exposing the shape of your body that is.

I like skinny jeans alot too :D, who doesnt?
 
How do y’all feel about men who dress like women?

If you notice, whenever men want to be serious or important, they don dresses: judges robes, religious vestments, university gowns, etc. These are essentially dresses (women’s clothes), which is to say they are clothes unsuitable for labor. Pants are the opposite, they are the clothes of the world of work and labor. Try climbing a ladder to paint the house, or crawling under the car to fix the transmission, or, heck, doing any kind of welding wearing a skirt (Good luck with that!). Aren’t we really talking about roles here?
 
algebra said:
I like skinny jeans alot too :D, who doesnt?
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I don’t particularly care for the new skinny jeans trend among young people. It seems they be drawn to extremes – either super-skinny or so baggy that they might as well not be wearing anything (since it barely stays on anyway). I hate to sound like an old man before my time, but whenever I see either I just shake my head and feel bad that their parents let them out of the house that way. 😦
 
I once dated a chubby girl. She couldnt bear to see other girls in skinny jeans and revealing clothes.

clothes like that create negative emotions in a lot of people. Its probably a good thing that they are frowned upon.

If the poor thing had lived in the middle east she would not have suffered from the stigma of being chubby (although she really wasnt all that chubby, and was a really really nice person deep down inside.) no one saw past the chubbiness (in the sense that she was not very popular in high school, etc)

I liked her, she was a good human, but also a fundamentalist christian.

Ironic that I didnt convert to be with her. But when I met my really hot pakistani wife, I converted to be with her.

Sometimes islam does get things right.
 
Sister_Amy said:
I wasn’t allowed to wear pants to school when I was a kid. :mad: And our church didn’t let women come in wearing pants, either, when I was growing up.

What’s wrong with these people?
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Did any woman get flogged and publically humiliated for wearing them? I think not.
You see the difference between the school/church you went too and islamic law has 2 different outcomes. I dont know what school/church you went to, but no dress code was at my Catholic church when i was a kid. But i bet a girl didnt get humiliated or punished if they did wear pants to your school, worst thing that would have happened is they would have to go home and get changed. islamic law allows a woman to be flogged, humiliated and much worse for wearing a pair of pants, goes to show which is the more peaceful religion, hey sis amy! :rolleyes:
 
About a year ago I saw a lot of girls wearing skinny jeans with long shirts–that was nice, having long shirts in fashion, since that’s what I like to wear. But now (or maybe here, since I moved to another part of the country) they wear skinny jeans with shorter shirts. Which is kind of gross.

A lot of the schools around where I live in Texas, I’ve noticed, have a uniform policy. I don’t thin it’s a bad idea, for schools, on the condition that girls ARE allowed to wear pants. As I stated earlier–I wasn’t allowed to as a kid and it really irks me the wrong way.

(No reason girls should be playing outside in winter in nothing but a skirt and high socks or tights. That’s not enough to keep them warm.)
 
MartinJordan said:
Hi Men0wjv,the Deuteronomy example you have given is not a Catholic teaching. It never originated from Catholicism. I never heard anyone think otherwise…till now.

MJ
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Go ask in the Traditional Catholicism forum, and you’ll see it. If you are bold, you could make a statement there that women should be allowed to wear pants, and see what happens. Jusr be sure to keep your tender parts covered.
 
Poor women in Islam,
since all this talking about ruling on how women should dress will prohibit women from:
following , enjoying or even competing in certain sports like swimming, snorkling, diving, gymnastic, etc or even certain performing arts like ballet, tango or my country’s very artistic Balinese dance etc etc…well 🤷
 
Bluegoat said:
Go ask in the Traditional Catholicism forum, and you’ll see it. If you are bold, you could make a statement there that women should be allowed to wear pants, and see what happens. Jusr be sure to keep your tender parts covered.
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:confused:

What does this have to do with being flogged? Moses was talking to Catholics?

MJ
 
men0wjv said:
To a novice, of course it would be difficult to find the official teaching.
We can go into the details if you wish, but its complex.
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Publically or privately beating the daylights out of a woman is not “complicated” it is actually quite simple. It is VERY wrong. You take a very long winding road to say so making one wonder what you really mean.
 
Bluegoat said:
Go ask in the Traditional Catholicism forum, and you’ll see it. If you are bold, you could make a statement there that women should be allowed to wear pants, and see what happens. Jusr be sure to keep your tender parts covered.
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Really!? So they agree with the rule, around here, just not the punishment for violating it?

I don’t agree with either–prohibition of pants, or lashes for wearing them.

And they’re fussing at me like it’s my fault the girl got lashed when I wear pants every single day (save once or maybe twice a year) and never had anyone say two words to me about it. This is such a weird place!
 
Sister_Amy said:
I don’t agree with either–prohibition of pants, or lashes for wearing them.
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Again the prohibition is against revealing the shape of the body, which pants do.

If you disagree with that, then you disagree with the prophet.
 
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